Is there a discrepancy time allowance-council issued PCN?

[kellya4]

My girlfriend received a council issued PCN for parking in an electric vehicle zone during a restricted period. There is no issue here. The ticket was issued at 16:03 and the zone became active at 16:00 (she had a valid ticket until 16:30 but did not realise this was an electric vehicle only zone).

I have appealed on the grounds that 16:03 is very close to 16:00 on the grounds that one persons 16:03 is another persons 15:58. They rejected this.

Should I appeal again? Is there any council parking legislation anyone knows about that may make it worth appealing again?

Or will I just pay?

Comments appreciated, thanks in advance!!

[TheAlfaMale]

I thought council traffic wardens were supposed to allow 5 minutes before ticketing? Or is that a local decision?

[kellya4]

TheAlfaMale said:

I thought council traffic wardens were supposed to allow 5 minutes before ticketing? Or is that a local decision?

Exactly what I want to find out before I donate £35 to the local council!!

[marshalla]

If you're feeling vexacious, ask them what sort of calibration and regulation is used to ensure the accuracy of the timekeeping device used by the parking enforcement officer.

[streaky]

Does signage make clear that tickets can be issued for periods longer than permitted parking?

Streaky

[kellya4]

@marshalla: I did, their response:

"The Civil Enforcement Officer’s hand-held computer automatically prints the time on the Penalty Charge Notice. Civil Enforcement Officers are unable to interfere with this.

The time on all our hand-held computers is set by a central computer. The time settings are checked every day and were correct on the day your ticket was given.

Other tickets given that day show the correct time. If there had been a fault, we would have received many other complaints but we have not."

Still though, this information should be available to users to set their time-pieces!!

@streaky: No, here is all the information available;

[SonicShadow]

I dont know what the law says about that, but looking at that sign as a regular chap, I would not think 'Oh, I cant park to the right unless I have an electric car' as the sign does not forbid non-electric vehicles parking there.

[kellya4]

SonicShadow said:

I dont know what the law says about that, but looking at that sign as a regular chap, I would not think 'Oh, I cant park to the right unless I have an electric car' as the sign does not forbid non-electric vehicles parking there.

It does after 4.00 hence the ticket issued at 4:03!!

[Vipers]

kellya4 said:

@marshalla: I did, their response:

"The Civil Enforcement Officer’s hand-held computer automatically prints the time on the Penalty Charge Notice. Civil Enforcement Officers are unable to interfere with this.

The time on all our hand-held computers is set by a central computer. The time settings are checked every day and were correct on the day your ticket was given.

Other tickets given that day show the correct time. If there had been a fault, we would have received many other complaints but we have not."

Still though, this information should be available to users to set their time-pieces!!

@streaky: No, here is all the information available;

Took some working with your comment on the electric zone became active at 1600

So does the sign mean you can park between 1000 and 1600, but only electric cara from 0700 to 1800. And presumably electric cars dont have to pay to park to charge, looking at the signs?

Edited by Vipers on Wednesday 1st August 15:25

[kellya4]

Vipers said:

Took some working with your comment on the electric zone became active at 1600

So does the sign mean you can park between 1000 and 1600, but only electric cara from 0700 to 1800, and do they have to be plugged to complymwithmtime after 1600?

Tried to minimise confusion, the photo of the sign does help explain the situation.

That's it exactly, whether they have to be plugged in or not I don't know, I suppose yes as a non-pistonhead would find it difficult to tell apart without the long lead. And I suppose, anyone with an electric vehicle will plug in at every opportunity to evade being stuck, much like me and my ridiculous iPhone!!

[zasker]

Surely that sign says if you park between 10 and 4 you have to pay. It doesn't say anything about not parking there after 4?

[Cyberprog]

The machine shouldn't be configured to allow you to park until 4.30 - I'd argue you had a valid ticket at the time...

[MrPicky]

What is an electric car anyway?

You can propel your vehicle by taking out the spark plugs, engaging gear and moving on the starter motor. This makes it an electric car.

Unless there is an official definition in law that overrides this definition.

[Vipers]

Cyberprog said:

The machine shouldn't be configured to allow you to park until 4.30 - I'd argue you had a valid ticket at the time...

Dont think any of them do that. Generally speaking with 30 min left, you have to pay for the minimum period, so say you pay for 3 houre, they will expire the following day 2 and a half hours after the parking restrictions come in to effect.

The con job is in the electric parking situation, if you park at 1545, and parking for non electric ends at 1600, and say the minumum ticket is £2 for 2 hours, you are being skimmed for paying £2 for 15 mins parking.

[joebongo]

I got one overturned by taking photos of the machines which all varied by a bit and so showed there was doubt about what the correct time was.

Leeway is discretionary I read, some places do and some don't.

[streaky]

zasker said:

Surely that sign says if you park between 10 and 4 you have to pay. It doesn't say anything about not parking there after 4?

Agreed. The additional stipulation refers to parking in connection [see what I did there?] with the recharging of electric vehicles, and I would argue that it imposes no restriction on the parking of other vehicles or electric vehicles for a purpose other than recharging.

Streaky