Speeding.....ALWAYS get the photos!

[blueyes]

Niece was driving the company hack and got a ticket for 44 in a 30. Trouble was we couldn't find the road they were referring to, so asked for more details. Snotty letter came back stating where the road was and that the driver could clearly be identified in the 4 photos they'd enclosed.

Trouble was the only photo clearly showing the car number plate AND with a speed on it had TIMEOUT across the bottom of it. Obviously I requested that they forward a photo that showed the speed without a TIMEOUT across the bottom of it.

Letter arrived this morning stating "no further action would be taken"

RESULT!

It seems that they were shooting across a line of traffic towards the oncoming traffic and hadn't been able to get a clear view/speed but had sent the ticket anyway. To55ers!

Moral of this story.... always get a look at the photos!


Oh, and to the Welsh Scamera Unit..

[gh0st]

Welsh scamera unit... hmmm now where is that w*nker smiley when you need it most

[alans]

sorry, what is timeout?

Alan
apart from a very nice choccy bar

[DustyC]

result blueeyes,

[blueyes]

alans said:

sorry, what is timeout?

It's what happens when the laser gun can't get a lock on a speeding car after a certain time. I'm sure one of the BIB could explain fully.

In our case the flow of traffic nearest the van interupted the laser so it couldn't register a speed or registered a speed of a vehicle going the opposite way. Just by chance they sent the photos which proved this otherwise my niece would be banned under the "new driver" totting up thingy. BTW she was adamant that she wasn't speeding... and even I didn't believe her!

[cptsideways]

alans said:

sorry, what is timeout?

There is a time limit on the speed recorded on the laser unit, the laser is connected to video recorder & the speed recorded is marked on the screen. A few seconds after each lock on is recorded it says timout.

Without a timeout you could drive through a laser speed trap with a video recorder running & they just aim the camera at you & but only register the speed of a previous vehicle.

The Scamera Safety Partnerships allegedly have systems in place to ensure each video recording is checked & checked again to make sure such HUGE injustices never occur like the one above - my ass they do.

Rule No1: Ask to see the evidence or lack of it regardless of what they say.

[Purple AK]

gh0st said:

Welsh scamera unit... hmmm now where is that w*nker smiley when you need it most

You called [url]www.talkaudio.co.uk/vbb/images/smilies/whatever.gif[/url]

>> Edited by Purple AK on Monday 21st June 21:20

[feet]

Its funny how NO-ONE will be with the police on this on eh? Tells you something doesn't it.

[Streetcop]

I'm with the police on this one....

I don't have all the information, but it appears that the motorist was actually doing 44mph in a 30mph zone. It just that, as other motorists were coming the other way, the machine kicks out a TIMEOUT warning. Result: she gets off on a technicality..but she was speeding....

Technicality...like when Winston Silcott SMITH got off on a technicality for murdering PC Keith Blakelock.

It's all bollocks.......until your loved ones are killed by someone else...you'll be praying there wont be any technicalities holding up justice then..

[Einion Yrth]

Streetcop said:

I'm with the police on this one.... I don't have all the information, but it appears that the motorist was actually doing 44mph in a 30mph zone.

In fact the only information you have would seem to suggest that there is no valid evidence to support the accusation of 44 in a 30, better than reasonable doubt, and no case to answer. Further over emotional and irrelevant ramblings notwithstanding.

[pmanson]

Yes but they were using the laser across traffic which I thought they weren't able to do. They then didn't get a proper reading but sent the ticket anyway.

Thats not good in my book.

[apache]

Streetcop said:

I'm with the police on this one.... I don't have all the information, but it appears that the motorist was actually doing 44mph in a 30mph zone. It just that, as other motorists were coming the other way, the machine kicks out a TIMEOUT warning. Result: she gets off on a technicality..but she was speeding.... Technicality...like when Winston Silcott SMITH got off on a technicality for murdering PC Keith Blakelock. It's all bollocks.......until your loved ones are killed by someone else...you'll be praying there wont be any technicalities holding up justice then..

So, you'll be a supporter of the 'guilty till proven innocent' brigade then.
Don't forget we have laws to protect the innocent which are there to avoid emotive reactions like yours.

[Streetcop]

apache said:

Don't forget we have laws to protect the innocent which are there to avoid emotive reactions like yours.

There are equally as many laws that protect the guilty too.....Ask any victim of crime..

[apache]

I know mate, My family are 'victims' It sucks but it's all we got.
I'd be a lot happy if the motorist ceased to be a target for easy stats and revenue, too many crimes are going unpunished due to crap policing/systems and policy

[Streetcop]

It's not policing policies...

Christ...most of the coppers I know would like to give a good shoeing to every burglar, mugger and thief..(like in the good old days)...it's what 99% of the public want to..

The times I hear.."they need flogging"..."Birch 'em"...."there's no detterent etc etc"..

It's not the police its the courts and the criminal justice system after the police.

The police catch burglars, thiefs, rapists, fraudsters, speeders etc etc..

The courts then hammer the speeders with points, fines and disqualifications. The thiefs, burglars etc..do get 'done' and do go to prison. However, the legal system in this country is so complex and so weighted behind the burden of proof, that it's getting almost impossible to proof certain criminal acts, without cctv or forensic evidence.

The police catch the crims and they go to jail. What happens then..they get released early for good behaviour etc etc..

It's really not the police to blame its the courts, the probabtion service and other woolly jumper brigades.

[gh0st]

Purple AK said:

gh0st said: Welsh scamera unit... hmmm now where is that w*nker smiley when you need it most You called [url]www.talkaudio.co.uk/vbb/images/smilies/whatever.gif[/url] >> Edited by Purple AK on Monday 21st June 21:20

Thanks Purple AK

Now where was I...

Thats right! Welsh scamera unit

Ahhhhh thats better

[jesusbuiltmycar]

streetcop said:

There are equally as many laws that protect the guilty too.....Ask any victim of crime..

Couldn't aggree more, especially in the case of crimes where there are always victims (most of the time speeding is a victimless crime) - however when it comes to speeding it is a case of guilty until arse-raped by the judge.

Funny how skrotes who get caught speeding, in stolen vehicles/driving whilst banned/no insurance/no tax/under the influence etc... get treated a lot more leniently than the motorist who's car is 100% legal, and whos only crime is to stray slightly over the speed limit.

I beleive that if I was to get caught speeding on an empty dual carriageway at say 100mph I would get a stiffer sentence than if a skrote stole my car and commited the same offence - but hey that is justice - Blair style. I should feel guilty for being able to afford a nice car in the first place......

[apache]

Streetcop said:

It's not policing policies... Christ...most of the coppers I know would like to give a good shoeing to every burglar, mugger and thief..(like in the good old days)...it's what 99% of the public want to.. The times I hear.."they need flogging"..."Birch 'em"...."there's no detterent etc etc".. It's not the police its the courts and the criminal justice system after the police. The police catch burglars, thiefs, rapists, fraudsters, speeders etc etc.. The courts then hammer the speeders with points, fines and disqualifications. The thiefs, burglars etc..do get 'done' and do go to prison. However, the legal system in this country is so complex and so weighted behind the burden of proof, that it's getting almost impossible to proof certain criminal acts, without cctv or forensic evidence. The police catch the crims and they go to jail. What happens then..they get released early for good behaviour etc etc.. It's really not the police to blame its the courts, the probabtion service and other woolly jumper brigades.

It's both from my experience unfortunately

[apache]

Streetcop, you're pretty new here and I fear you may be painting yourself into a corner. There are a lot of good coppers who post on PH (and I'm sure you're one of them) some have left as they became the focal point of motorists discontent and come back under a different nickname. Don't take the flak personally, we know the system is bolloxed, we know there is one rule for scrotes and one for us, we also know there are good cops and bad cops and I know there are some bloody awful CCs (S Cambridge for one)

[blademan]

Streetcop said:

It's not policing policies... Christ...most of the coppers I know would like to give a good shoeing to every burglar, mugger and thief..(like in the good old days)...it's what 99% of the public want to.. The times I hear.."they need flogging"..."Birch 'em"...."there's no detterent etc etc".. It's not the police its the courts and the criminal justice system after the police. The police catch burglars, thiefs, rapists, fraudsters, speeders etc etc.. The courts then hammer the speeders with points, fines and disqualifications. The thiefs, burglars etc..do get 'done' and do go to prison. However, the legal system in this country is so complex and so weighted behind the burden of proof, that it's getting almost impossible to proof certain criminal acts, without cctv or forensic evidence. The police catch the crims and they go to jail. What happens then..they get released early for good behaviour etc etc.. It's really not the police to blame its the courts, the probabtion service and other woolly jumper brigades.

Streetcop.
I don't post that regularly, because I like to read and digest all that is being said and form ( hopefully ) a balanced opinion.
When you first posted, you seemed a well balanced copper, but I'm afraid you are getting baited and your recent posts clearly show you are getting emotional and your blood pressure is rising.
The fact is, this country has become so P-Correct and ticking the right boxes is all that seems to matter now. From your endless f*****g paperwork which you have to do to satisfy the muppets in government, to school targets.........everyone has got to cross their I's and dot the T's. It never used to be like that, but as always, when things go wrong, there are knee jerk reactions and usually, things go too far the other way.
Your points are based on your personal experiences, and those of your colleagues.
Similarly, the experiences we read on these postings are those of the personal experiences of those posters.
These threads are of no use if people stay up late at night on their PC, typing emotive reactions to what they have just read.
We ALL want those that break the law to be brought to justice.
I think the question here is what IS justice.
Justice can never be done when millions of good decent motorists WHO KNOW HOW TO REGULATE their speed according to the conditions, are losing their licences.This IS alienating the public from the scamera partnerships ( a lot of people think the BiB operate these scamera's - some do, but most are civvies ). Personally, and judging by some of the posts, a lot seem to agree that if the cameras were in obvious danger black spots ( schools etc ) EVEN IF THERE HAD BEEN NO ACCIDENTS recently, then we, the motoring public could understand and accept that safety is the prime concern. But from the posts and from my own experience, a lot of them are placed in areas where there havent been accidents that any locals have seen.Just last week, I saw a Talivan on my work run, positioned to catch motorists coming over the brow of a hill. So I contacted the relevant scam'ship and was given the usual bull about being a black spot blah blah. I have been past that same spot every day for 4 years and have NEVER seen an accident or flowers on the floor or any other evidence of said accidents.Yet I drive/ride through area's that are dangerous even to travel at 20 let alone 30 and have to say that most drivers SIGNIFICANTLY reduce their speed AS THEY ALWAYS HAVE DONE in situations like this. WHERE ARE THE CAMERAS HERE THEN ????!!!!
We all know why they are not at these obvious places, don't we. Cos they'd only snap a few per day.
All these postings, emotive reactions examples, jibes at Wildcat, are pointless. She has her opinions and they are valid. The time has come where quite frankly fewer and fewer people believe ANYTHING that politicians tell us , and particularly scamera partnerships.Everyone, please CALM down and lets keep this objective, cos personally, I am getting to the stage where I dont want to read them anymore.
And yes I do agree with your last statement re the courts letting off scumbags, but it is equally true that SOME coppers absolutely f******g love the power that they have over the public and abuse it. Just some mind.
Stay cool Streetcop ,and lets get back to some sensible rational posting. We all want to see everyones side of the story, but lets keep it constructive.
P.S Wildcat........love your sense of humour and expressions. Brilliant!!