Blown lorry tyre hits my car, who's at fault ?

[Try5t]

GC8 said:

Without reading the other posts (and this may be in the post above): youll have to establish that the operator was negligent. If the drivers record book shows that he noted a sidewall cut on his inspection that morning (or better yesterday morning), then you will have them. Also if the vehicle hasnt been inspected properly then your position will be stronger.

Granted that if the above was the true then it would not just be possible negligence but also a possible criminal offence as well.

The grey area arises when the tyre has not been inspected and there is no obligation to inspect outside of recognised service and maintenance schedules. The operator's obligation is one of "reasonableness" in the circumstances - the fact that it exploded and caused damage may not necessarily indicate negligence and therefore a liability.

I defended an exploding tyre case some years ago for an insurer - which we won (to my surprise if I am honest!).

Contrary to what some claimant solicitors will tell you - just because you blame, does not necessarily mean yopu have a claim!! i.e. accidents do happen, which is why we have insurance.

[saaby93]

I can see from a negligence point of view there are getouts but I still say that if my tyre blew up and damaged someone or something else I'd expect my third party insurance to pay out.

Me saying sorry about that but not my problem isnt going to be helpful

[oldsoak]

GC8 said:

I am more than confident that I dont need to, thank you Justin.

But rypt DOES....

[Noger]

saaby93 said:

I can see from a negligence point of view there are getouts but I still say that if my tyre blew up and damaged someone or something else I'd expect my third party insurance to pay out.

Me saying sorry about that but not my problem isnt going to be helpful

Please do report back when that happens

Insurer : Dont worry Mr Saab, you are not liable for the damage
MrSaab: Nooooo, that is all wrong. I am at fault. Here Mr TP, have some money.

[saaby93]

Noger said:

saaby93 said:

I can see from a negligence point of view there are getouts but I still say that if my tyre blew up and damaged someone or something else I'd expect my third party insurance to pay out.

Me saying sorry about that but not my problem isnt going to be helpful

Please do report back when that happens

Insurer : Dont worry Mr Saab, you are not liable for the damage
MrSaab: Nooooo, that is all wrong. I am at fault. Here Mr TP, have some money.

yeah I know

I'm just saying what I expected before this thread began

So if I had said to third party, sorry about damage, I'll get onto my insurance to sort it out, would they cough?

[oldsoak]

saaby93 said:

Noger said:

saaby93 said:

I can see from a negligence point of view there are getouts but I still say that if my tyre blew up and damaged someone or something else I'd expect my third party insurance to pay out.

Me saying sorry about that but not my problem isnt going to be helpful

Please do report back when that happens

Insurer : Dont worry Mr Saab, you are not liable for the damage
MrSaab: Nooooo, that is all wrong. I am at fault. Here Mr TP, have some money.

yeah I know

I'm just saying what I expected before this thread began

So if I had said to third party, sorry about damage, I'll get onto my insurance to sort it out, would they cough?

Yes they'd cough and say...'you are not liable Mr Saaby so we won't be paying out a penny.';)

[DavidHM]

Some insurers have a policy of paying out when a driver is taken ill, even if there is no negligence. I can't go into details - the case I dealt with was very specific indeed - but there was no defence raised by the insurer in circumstances of sudden illness. I don't know if the same would apply where bits unexpectedly fall off a vehicle but I would at least put a claim in against the third party, even if I wouldn't necessarily take it to trial.

[evil len]

Just thought I'd let you know the outcome to this. Looks like I've "won", got a cheque in the post from the insurers for my excess ... no letter, no explaination, just a big cheque LOL ... (looks like I'll have to give them a ring and get the full sp)

Edited by evil len on Saturday 27th February 12:54

[oldsoak]

evil len said:

Just thought I'd let you know the outcome to this. Looks like I've "won", got a check in the post from the insurers for my excess ... no letter, no explaination, just a big check LOL ... (looks like I'll have to give them a ring and get the full sp)

Good result!

In the UK the word is 'CHEQUE'... thought you should know...

Something a little more constructive...
Yesterday I was following behind a HGV with a tri-axle trailer sporting super single tyres when the rear axle nearside tyre 'let go' bits and pieces flew in all directions and a good sized chunk of casing landed in front of me and I was able to swerve and avoid it.
Now had I been doing what far too many people do and been too bloody close to the rear of the trailer..I would probably be wedged under the trailer or at least be in need of a windscreen replacement.
As it was, I had left a good sized gap so was able to avoid the debris and continue my journey undamaged.

[evil len]

oldsoak said:

In the UK the word is 'CHEQUE'... thought you should know...

Good lord, senility is taking over me !!! I'm normally the first to be a grammar nazi (don't get me started on 'their' etc) ! So sorry, must try harder

(edited to add, not only did I do it once, I spelt it wrong twice !!!)

Edited by evil len on Saturday 27th February 12:55

[evil len]

oldsoak said:

As it was, I had left a good sized gap so was able to avoid the debris and continue my journey undamaged.

All well in your circumstances (and I'm glad you're okay) but speaking of my personal case, I was in the middle lane with cars either side of me ... swervage could have resulted in sideswipage

[jagracer]

evil len said:

Just thought I'd let you know the outcome to this. Looks like I've "won", got a cheque in the post from the insurers for my excess ... no letter, no explaination, just a big cheque LOL ... (looks like I'll have to give them a ring and get the full sp)

Edited by evil len on Saturday 27th February 12:54

Make sure it doesn't impact on your renewal costs, insurers either suffer from convenient memory lapses or don't take into account who's fault it was.

[evil len]

jagracer said:

Make sure it doesn't impact on your renewal costs, insurers either suffer from convenient memory lapses or don't take into account who's fault it was.

Aye, hence why I need to give them a ring. Just seems odd for them to send a cheque with no covering letter (unless that's AWOL in the post of course)

[oldsoak]

evil len said:

oldsoak said:

As it was, I had left a good sized gap so was able to avoid the debris and continue my journey undamaged.

All well in your circumstances (and I'm glad you're okay) but speaking of my personal case, I was in the middle lane with cars either side of me ... swervage could have resulted in sideswipage

Point taken.
BTW thanks, I am fine, but my youngest who was sat in the passenger seat went a strange colour as I neatly sidestepped a chunk of flying debris and he saw it sail past his window missing it by mere inches!

[alliray]

I have just been through this myself but from the other side of things, my vehicle had a blow out (super single on the trailer) and damaged a car passing in the adjacent lane.

After a bit of telephone tennis with the car owner I contacted our insurers to clarify the situation. The wagon driver/ operator bares no responsibility for a tyre blowing out and another motorist hitting the debris. It would be down to the other motorist to repair their own vehicle however unfair this may seem.

A tyre blowing out is NOT negligence and is an entirely different situation to a following car being damaged by an insecure load falling from the vehicle. What if the blow out was caused by debris in the carriageway from a previous incident? Personally I would rather take my chances with fragments of rubber than 44 tons of artic swerving to avoid something in the road.

HOWEVER....IF the aggrieved motorist chose to make a claim through the usual channels then the operator could be subject to scrutiny including all vehicle maintenance records etc. If anything was found amiss (services done late or missed, incomplete defect notes etc) then they would be looking at far more trouble than simply having to pay for the damage sustained on the other vehicle, depending on how bad the maintenance records were they could potentially face criminal proceedings, regardless of whether or not the maintenance issues pertained to the tyres on the vehicle.

What I would say is, if this ever happens to you, if the damage is minor say a couple of hundred quid, or you have a sizeable excess I would take it on the chin.

If the vehicle that has the blow out is from a large national haulier, think Stobarts or the supermarkets, take it on the chin as they are not obliged to cough up and it is unlikely that initiating a civil claim would unearth anything untoward in their vehicle maintenance regime.

If the vehicle was from a small independant company and the damage to your car was substantial it MAY be worth pursuing as they would be more likely to not be operating absolutely to the letter of the law, just keep in mind that if you lost you would be further out of pocket.

As with most insurance matters in this country it is yet another mine field and only about as certain as a punt on the horses!!!

[rypt]

I still don't see why it is deemed that a blowout is something that "just" happens, clearly if a tyre suffers a blow out it was not fit for duty ... you don't hear car tyres getting random blowouts...

[Robb F]

Cyberprog said:

if the lorry hadn't been there, there wouldn't have been an accident!

If he wasn't driving behind the lorry, there wouldn't have been an accident[/devil's advocate]

[F i F]

rypt said:

I still don't see why it is deemed that a blowout is something that "just" happens, clearly if a tyre suffers a blow out it was not fit for duty ... you don't hear car tyres getting random blowouts...

I looked a trailer tyre which had suffered disastrous failure one hour after being fitted and driven for the first time. The tyre had passed all the manufacturer quality control checks and looked perfectly sound when fitted. I can say this because it was on my trailer.

In answer to saaby's question about how often HGV/PSV (can't get used to current terminology) and artic trailer wheels fall off. I have investigated a number of lost and loose wheel incidents.

Research has shown that there are about 3000 recorded incidents each year of which typically seven will result in fatalities.

I have yet to see one where a correctly maintained vehicle with wheels and fixings fitted to the code of prractice and the correct manufacturer settings and fixings has come loose. In all cases they have been down to poor and inadequate maintenance, although in one case over maintenance. Here an old timer used to go round his 8 wheel tipper nad crack his nuts every morning, oo err matron. He eventually managed to do a tensile test on his studs.

Many many reasons for wheel loss, however all the various panaceas that you see about from plastic arrows on nuts, through wire clips to locking nuts are just, in the end, no more than security theatre.

[heebeegeetee]

rypt said:

I still don't see why it is deemed that a blowout is something that "just" happens, clearly if a tyre suffers a blow out it was not fit for duty ... you don't hear car tyres getting random blowouts...

You can run over a screw or nail en route and be unaware, a tyre can very often be damaged internally without any external evidence...

When was the last time you scrutinised the surface of your tyres, inc moving the car to examine the 'contact patch'? It still surprises me how many vehicles i see which have stopped due to a puncture on the nations m'ways.

Re the OP, i would have thought the hauliers insurance would pay, but have no experience of this.

[rypt]

heebeegeetee said:

rypt said:

I still don't see why it is deemed that a blowout is something that "just" happens, clearly if a tyre suffers a blow out it was not fit for duty ... you don't hear car tyres getting random blowouts...

You can run over a screw or nail en route and be unaware, a tyre can very often be damaged internally without any external evidence...

When was the last time you scrutinised the surface of your tyres, inc moving the car to examine the 'contact patch'? It still surprises me how many vehicles i see which have stopped due to a puncture on the nations m'ways.

I do check my tyres whenever the car is up on the jacks, which is generally every couple of weeks for this or what.
That still does not answer my question as to why cars do not suffer disastrous blowouts at the same frequency as you see abandoned truck tyre carcasses around.