Mass effect: Andromeda
Discussion
SimianWonder said:
The animations and character models are part of a larger issue, but weren't the reason for scoring it like that and again, as a huge fan of the original Mass Effect trilogy, Mass Effect: Andromeda has left me feeling deeply conflicted. The list of complaints I have about the game is lengthy, and it seems to be a step backwards for the series, but I still don’t think it’s an irredeemably bad game.
I enjoyed it, I just don't love it, not like I did the Trilogy. Yes, even ME3.
It just feels really lacking in polish, there are so many rough edges that shouldn't be there, so many silly little things that seem to exist only to annoy, aggravate or confuse. Crafting, for instance, being needlessly convoluted. It's the only way to get the gear you really want, but it boils down to mindlessly scanning everything in sight to accrue the correct level of resource, then having to delve into the messy menu UI to research it, then switch to another menu to develop it,then run to the loadout terminal to equip it. The crafting and loadout terminals are at different places on the Tempest as well, so you need to run around everytime you craft something to equip it, and you can't compare weapon stats between your current piece and one you're looking to build on the Tempest because you're in you civvies and the game doesn't recognise your currently equipped gear, which is ridiculous.
Find a weapon in the field? Well, tough luck, you can't just pick it up and use it, you need a loadout terminal to equip it. Plus, the ultra rare mods are just that; ultra-rare. I put one on a Mattock 3 assault rifle when I was level fifteen or something, but I'm now at level 60 and haven't seen another. Essentially, I just wasted it by putting it on a relatively early game piece of gear. So, the lesson is, don't use anything rare? What's the point of having them if they're so scarce and there's no way to recover them? It simply makes you not want to use them for fear of using them on the wrong item at the wrong time.
Silly things like that, in isolation, aren't a problem, but they do mount up.
Most of the missions outside the main story are tedious as well. Far too many of them devolve into "go here, scan something", even the ones that initially seem important, or have an intriguing premise, before asking you to planet hop multiple times to find the next navpoint, scan a crucial piece of equipment, or find a missing datapad. I'm a pathfinder, a trailblazer, not an errand boy. I know this kind of thing was a staple of RPGs, but given how much meat The Witcher 3 put on the bones of its side quests, is it wrong of me to have hoped the MEA might manage to at least be on par with a two year old game in that regard?
These missions aren't all bad, per se, but they desperately needed some editing, or at least a wider variety of gameplay scenarios. Forcing players to repeat the exact same action three times or drive across the map to interact with one prompt isn't fun, it just feels like padding. It feels like sandbox checklist busywork for the sake of it. It's Mass Effect, for goodness sake, not a Ubisoft game!
The campaign and loyalty missions are much better in this regard, but even then I felt the story was too brief. It feels like it is just hitting its stride and suddenly its over. Plus, you have to do sudoku puzzles to access monoliths. Who thought that was a good idea? Yes, you can now buy keys to bypass it cheaply enough, but if its so awful that the player base simply doesn't want to do it, then why is it even in the game?
It feels like Bioware was conflicted when making the game, mistaking depth and richness with complexity and size, a trap many open world games seem to fall into. Even, the combat, which is actually excellent, isn't perfect. Taking away your ability to control your squad mates powers means that its down to chance if you happen to trigger any tech or biotic damage combo other than your own. Still, that feels like a reasonable trade off given how much more open the combat spaces are and how much faster and more maneuverable than Shepard Ryder is.
I could go on, but I won't. Like I said, it's a decent enough game, it just utterly failed to live up to my - admittedly lofty -expectations, and if anything I feel more inclined to go and play the original trilogy again than to do a second run of MEA.
Maybe that says more about me than about the game.
Very comprehensive review... this mirrors most of the critical reviews I've read elsewhere. I enjoyed it, I just don't love it, not like I did the Trilogy. Yes, even ME3.
It just feels really lacking in polish, there are so many rough edges that shouldn't be there, so many silly little things that seem to exist only to annoy, aggravate or confuse. Crafting, for instance, being needlessly convoluted. It's the only way to get the gear you really want, but it boils down to mindlessly scanning everything in sight to accrue the correct level of resource, then having to delve into the messy menu UI to research it, then switch to another menu to develop it,then run to the loadout terminal to equip it. The crafting and loadout terminals are at different places on the Tempest as well, so you need to run around everytime you craft something to equip it, and you can't compare weapon stats between your current piece and one you're looking to build on the Tempest because you're in you civvies and the game doesn't recognise your currently equipped gear, which is ridiculous.
Find a weapon in the field? Well, tough luck, you can't just pick it up and use it, you need a loadout terminal to equip it. Plus, the ultra rare mods are just that; ultra-rare. I put one on a Mattock 3 assault rifle when I was level fifteen or something, but I'm now at level 60 and haven't seen another. Essentially, I just wasted it by putting it on a relatively early game piece of gear. So, the lesson is, don't use anything rare? What's the point of having them if they're so scarce and there's no way to recover them? It simply makes you not want to use them for fear of using them on the wrong item at the wrong time.
Silly things like that, in isolation, aren't a problem, but they do mount up.
Most of the missions outside the main story are tedious as well. Far too many of them devolve into "go here, scan something", even the ones that initially seem important, or have an intriguing premise, before asking you to planet hop multiple times to find the next navpoint, scan a crucial piece of equipment, or find a missing datapad. I'm a pathfinder, a trailblazer, not an errand boy. I know this kind of thing was a staple of RPGs, but given how much meat The Witcher 3 put on the bones of its side quests, is it wrong of me to have hoped the MEA might manage to at least be on par with a two year old game in that regard?
These missions aren't all bad, per se, but they desperately needed some editing, or at least a wider variety of gameplay scenarios. Forcing players to repeat the exact same action three times or drive across the map to interact with one prompt isn't fun, it just feels like padding. It feels like sandbox checklist busywork for the sake of it. It's Mass Effect, for goodness sake, not a Ubisoft game!
The campaign and loyalty missions are much better in this regard, but even then I felt the story was too brief. It feels like it is just hitting its stride and suddenly its over. Plus, you have to do sudoku puzzles to access monoliths. Who thought that was a good idea? Yes, you can now buy keys to bypass it cheaply enough, but if its so awful that the player base simply doesn't want to do it, then why is it even in the game?
It feels like Bioware was conflicted when making the game, mistaking depth and richness with complexity and size, a trap many open world games seem to fall into. Even, the combat, which is actually excellent, isn't perfect. Taking away your ability to control your squad mates powers means that its down to chance if you happen to trigger any tech or biotic damage combo other than your own. Still, that feels like a reasonable trade off given how much more open the combat spaces are and how much faster and more maneuverable than Shepard Ryder is.
I could go on, but I won't. Like I said, it's a decent enough game, it just utterly failed to live up to my - admittedly lofty -expectations, and if anything I feel more inclined to go and play the original trilogy again than to do a second run of MEA.
Maybe that says more about me than about the game.
I think I've been spoiled by The Witcher 3's side quests now, everything else seems really offensively like busywork by comparison.
It's hard to understand how a franchise as well established as Mass Effect, with the sort of talent that must exist at Bioware, could churn out something of this standard. They could learn a thing (or ten) from the developers of Injustice 2 - who must surely be a lot smaller budget and in team size - in terms of animation quality.
Durzel said:
SimianWonder said:
The animations and character models are part of a larger issue, but weren't the reason for scoring it like that and again, as a huge fan of the original Mass Effect trilogy, Mass Effect: Andromeda has left me feeling deeply conflicted. The list of complaints I have about the game is lengthy, and it seems to be a step backwards for the series, but I still don’t think it’s an irredeemably bad game.
I enjoyed it, I just don't love it, not like I did the Trilogy. Yes, even ME3
Very comprehensive review... this mirrors most of the critical reviews I've read elsewhere. I enjoyed it, I just don't love it, not like I did the Trilogy. Yes, even ME3
I think I've been spoiled by The Witcher 3's side quests now, everything else seems really offensively like busywork by comparison.
It's hard to understand how a franchise as well established as Mass Effect, with the sort of talent that must exist at Bioware, could churn out something of this standard. They could learn a thing (or ten) from the developers of Injustice 2 - who must surely be a lot smaller budget and in team size - in terms of animation quality.
One thing that hasn't been mention is how dull, characterless and void of personality everyone is. Aside from Peebee and Jaal, the rest are of no interest and I can't even be bothered to listen to alot of the conversations - most of what made ME awesome (ME2 especially) were the crewmates and lively NPC's you found out and about....I'm struggling to remember any in Andromeda, they might as well have all been Avina AI units spewing recorded messages.
And do they only have one Asari model? Even ME1/2/3/ did better.
And why does everyone talk, rigidly, face to face? I'm sure some of them are blind too, as their eyes move like Stevie Wonder. Heck, I've had some conversations where the NPC can't even be bothered to turn and face me, others don't even bother to stop messing with their arm-things.
Lastly, it seems the project focus was to cram as many missions in as possible. I'd rather have 40, interesting, deep side quests, than 100 similar, shallow ones. Quality, not quantity.
Maybe I've just been spoilt by The Witcher 3 since I've played the old ME games? Maybe ME2/3 were similar, but W3 raised the bar?
Yeah, Peebee aside, all the Asari are the same character model. It's a bit on the lazy side, but then the Krogan are basically the same as well, split into male or female models.
I don't think Witcher 3 revolutionised the genre like some do, but it definitely moved the goal posts in terms of presenting and telling a mature, deep, character driven story and the fact that many of secondary quests felt like they belonged right alongside the main quest speaks volumes for just how good they were. Proof? They're not even referred to as side quests, they're secondary quests and that's how the game treats them. Secondary to the story, but with no less thought or care put into them.
It gets worse as well. The Game of the Year edition of Witcher 3 frankly embarrasses Andromeda in just about every single way, and I'd argue for the fact that Hearts of Stone, the first "expansion pack" (which really did feel like an extended DLC quest, not a full fat expansion - an argument for another day, perhaps!) taken on its own, and without the base game or the frankly incredible Blood & Wine second expansion, trumped the entirety of Andromeda. It's not even a close run thing, and Witcher 3 is now two years old. Surely Bioware must have played it and realised their own product fell woefully short of this mark?
Andromeda also had the misfortune to arrive at the same time as Horizon Zero Dawn. To my surprise, Horizon was both an absolute technical marvel and has a compelling, well told story, all set in the most gorgeous sandbox I've ever seen. The fact that it shipped polished to the nth degree just pours more salt on what a dismal state Andromeda launched in.
Again, I didn't hate Andromeda, but I stand by the fact that it's a six out of ten game at best and given how fierce the competition is, that simply isn't close to good enough for a game bearing the Mass Effect brand. Frankly, if this is the best Bioware can muster, then it is probably for the best that they retire Mass Effect before they tarnish that beloved name even further.
I don't think Witcher 3 revolutionised the genre like some do, but it definitely moved the goal posts in terms of presenting and telling a mature, deep, character driven story and the fact that many of secondary quests felt like they belonged right alongside the main quest speaks volumes for just how good they were. Proof? They're not even referred to as side quests, they're secondary quests and that's how the game treats them. Secondary to the story, but with no less thought or care put into them.
It gets worse as well. The Game of the Year edition of Witcher 3 frankly embarrasses Andromeda in just about every single way, and I'd argue for the fact that Hearts of Stone, the first "expansion pack" (which really did feel like an extended DLC quest, not a full fat expansion - an argument for another day, perhaps!) taken on its own, and without the base game or the frankly incredible Blood & Wine second expansion, trumped the entirety of Andromeda. It's not even a close run thing, and Witcher 3 is now two years old. Surely Bioware must have played it and realised their own product fell woefully short of this mark?
Andromeda also had the misfortune to arrive at the same time as Horizon Zero Dawn. To my surprise, Horizon was both an absolute technical marvel and has a compelling, well told story, all set in the most gorgeous sandbox I've ever seen. The fact that it shipped polished to the nth degree just pours more salt on what a dismal state Andromeda launched in.
Again, I didn't hate Andromeda, but I stand by the fact that it's a six out of ten game at best and given how fierce the competition is, that simply isn't close to good enough for a game bearing the Mass Effect brand. Frankly, if this is the best Bioware can muster, then it is probably for the best that they retire Mass Effect before they tarnish that beloved name even further.
Edited by SimianWonder on Saturday 27th May 23:13
I've just seen the Krogan "fight". Good grief. I saw it before in a YT video, but only just got to that part of the game. Someone was in a rush to get to the pub on a friday night...terrible.
I've also recently seen a 'memory' that I suspect was meant to be sombre and rather sad; it wasn't because I was too busy noticing how items were clipping through each other while Sarah tried to do something with her face....I couldn't figure out what. Scott didn't seem to bothered about the situation.
I agree, It's definitely a 6/10 game from me.
I've also recently seen a 'memory' that I suspect was meant to be sombre and rather sad; it wasn't because I was too busy noticing how items were clipping through each other while Sarah tried to do something with her face....I couldn't figure out what. Scott didn't seem to bothered about the situation.
I agree, It's definitely a 6/10 game from me.
MattyB_ said:
I've just seen the Krogan "fight". Good grief. I saw it before in a YT video, but only just got to that part of the game. Someone was in a rush to get to the pub on a friday night...terrible.
Yeah, I thought my game had glitched out and it wasn't until I tried watching it on youtube I realised that's how it was meant to be. A couple of seven foot, seven hundred pound bipedal lizard-men duking it out and it felt like it had all the impact of a damp pair of underpants in a gentle breeze.MattyB_ said:
I've just seen the Krogan "fight". Good grief. I saw it before in a YT video, but only just got to that part of the game. Someone was in a rush to get to the pub on a friday night...terrible.
I've also recently seen a 'memory' that I suspect was meant to be sombre and rather sad; it wasn't because I was too busy noticing how items were clipping through each other while Sarah tried to do something with her face....I couldn't figure out what. Scott didn't seem to bothered about the situation.
I agree, It's definitely a 6/10 game from me.
Krogan fight was comical. I also found it hard to figure out whether Nakmoor Morda was a female or male Krogan, sounded like a camp bloke I've also recently seen a 'memory' that I suspect was meant to be sombre and rather sad; it wasn't because I was too busy noticing how items were clipping through each other while Sarah tried to do something with her face....I couldn't figure out what. Scott didn't seem to bothered about the situation.
I agree, It's definitely a 6/10 game from me.
Wobbegong said:
MattyB_ said:
I've just seen the Krogan "fight". Good grief. I saw it before in a YT video, but only just got to that part of the game. Someone was in a rush to get to the pub on a friday night...terrible.
I've also recently seen a 'memory' that I suspect was meant to be sombre and rather sad; it wasn't because I was too busy noticing how items were clipping through each other while Sarah tried to do something with her face....I couldn't figure out what. Scott didn't seem to bothered about the situation.
I agree, It's definitely a 6/10 game from me.
Krogan fight was comical. I also found it hard to figure out whether Nakmoor Morda was a female or male Krogan, sounded like a camp bloke I've also recently seen a 'memory' that I suspect was meant to be sombre and rather sad; it wasn't because I was too busy noticing how items were clipping through each other while Sarah tried to do something with her face....I couldn't figure out what. Scott didn't seem to bothered about the situation.
I agree, It's definitely a 6/10 game from me.
I'm pretty frustrated with myself for caving in and buying it in week one. I played about an hour or so then gave up. Fired it up over this weekend, did one conversation and shut it down again. I just couldn't be bothered with it!
Maybe I'll come back to it later in the year when the ennui may have passed.
Maybe I'll come back to it later in the year when the ennui may have passed.
I too bought this at launch with high hopes having been a fan of the first three. Played a few hours (enough to get to the Tempest and a few missions on Eos) and then dropped it for other things as it didn't really grab me
Over the last week, I've picked it up again and played some more hoping for a better experience as it has now had several patches and updates. I'm at level 23 or thereabouts, Eos at 100% viability and done most of Veold with the next main quest being on that planet too
And I've ejected the disc and put it on the shelf. My god, it's just so damn dull! Missions are repetitive and boring, the character movement is terrible and not at all fluid, the gun play just doesn't work for me, the not difficult but slow the game to a crawl Remnant sudoku decryption puzzles are incredibly ill conceived and as for all the crafting / research nonsense .... clumsy, cumbersome, tedious are some of the words I'd use
Little things like if you want to get on the Tempest to pick up rewards, check on the Strike missions, etc you have to leave the planet you are on and go to orbit? I mean, why is that? It's completely stupid and annoying. I just want to get on the ship, perhaps change loadouts (this is also a rubbish way of doing things), sell stuff, spend AVP points, etc and then you know, get off the ship again and continue what I was doing on the planet
Nope, it's a big fat flop for me - 5 out of 10 and if I did such things, I'd trade it in for something else in a heartbeat. For me, probably one of the worst game purchases I've made in a long time
Over the last week, I've picked it up again and played some more hoping for a better experience as it has now had several patches and updates. I'm at level 23 or thereabouts, Eos at 100% viability and done most of Veold with the next main quest being on that planet too
And I've ejected the disc and put it on the shelf. My god, it's just so damn dull! Missions are repetitive and boring, the character movement is terrible and not at all fluid, the gun play just doesn't work for me, the not difficult but slow the game to a crawl Remnant sudoku decryption puzzles are incredibly ill conceived and as for all the crafting / research nonsense .... clumsy, cumbersome, tedious are some of the words I'd use
Little things like if you want to get on the Tempest to pick up rewards, check on the Strike missions, etc you have to leave the planet you are on and go to orbit? I mean, why is that? It's completely stupid and annoying. I just want to get on the ship, perhaps change loadouts (this is also a rubbish way of doing things), sell stuff, spend AVP points, etc and then you know, get off the ship again and continue what I was doing on the planet
Nope, it's a big fat flop for me - 5 out of 10 and if I did such things, I'd trade it in for something else in a heartbeat. For me, probably one of the worst game purchases I've made in a long time
chris watton said:
And to think, I almost bought this over Horizon Zero Dawn. (Until I watched reviews and gameplay footage on YouTube...)
I bought MEA over HZD because HZD is (and won't be) available on PC.Only bought it because it was on offer for £20 - just after I'd finished Witcher 3 - and it's fine for that price.
vonuber said:
Oddly enough I found the first 15hrs of the game much worse than the remainder. It's a a bit arse about face which is shame, as there is some genuinely good stuff in it.
Yeah, I'd agree with that. Once you get a bit of freedom in where you want to go the game does improve considerably. The very first planet where Alec is leading you was just so, so dull.Gassing Station | Video Games | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff