Traffic Police Training

[treehack]

On my way home from getting my car fixed tonight saw the most appling piece of driving.Stuck behind a mini bus doing 50 in a 60 but i was in no hurry.Looked in my mirror to see a silver BMW,on closer look i caould clearly make out both front seat occupants were police so thought i'd better behave myself.after a few miles it starts to look for the overtake,but he's to close to me so has to go really wide to get a good view.This carries on for a mile or so and he misses at least two clean overtakes.
So as we are approaching a kink in the road the last thing i expect is to find the BMW coming past me,he wasn't going fast enough to do me and the mini bus before the kink.As it came past i saw it was 4 up all in police uniform.So i eased off to open up the gap between me and the mini bus to let him in saftly,but he decided to go for it!!
Well if i was in that car i would have shat myself bigtime.An old micra came round the kink as he went for it!If the Micra hadn't almost come to a stop,the mini bus and i braked hard then it would have resulted in a nasty head on collision.He had the room to get between me and the mini bus.What a tt.
Would he have got a bollocking?Personally i would have asked to get out of the car.
How can they get away with this on public roads?

Edited by treehack on Monday 4th December 21:41

[hollowpockets]

by sounds of things he'll need plenty training thats for sure

[deva link]

I don't know what the current Instructor thinking is, but based on my previous company's use of retired Police driving instructors for "Defensive Driving" training, I would say they're definitely of the 'go for it' rather than the 'hang back' mindset.

[justinp1]

I think if the shoe was on the other foot and it was you doing the overtaking and four police witness is the car doing the watching, you may be up before the beak for a Dangerous Driving charge!

[Egbert Nobacon]

The Chinese takeaway was probably about to close, hence the requirement for full chase procedure.

Was the Police helicopter hovering above giving them the clearest route !

[cptsideways]

Was the kink to left by any chance? if so being on the wrong side of the road may have actually aided full visisblity of the "blind" road ahead. Classic bit of roadcraft possibly though the dodgy oncoming car was definately NOT

Also the sitting on your offside & not overtaking is for the same reason, giving a full view of the road ahead of you & said minibus.

Edited by cptsideways on Tuesday 5th December 22:18

[treehack]

[quote=cptsideways]Was the kink to left by any chance? if so being on the wrong side of the road may have actually aided full visisblity of the "blind" road ahead. Classic bit of roadcraft possibly though the dodgy oncoming car was definately NOT

Also the sitting on your offside & not overtaking is for the same reason, giving a full view of the road ahead of you & said minibus.

Edited by cptsideways on Tuesday 5th December 22:18

[/quote

No it was a left hand kink with no sight line due to hedge!
As for the sitting on offside,he was way to close so had to go right over to see.If he'd hung back could of sat just to the left of the line giving a clear sight line for gap's.I see people getting to close to the back's of lorry's then jigging over to look for a gap right in front of on coming traffic.
If the car had caused an accident what would have happened?Who would be more to blame the driver or instructor?

[xxplod]

Four up that sounds like it would have been a driver training vehicle. Maybe the driver has received some advice!

[peaktorque]

Wasn't this one was it?

[Zod]

cptsideways said:

Was the kink to left by any chance? if so being on the wrong side of the road may have actually aided full visisblity of the "blind" road ahead. Classic bit of roadcraft possibly though the dodgy oncoming car was definately NOT

Also the sitting on your offside & not overtaking is for the same reason, giving a full view of the road ahead of you & said minibus.

Edited by cptsideways on Tuesday 5th December 22:18

I agree with the second paragraph, but moving to the other side of the road to see around a left hand bend is only roadcraft if you have enough space in which to pull over if something comes the other way. Doing it at full tilt with cars you are overtaking blocking your return is lunacy.

[slowly slowly]

How many people were on bored the mini bus, was there only one person in the Micra, If so theres four of them and only 3 of you, your stuffed, the copper driving the BMW would just wave the Roadcraft book at you and say "don't fcukin blame me mate, I was driving according to the Roadcraft book so it must be safe and if you don't like it, go and see my mate, oh er what's his name.

[vonhosen]

guam said:

Now this is exactly what makes many of us concerned about abuse of powers as evidenced on other threads. Given the driving was patently dangerous did his three colleagues nick him for dangerous driving? If not why not?


VH, Dibble Annie etc, would you have nicked the driver of that car on that DAY if not why not?

Not trying to be difficult here but as defenders of the public (no sarcasm inteneded) surely on that day the Public needed defending against that driver BIB or not.


Would be interested to hear a response!


cheers

You say patently dangerous & that's how the OP may have viewed it, but it doesn't necessarily follow that they did. How many times do we see different people view the exact same event, but have very different view points of it ?

If I was in a car & someone was shaping to do what I considered a dangerous overtake, I would personally intervene prior to them embarking on it. They'd have been briefed prior to us going in the car what form that intervention would take & what was expected of them should it take place. They'd also be very aware of the consequences of them ignoring it.

Edited by vonhosen on Thursday 7th December 18:37

[safespeed]

A bit of topic drift, I'm afraid...

vonhosen said:

If I was in a car & someone was shaping to do what I considered a dangerous overtake, I would personally intervene prior to them embarking on it.

Von, do you find that your judgement in such situations is the same irrespective of being a driver or a passenger?

I don't, and I don't know why.

By coincidence I posted a question about this exact subject on the Safe Speed forums a few hours ago. See: www.safespeed.org.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?t=11261

Edited by safespeed on Friday 8th December 06:03

[vonhosen]

safespeed said:

A bit of topic drift, I'm afraid...

vonhosen said:

If I was in a car & someone was shaping to do what I considered a dangerous overtake, I would personally intervene prior to them embarking on it.

Von, do you find that your judgement in such situations is the same irrespective of being a driver or a passenger?

I don't, and I don't know why.

By coincidence I posted a question about this exact subject on the Safe Speed forums a few hours ago. See: www.safespeed.org.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?t=11261

Edited by safespeed on Friday 8th December 06:03

Not exactly the same, but not markedly different either.
I don't consider that the margins I'm working with are exceptionally tight.
When I'm looking at overtakes, I'm looking for reasons that we shouldn't be going rather than than I must try & go. If we get to the stage where the decision hasn't been made & if it isn't made soon it's going to be made for us. Then it's going to be a no go.

I think the difference you describe is created by the feeling of control.
It's like the difference in perception of speed on a motorbike between being a passenger or doing the riding. Perhaps you don't like the subconscious lack of control you feel compared to when you are doing the driving. This is where really good effective commentary by the person driving can allay your doubts.

You are placing a lot of trust in the person driving & it's a position of trust you move to gradually. To be honest with most you see it all so much earlier than them & it's so obvious, that you have lots of time. It's harder with the exceptional ones because there is less time.
It's all relative though because what I consider a lot of time others may not, or of course vice versa.

Edited by vonhosen on Friday 8th December 06:51

[safespeed]

vonhosen said:

Not exactly the same, but not markedly different either.

[...]

Interesting. Thanks. We're continuing to examine it over at Safe Speed.