Red light camera issue

[yeti]

Coming to the end of the M32 into Bristol, limit switches to 30mph then there are lights. I'd just helped a mate move house and was driving a hired van full of furniture - it took a lot to stop and I didn't want to slam on the anchors with all his gear in the car when the light started turning. As it was, I rolled about a metre over the line and the camera went off.

About 5 seconds later it went off again, is this some kind of checkshot to see if you kept going or if you did actually stop?

Yes I went through the red light but ony by a metre - have I committed an offence? If so, is it worth arguing? No NIP yet, but then it was through a hire company.

Any advice appreciated, license clean at the moment...

[Dwight VanDriver]

What the law (Traffic Signs and General Directions 2002) lays down on light sequence:

The red signal shall convey the prohibition that vehicular traffic shall not proceed BEYOND THE STOP LINE.

The amber signal shall, when shown alone, convey the same prohibition as the red signal, except that, as respects any vehicle which is so close to the stop line that it cannot safely be stopped without proceeding beyond the stop line, it shall convey the same indication as the green signal shown immediately before it.

Two shots generally taken. The first to show a violation of passing the stop line, the second to confirm the vehicle in the middle of the junction.

You may be lucky if that second shot does not show you and stationary just over the line.

For your it is a long sweat whilse papers go to Hire Company as Reg keeper, then back to Authority, then more papers to you. If you are on good terms with the Hire Company check with them after 15 days from the incident to see if they have received a NOIP/S172 nameing form about the incident. If they haven't then it could be that you are not being prosecuted.

If they have then firstly a Conditional Offer will be made. Consider if you can put up a good case (with witness)to plead the amber signal get out above if so then consider refusing the CO and elect Court hearing on a Not Guilty plea.

dvd

[yeti]

Thanks DVD,

I had two others in the van with me, both professional people in good standing (blah blah) and really don't want it on my license. If I go to court, the points can't be increased can they??

I'm surprised that I actually comitted an offence, it'd be very petty if they prosecuted. No doubt they will in that case.

Bah

[Dwight VanDriver]

Conditional Offer - 3 points

Court max 3 points.

dvd

[Dr T]

DVD, would I be correct in saying that if your rear wheels are on the correct side of the line at the second photograph, then you're not likely to get prosecuted?

[puggit]

Dr T said:

DVD, would I be correct in saying that if your rear wheels are on the correct side of the line at the second photograph, then you're not likely to get prosecuted?

Not if it's a partnership. They aren't interested in fairness, or safety, just cash.

Hence the driver who was prosecuted for crossing a line when moving out of the way of an emergency vehicle (see long thread somewhere else).

[Fat Audi 80]

puggit said:

Dr T said: DVD, would I be correct in saying that if your rear wheels are on the correct side of the line at the second photograph, then you're not likely to get prosecuted? Not if it's a partnership. They aren't interested in fairness, or safety, just cash. Hence the driver who was prosecuted for crossing a line when moving out of the way of an emergency vehicle (see long thread somewhere else).

Let's not go there again, but that was fecking ridiculous....

[yeti]

Rear wheels were definitely not over the line - it's pretty obvious I hadn't shot the lights, just didn't want to slam on the anchors as I was trying to be nice to my mate's furniture!

I hear what you're saying, technically I am at fault, it'll come down to how money hungry Bristol CC / Scamera muppets are.

I won't accept a conditional offer, it'll be court for sure. Good luck with them scheduling it when I'm home, inland revenue rules say I can only spend 90 days a year in this country. Every other country in the civilised world is 180 days, I just take my money elsewhere!

[A57 HSV]

Almost the same thing happened to a colleague at the same same of lights, only he had 3 passengers in his Merc. & didn't want to slam on the brakes.
He was flashed at but no NIP.
However, this was c.2.5 yrs ago & I can't remember if they have changed this camera from film to digital!
Let's hope not.

[justinp1]

I do hope that it does not get as far as court. I would have hoped someone has their thinking cap on when the film is looked at. Failing that I would have thought that the CPS would not have thought it in the public interent to pursue.

I fear that if it went to court, the offence is an 'absolute' offence, ie technically you are guilty whatever the reason.

I am sure DvD or someone more legally versed than me could lend the exact term. All I am thinking is that if it gets that far, I cannot see how the court could find not guilty, based on the exact implications of the traffic light rules. Thus, a 3 point and £60 may be better financially than your day in court (although I enjoyed mine!).

[Vipers]

Tis a great pity they dont "Flash" pedestrians who insist in crossing when their light is RED.

One particularily bad spot in Aberdeen, is coming up to a tee junction to turn left onto Union Street, you can absolutely bloody guarantee as you turn left, coz your light is GREEN, some plonker is crossing the road against the RED light, and if you hit them, guess who's to blame............

[kenp]

If both pictures show him stationary (straddling the stop line), how does that prove that he jumped a red light? If engine had stalled during a green phase, you would have the same pics?

[7db]

That's a great point.

IIRC it's the front wheels that count, not the back ones.