World of Tanks (Vol 2)
Discussion
The spotting mechanics aren't great in World of Tanks anyway and some people have reported issues with the current patch.
I think by default replays are disabled, but you can turn them on in the settings. It'll either save every game (it doesn't take much space - less than 1Mb usually) or just the last game and overwrite previous ones. To play them you need to exit the game and click on the file you want (there's a Replays folder) and you can fast forward, rewind and freeze frame as you wish.
For instant replays of damage you need to play War Thunder Ground Forces. This game has little animations telling you what you hit, (or where you were hit) and what damage it did to crew and modules.
E.g. :
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3_S43IaYOQ4
I think by default replays are disabled, but you can turn them on in the settings. It'll either save every game (it doesn't take much space - less than 1Mb usually) or just the last game and overwrite previous ones. To play them you need to exit the game and click on the file you want (there's a Replays folder) and you can fast forward, rewind and freeze frame as you wish.
For instant replays of damage you need to play War Thunder Ground Forces. This game has little animations telling you what you hit, (or where you were hit) and what damage it did to crew and modules.
E.g. :
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3_S43IaYOQ4
I had a belter platoon session last night, my platoon mate was pretty low on silver, so we ran tier 8 premiums for a few hours, mainly his FCM 50 t and my Super Pershing. These tanks actually have great synergy, with the SP acting as a distraction, tanking shots with it's troll spaced armour and the FCM acting as the flanker. We had a match on Himmelsdorf where I drove the front of my SP out into the line of fire at the optimum bounce angle and through wiggling between shots, managed to block somewhere in the region of about 20-25 shots, the enemy completely transfixed with tunnel vision. In that time, I killed a Sturer Emil (complete with 128mm gun), a Fury and most of a hull-down T29 health bar. If I could have recorded it and played "Ride of the Valkyries" over the top it would be an incredible piece of footage.
I think I banked about 1.5 million in silver in two hours, not bad. I could have probably done more in my T34 but I don't find it as much fun in a platoon as the SP.
I think I banked about 1.5 million in silver in two hours, not bad. I could have probably done more in my T34 but I don't find it as much fun in a platoon as the SP.
This last week the game has been absolutely kicking my arse
http://www.noobmeter.com/player/eu/cirian75/500550...
http://www.noobmeter.com/player/eu/cirian75/500550...
Mine has been kicked quite a bit harder than that. Matchmaking and RNG within the game has been atrocious just lately. It's been so bad that I have been logging off after less than a dozen games because I am struggling to get a single win.
http://www.noobmeter.com/player/eu/scarebird/50034...
http://www.noobmeter.com/player/eu/scarebird/50034...
cirian75 said:
the main reason appears to be the teams make up.
most players I've been lumped with are the 40 to 44% win rate players
heavy tanks have started to camp the back much worse than normal, mainly idiots in premium T34's
I have noticed that far more players are camping at the back since the last patch, I wonder if the nerfed view range has caused people to be even more cautious.most players I've been lumped with are the 40 to 44% win rate players
heavy tanks have started to camp the back much worse than normal, mainly idiots in premium T34's
It does seem to have been more campy of late, and this weekend was particularly bad. It could be the view range changes have confused people - in theory it should make it less campy as people will be spotted later by TD's than before but that's already putting more thought into it than the majority of people will.
It might also be that there are so many lights whizzing round now, thanks to the missions and new tank trees, that you can get randomly spotted almost anywhere at any time it feels.
It might also be that there are so many lights whizzing round now, thanks to the missions and new tank trees, that you can get randomly spotted almost anywhere at any time it feels.
They've been playing whack-a-mole with the nerf bat a lot recently. Trouble is, as soon as they cripple one vehicle or class, people just move to another and spam that instead. I don't think it's good for the game for them to keep messing around like this.
It's the same with maps. They're constantly fiddling with them because they don't test them enough before they're introduced.
It's the same with maps. They're constantly fiddling with them because they don't test them enough before they're introduced.
cirian75 said:
I know that 704 is getting nerf'd 3 patches in a row
9.5 = secret reverse speed nerf they told no one about.
9.6 = lost 30m view range
9.7 = BL10 is losing 20mm pen, 286 down to 266.
Ouch, that's pretty tough, it is a very powerful TD though. 9.5 = secret reverse speed nerf they told no one about.
9.6 = lost 30m view range
9.7 = BL10 is losing 20mm pen, 286 down to 266.
Your comment about the surging numbers of T34s on the field is interesting, I can see how giving out one of the most powerful support tanks in the game, with that incredible gun and mantlet combination, could swing the gameplay in a bad direction.
Mastodon2 said:
cirian75 said:
I know that 704 is getting nerf'd 3 patches in a row
9.5 = secret reverse speed nerf they told no one about.
9.6 = lost 30m view range
9.7 = BL10 is losing 20mm pen, 286 down to 266.
Ouch, that's pretty tough, it is a very powerful TD though. 9.5 = secret reverse speed nerf they told no one about.
9.6 = lost 30m view range
9.7 = BL10 is losing 20mm pen, 286 down to 266.
Your comment about the surging numbers of T34s on the field is interesting, I can see how giving out one of the most powerful support tanks in the game, with that incredible gun and mantlet combination, could swing the gameplay in a bad direction.
Ash:
You have a spotting capability on your own - the actual ability of YOU to spot a tank depends on your spotting range and the target's camo rating etc.
Other team members can spot a tank for you - this may be outside your spotting range - if they spot it (assuming they're within radio contact) it will be visible to you so long as it is within your max draw distance
Rotating a tank does count as your tank moving and therefore it will lose any camo bonus for remaining still and you are therefore more likely to be spotted
Yes you can hit a tank even if you can't see it - I've blind shot tanks loads of times - think there's even a medal for it now
Tanks are highlighted if someone spots them - you do not need to be 'pointing' at a tank to see it - you always have 360 degree vision
Disappearing tanks (a phenomenon supposedly being fixed soon allegedly) merely mean that a spotted tank has left someone's spotting range for long enough - they're still there and can still be hit
You have a spotting capability on your own - the actual ability of YOU to spot a tank depends on your spotting range and the target's camo rating etc.
Other team members can spot a tank for you - this may be outside your spotting range - if they spot it (assuming they're within radio contact) it will be visible to you so long as it is within your max draw distance
Rotating a tank does count as your tank moving and therefore it will lose any camo bonus for remaining still and you are therefore more likely to be spotted
Yes you can hit a tank even if you can't see it - I've blind shot tanks loads of times - think there's even a medal for it now
Tanks are highlighted if someone spots them - you do not need to be 'pointing' at a tank to see it - you always have 360 degree vision
Disappearing tanks (a phenomenon supposedly being fixed soon allegedly) merely mean that a spotted tank has left someone's spotting range for long enough - they're still there and can still be hit
Its a complex one, spotting. Best bet is to read up in the WOT Wiki about it, if I remember rightly its explained there well. I'll try here, but seriously suggest reading there.
1) Between every tank in the battle at any time is a 'score' to be spotted. That score is affected by many factors, some of which a variable during a match, but essentially equates to being a distance at which someone has to be from you to be able to them.
2) Every tank in the game has a maximum view range. This is affected by factors, some of which are dynamic during the game.
3) Spotting checks are carried out by the game server at differing intervals - for example it checks if you are spotting things close to you virtually all the time, but only for things far away from you every few seconds (this is due to the load on the server).
4) At each spotting check, if you have any tanks within your view range (at that point in time) where their range to be spotted is less than your distance from them then you spot them.
5) When spotting a tank you also radio your team. So if the spotted tank would not have been visible to them through the normal mechanic they can still see them, but will stop seeing them when you lose the spot. Likewise you can see what they are spotting and you could not spot, but only when they are spotting them.
6) If you get within 50m of any tank you auto spot them (even if they are the other side of a building and you can't actually see them). Think of it as you can hear them.
In practice it works by being: your view range + modifiers - enemy tank camo modifiers = range needed to spot enemy. If they are closer than that then they are spotted. So that bit is fairly simple..
Now, as I mentioned the view ranges / spotted scores are dynamic and this is what causes the spotted / not spotted / spotted issue you describe.
Dynamic factors affecting score to be spotted:
-Camo rating. The more camo rating you have, the further view range needed to spot you. Camo Paint, Camo nets increase this. Paint is permanent, nets only when they are active (after being still for 3 seconds)
-Bushes/Trees. These have the affect of increasing Camo rating when they are between you and the enemy. 1 bush is ok, 2 has a massive effect.
-Firing. Firing greatly reduces your camo rating temporarily, making your score to be spotted much lower.
-Crew Skills. A crew member trained in the camo skill will add further rating. The more rating, the more distance is required to spot you.
Dynamic factors affecting view range of the spotter:
Tank stats. Each tank / turret comes with a max view range, but these are modified by:
-Equipment. Coated Optics or Binoculars add a direct bonus to view range. Ventilation adds a smaller bonus.
-Crew Skills. A 100% commander has more view range than a 75% commander, but then additionally a crew member trained in the situational awareness skill will add further view range. There is another crew skill that does this also, but I forget what its called. Additionally having the Brothers in Arms skill at 100% on all crew members will boost view range.
-Tank / Crew Damage. In a battle if your viewport is destroyed, or your commander is injured, your view range falls massively until repaired / healed.
So it's entirely possible that at one spotting check a tank is just visible to you, but then circumstances change (they get a higher camo when their camo net activates for example) then they are not visible at the next spotting check so they go invisible. Then they fire / you get closer and at the next spotting check they become visible again as you are close enough to see them again...
It's all weird, but once you get it down it becomes a very valuable strength to understand it.
I've also not gone into the max view range for spotting checks (it's 500m. Even if a tank 510m away from you should be visible by the rules above it wont be).
1) Between every tank in the battle at any time is a 'score' to be spotted. That score is affected by many factors, some of which a variable during a match, but essentially equates to being a distance at which someone has to be from you to be able to them.
2) Every tank in the game has a maximum view range. This is affected by factors, some of which are dynamic during the game.
3) Spotting checks are carried out by the game server at differing intervals - for example it checks if you are spotting things close to you virtually all the time, but only for things far away from you every few seconds (this is due to the load on the server).
4) At each spotting check, if you have any tanks within your view range (at that point in time) where their range to be spotted is less than your distance from them then you spot them.
5) When spotting a tank you also radio your team. So if the spotted tank would not have been visible to them through the normal mechanic they can still see them, but will stop seeing them when you lose the spot. Likewise you can see what they are spotting and you could not spot, but only when they are spotting them.
6) If you get within 50m of any tank you auto spot them (even if they are the other side of a building and you can't actually see them). Think of it as you can hear them.
In practice it works by being: your view range + modifiers - enemy tank camo modifiers = range needed to spot enemy. If they are closer than that then they are spotted. So that bit is fairly simple..
Now, as I mentioned the view ranges / spotted scores are dynamic and this is what causes the spotted / not spotted / spotted issue you describe.
Dynamic factors affecting score to be spotted:
-Camo rating. The more camo rating you have, the further view range needed to spot you. Camo Paint, Camo nets increase this. Paint is permanent, nets only when they are active (after being still for 3 seconds)
-Bushes/Trees. These have the affect of increasing Camo rating when they are between you and the enemy. 1 bush is ok, 2 has a massive effect.
-Firing. Firing greatly reduces your camo rating temporarily, making your score to be spotted much lower.
-Crew Skills. A crew member trained in the camo skill will add further rating. The more rating, the more distance is required to spot you.
Dynamic factors affecting view range of the spotter:
Tank stats. Each tank / turret comes with a max view range, but these are modified by:
-Equipment. Coated Optics or Binoculars add a direct bonus to view range. Ventilation adds a smaller bonus.
-Crew Skills. A 100% commander has more view range than a 75% commander, but then additionally a crew member trained in the situational awareness skill will add further view range. There is another crew skill that does this also, but I forget what its called. Additionally having the Brothers in Arms skill at 100% on all crew members will boost view range.
-Tank / Crew Damage. In a battle if your viewport is destroyed, or your commander is injured, your view range falls massively until repaired / healed.
So it's entirely possible that at one spotting check a tank is just visible to you, but then circumstances change (they get a higher camo when their camo net activates for example) then they are not visible at the next spotting check so they go invisible. Then they fire / you get closer and at the next spotting check they become visible again as you are close enough to see them again...
It's all weird, but once you get it down it becomes a very valuable strength to understand it.
I've also not gone into the max view range for spotting checks (it's 500m. Even if a tank 510m away from you should be visible by the rules above it wont be).
Edited by bstb3 on Monday 16th March 14:58
ash73 said:
Thanks chaps, the weird thing is the tanks disappear when they start moving after I hit them; that should make them more visible, not less. I was worried it was a cheat.
Were they at range? If so it was likely a tank beyond your ability to spot and you were seeing it by proxy via radio, when the team-mate radioing it's position lost contact so did you.ash73 said:
Thanks chaps, the weird thing is the tanks disappear when they start moving after I hit them; that should make them more visible, not less. I was worried it was a cheat.
I don't think those kind of cheats really exist in WOT, thankfully. There are dirty 'mods' which show information that should be hidden (for example highlighting on a minimap where arty has just fired from), but spotting, damage, accuracy etc is all handled server side. For a cheat to affect it they would have to hack the WOT servers, and I really cant see it being worth the hassle.Could it be that the target was obscured by a bush? If so and they had fired it could be making them visible initially, giving time to fire back and see them move. After a while the camo loss from firing is lost, then they become invisible again on the next spotting check even if moving - bushes add a lot of camo if used properly.
Edit - seen your reply. That spot you describe is right on the limits of spotting ranges, especially in lower tiers, and there are bushes than can interfere with it also.
Got royally moaned at for "stealing" kills last night most unfairly IMO.
I was in the ELC again and had joined an adhoc group moving around the edge of the map. I was scouting ahead and spotting the incoming heavies (one at a time luckily) I would call for fire on each and hide... nothing, nothing, nothing- ok then so I pop out track them and run away to reload.
My "team" finally catch up and start pounding the enemy down, by the time I've reloaded and got back into the fray the enemy is down to 200-ish, I wait for him to get finished so I can scout ahead again, nothing, nothing oh sod-it, I dart out and kill them then push on.
Did this three times and kept getting abuse- pretty lame IMO since I spotted all of them and put the first shot in on 2. After all it is a team game isn't it?
I also spotted all the arty and got them killed, was trying to complete LT-10 but alas the SPG's spotted me too just too sh*t to take me out :-)
I was in the ELC again and had joined an adhoc group moving around the edge of the map. I was scouting ahead and spotting the incoming heavies (one at a time luckily) I would call for fire on each and hide... nothing, nothing, nothing- ok then so I pop out track them and run away to reload.
My "team" finally catch up and start pounding the enemy down, by the time I've reloaded and got back into the fray the enemy is down to 200-ish, I wait for him to get finished so I can scout ahead again, nothing, nothing oh sod-it, I dart out and kill them then push on.
Did this three times and kept getting abuse- pretty lame IMO since I spotted all of them and put the first shot in on 2. After all it is a team game isn't it?
I also spotted all the arty and got them killed, was trying to complete LT-10 but alas the SPG's spotted me too just too sh*t to take me out :-)
we had a proper kill stealer last night
Mainly T8 game, I'm in the JP2, unplatooned
Sandriver on assault, we're defending.
battle progresses well, we are winning.
their right attack is killed off.
So we move to assist the left.
and then it gets strange WZ-111 on 3 kills teams up with me, or so I think
I engage 2 E25's and a tiger 1
I Kill one E25, getting smashed to death by the other E25 and Tiger 1
I wonder why are they only shooting me?
the I die just as I plant a 500hp into the 2nd E25, and then I notice that WZ-111 has held back out behind cover.
He then pops up and kills the the E25 and tiger.
I then see him with 3 times with others on our team, he goes in with them and holds back at the last second to make sure they do the lions share of damage before they die and he moves in and kill steals.
Team well are of what he's doing now are raging in chat.
Its now 2 vs 1
Us > Panther 88 and the WZ-111 who is 100% health
them > a borsig.
panther hits the borsig, borsig hits back.
Panther is on very low health and is a one shot, borsig can take one more from the panther but not the WZ
WZ-111 stops hiding behind the berm to kill steal his 8th, Panther clocks this, guns his engine and ram kills/suicides the borsig deigning the WZ his 8th
WZ did about 1400 damage in a T8 game.
Mainly T8 game, I'm in the JP2, unplatooned
Sandriver on assault, we're defending.
battle progresses well, we are winning.
their right attack is killed off.
So we move to assist the left.
and then it gets strange WZ-111 on 3 kills teams up with me, or so I think
I engage 2 E25's and a tiger 1
I Kill one E25, getting smashed to death by the other E25 and Tiger 1
I wonder why are they only shooting me?
the I die just as I plant a 500hp into the 2nd E25, and then I notice that WZ-111 has held back out behind cover.
He then pops up and kills the the E25 and tiger.
I then see him with 3 times with others on our team, he goes in with them and holds back at the last second to make sure they do the lions share of damage before they die and he moves in and kill steals.
Team well are of what he's doing now are raging in chat.
Its now 2 vs 1
Us > Panther 88 and the WZ-111 who is 100% health
them > a borsig.
panther hits the borsig, borsig hits back.
Panther is on very low health and is a one shot, borsig can take one more from the panther but not the WZ
WZ-111 stops hiding behind the berm to kill steal his 8th, Panther clocks this, guns his engine and ram kills/suicides the borsig deigning the WZ his 8th
WZ did about 1400 damage in a T8 game.
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