BMW X5 Police Car
Discussion
This question may well have been asked before but why do supposedly cash strapped Police Forces (in the case Essex Constabulary) have such expensive cars???
Many of the cars I see around the area where I live are BMW 330d/530d or Volvo Estates (£35 -40k cars).
I used to work in a vehicle leasing company and know for a fact that they cost a fortune compared with, say, a Skoda Octavia VRs which would do a comparable job. What's more they the various forces don't even pool thier buying power as far as I know.
The final straw was seeing a 62 plate X5 today - a £45k 4WD that won't even go off road!!
WHY???
Many of the cars I see around the area where I live are BMW 330d/530d or Volvo Estates (£35 -40k cars).
I used to work in a vehicle leasing company and know for a fact that they cost a fortune compared with, say, a Skoda Octavia VRs which would do a comparable job. What's more they the various forces don't even pool thier buying power as far as I know.
The final straw was seeing a 62 plate X5 today - a £45k 4WD that won't even go off road!!
WHY???
OK, so the PH search engine ain't that great hence the tired topic but...
The discounted list of a BMW is still way above the list of a Skoda which could depreciate to £0 and still be cheaper to run that any 3 litre BMW.
It seems to me that, as with many public sector institutions, they don't know thier a*se from thier elbow when it comes to keeping costs down.
Mention reducing a forces budget and the immediate response is the usual hysterics of "less police on the front line" BS rather than really looking at where to save money. The car thing is a sympton of said incompetance.
The discounted list of a BMW is still way above the list of a Skoda which could depreciate to £0 and still be cheaper to run that any 3 litre BMW.
It seems to me that, as with many public sector institutions, they don't know thier a*se from thier elbow when it comes to keeping costs down.
Mention reducing a forces budget and the immediate response is the usual hysterics of "less police on the front line" BS rather than really looking at where to save money. The car thing is a sympton of said incompetance.
Dibble said:
Yes it has. And answered, ad infinitum. But in summary:
All Police cars have to be "type approved".
Police do not pay list for vehicles, they are heavily discounted from the manufacturer.
"Better" cars have higher residuals when they are sold at the end of their service.
It's not just the cost of the car, it's the cost of servicing etc over the life of the vehicle.
Certain vehicles are required to carry certain loads, which require the ability to do so.
Reliability is taken into account, so brand X may cost £more than brand Y, but if half the fleet of brand Y is off the road, you'll need twice as many vehicles. So for example 3 BMW X5 at £20k each works out cheaper than 6 Vauxhall Fronteras at £12k each.
Sorry, but whilst each of the above may be true (excepting the last - a £20K X5 & a Vauxhall Frontera????) it don't justify buying BMW's / Disco's etc over Skoda's / Hyundai's etc when the latter are a) more reliable; b) available with similar discounts but from far lower list prices; c) cheaper to service.All Police cars have to be "type approved".
Police do not pay list for vehicles, they are heavily discounted from the manufacturer.
"Better" cars have higher residuals when they are sold at the end of their service.
It's not just the cost of the car, it's the cost of servicing etc over the life of the vehicle.
Certain vehicles are required to carry certain loads, which require the ability to do so.
Reliability is taken into account, so brand X may cost £more than brand Y, but if half the fleet of brand Y is off the road, you'll need twice as many vehicles. So for example 3 BMW X5 at £20k each works out cheaper than 6 Vauxhall Fronteras at £12k each.
Also, as I recall from direct experience many forces lease vehicles ands don't pay that much different from the likes of BT / local councils / NHS. Can't remember the last visiting nurse I saw in a BMW..
ben5732 said:
Volvo and BMW also offer a much longer warranty to police forces than other marks. Also in the case of traffic... If my car gets stolen I'd rather they be able to catch the idiot than wave as it flies past. The older V70s could take a fair amount of abuse and could carry a decent load. I don't think they could catch someone with a fully loaded police vehicle if they were driving a 520D.
Skoda VRs is type approved, has similar performance (have owned / driven both) and is 50% the price of the BMW. It'd be a similar story with a Mondeo (given the number of Focus cars used I would guess Ford offer cars on good terms).The maths do not add up whichever way you look at it.
TPS said:
pointedstarman said:
it don't justify buying BMW's / Disco's etc over Skoda's / Hyundai's etc when the latter are a) more reliable; b) available with similar discounts but from far lower list prices; c) cheaper to service.
Get a disco and get a skoda.Hook it up to a hgv and let me know which one pulls the hgv out of lane one and to safety.But I'm guessing from what's been said that a fair number of the posters on here are from Her Majesty's Constabulary and if you'd rather have a flash car than more police (or, indeed, risk your job so the rest of your coleagues can drive BMW's) then fine.
TPS said:
pointedstarman said:
TPS said:
pointedstarman said:
it don't justify buying BMW's / Disco's etc over Skoda's / Hyundai's etc when the latter are a) more reliable; b) available with similar discounts but from far lower list prices; c) cheaper to service.
Get a disco and get a skoda.Hook it up to a hgv and let me know which one pulls the hgv out of lane one and to safety.But I'm guessing from what's been said that a fair number of the posters on here are from Her Majesty's Constabulary and if you'd rather have a flash car than more police (or, indeed, risk your job so the rest of your coleagues can drive BMW's) then fine.
Reread your own post above...........hint,It don't justify buying BMW's over a skoda.
You just will not admit your.argument is wrong.
Strange how you want to moan about a BMW X5 but keep silent about the running costs of a eurocopter police helicopter.
WRT helicopters. Somewhat different subject. Having worked in the Aerospace industry I can understand the need for using the Eurocopter and wouldn't argue with it.
TPS said:
pointedstarman said:
TPS said:
pointedstarman said:
TPS said:
pointedstarman said:
it don't justify buying BMW's / Disco's etc over Skoda's / Hyundai's etc when the latter are a) more reliable; b) available with similar discounts but from far lower list prices; c) cheaper to service.
Get a disco and get a skoda.Hook it up to a hgv and let me know which one pulls the hgv out of lane one and to safety.But I'm guessing from what's been said that a fair number of the posters on here are from Her Majesty's Constabulary and if you'd rather have a flash car than more police (or, indeed, risk your job so the rest of your coleagues can drive BMW's) then fine.
Reread your own post above...........hint,It don't justify buying BMW's over a skoda.
RYou just will not admit your.argument is wrong.
Strange how you want to moan about a BMW X5 but keep silent about the running costs of a eurocopter police helicopter.
WRT helicopters. Somewhat different subject. Having worked in the Aerospace industry I can understand the need for using the Eurocopter and wouldn't argue with it.
You clearly said it does not justify buying a bmw/disco over a skoda.
Your whole beef from your first post is the louder should not be driving around in BMW X5's.
Would you know like to admit you may have got it wrong.
LongLiveTazio said:
Crossflow Kid said:
Is that really part of the type approval test?
X5s are used as motorway cars so yes safety is a consideration. The vRS is quick but it is more fatiguing at high speed, the seats are worse, the driving position less advantageous, it can't tow large vehicles, it's not as good in winter, etc. I've regularly managed to drive the lenght of the country and back in a day in cars a lot less comfortable than a Disco or a 530. Difference is that, as a company car, my employer cosiders the cost of the fleet and I have to consider the BiK costs.
I figure a viable replacement for the X5/Disco would be the Transit or similar. It does a fine job for the AA/RAC/ numerous delivery firms and thier drivers cope ok with many hours driving / towing and so on.
Elroy Blue said:
Transit for m/way patrol????
You are REALLY, REALLY, REALLY embarrassing yourself now.
No, actually I'm not.You are REALLY, REALLY, REALLY embarrassing yourself now.
The higher power vans carry plenty, have similar performance (when loaded) and have lower through life costs.
Believe me, if the Disco / X5 were cheaper to run over 150 - 200k miles then every breakdown company would use them.
I figure it's an image thing for the force rather than a practical issue.
vonhosen said:
pointedstarman said:
Elroy Blue said:
Transit for m/way patrol????
You are REALLY, REALLY, REALLY embarrassing yourself now.
No, actually I'm not.You are REALLY, REALLY, REALLY embarrassing yourself now.
The higher power vans carry plenty, have similar performance (when loaded) and have lower through life costs.
Believe me, if the Disco / X5 were cheaper to run over 150 - 200k miles then every breakdown company would use them.
I figure it's an image thing for the force rather than a practical issue.
Similar performance (X5 & transit) ????????
WRT performance, yes an X5 is higher performance but a Disco is actually slower. Tell me what specific task an X5 is needed for to justify its purchase.
vonhosen said:
pointedstarman said:
vonhosen said:
pointedstarman said:
Elroy Blue said:
Transit for m/way patrol????
You are REALLY, REALLY, REALLY embarrassing yourself now.
No, actually I'm not.You are REALLY, REALLY, REALLY embarrassing yourself now.
The higher power vans carry plenty, have similar performance (when loaded) and have lower through life costs.
Believe me, if the Disco / X5 were cheaper to run over 150 - 200k miles then every breakdown company would use them.
I figure it's an image thing for the force rather than a practical issue.
Similar performance (X5 & transit) ????????
WRT performance, yes an X5 is higher performance but a Disco is actually slower. Tell me what specific task an X5 is needed for to justify its purchase.
It's not a specific task that leads to the X5 being picked over a Transit, it's the breadth of tasks (& other considerations) that lead to it. The vehicle has to be able to perform in many key areas & the Transit would be so poor in some it would immediately be discounted as unsuitable. (ie one already highlighted - TPAC).
So the X5 is an ideal vehicle for TPAC, I guessing due to performance. So why so many slug like Disco's? If a TPAC is required do you have to retire the Disco's from the scene then because of thier performance?
Look, I don't deny that an X5 is a great car but as one of the people paying for it I'd rather a proper cost / benefit analysis be done on what's the best solution rather than keep bunging money at it because, surprise, surprise, the people who use the cars want the best (read most expensive) cars they can get thier mits on.
Elroy Blue said:
pointedstarman said:
Look, I don't deny that an X5 is a great car but as one of the people paying for it I'd rather a proper cost / benefit analysis be done on what's the best solution rather than keep bunging money at it because, surprise, surprise, the people who use the cars want the best (read most expensive) cars they can get thier mits on.
What, you mean like what is done before ANY car is bought.Here is some advice. To save your internet useage, just stick your fingers in your ears and go 'la,la,la'.
As for your assertion that a CBA is done, there's a pertinent saying - quality not quantity.....
egor110 said:
You seem to think your the only person who pays tax and that the police who drive the cars swan into a office and demand a new bmw.
Office bods with lovely spreadsheets decide what replaces outgoing the outgoing model.
I'm glad nobody's attacking me for my flash red vauxhall combi van paid for by your taxes
So you work for the postal service then??? Office bods with lovely spreadsheets decide what replaces outgoing the outgoing model.
I'm glad nobody's attacking me for my flash red vauxhall combi van paid for by your taxes
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