Tyres - I'm confused
Discussion
I've just been searching back through previous threads on tyres and I'm still confused.
My Chimaera 500's rear S02's are getting to the end of their life and are in need of replacement.
I've read all the threads on S03's, Toyos, Eagles, etc. but I am still unsure what tyres to go with.
I will be continuing to use the car on public roads, mostly in the dry.
I do not want surprises (ie. sudden breakaway on the limit followed by a trip into hedge) which makes me cautious of reports of the S03 having abrupt breakaway. Having said that, I don’t corner on the limit on the roads but I have broken traction several times due to putting the power down too early on the exit of a bend. Greater experience of the car makes it a rare occurrence now but I am still wary of it happening.
I'd like good grip in the wet and dry, but since I drive like a complete granny when it starts to rain (a result of having had a couple of nasty fishtails in the wet) then I guess that dry grip is of slightly higher importance to wet.
So I am in a quandary as to what tyres are most suitable for my car and driving style.
What do people recommend?
My Chimaera 500's rear S02's are getting to the end of their life and are in need of replacement.
I've read all the threads on S03's, Toyos, Eagles, etc. but I am still unsure what tyres to go with.
I will be continuing to use the car on public roads, mostly in the dry.
I do not want surprises (ie. sudden breakaway on the limit followed by a trip into hedge) which makes me cautious of reports of the S03 having abrupt breakaway. Having said that, I don’t corner on the limit on the roads but I have broken traction several times due to putting the power down too early on the exit of a bend. Greater experience of the car makes it a rare occurrence now but I am still wary of it happening.
I'd like good grip in the wet and dry, but since I drive like a complete granny when it starts to rain (a result of having had a couple of nasty fishtails in the wet) then I guess that dry grip is of slightly higher importance to wet.
So I am in a quandary as to what tyres are most suitable for my car and driving style.
What do people recommend?
I have a Griff 500. Changed rear SO2s to SO3s a month ago. First impressions marred somewhat by having 34lbs pressure 
but at correct pressure they are fine. Loads more grip in the dry due I'm sure to the SO2s being well worn - in fact the difference is quite amazing. Don't ever be fooled into thinking well worn tyres on dry days are "slicks" as I admit I used to.
The SO3s felt as though they were "squirming" under hard acceleration and cornering when new but that seems to have gone now.
In the wet the performance is excellent. I've had no sudden breakaway moments. Hope this helps.
but at correct pressure they are fine. Loads more grip in the dry due I'm sure to the SO2s being well worn - in fact the difference is quite amazing. Don't ever be fooled into thinking well worn tyres on dry days are "slicks" as I admit I used to. The SO3s felt as though they were "squirming" under hard acceleration and cornering when new but that seems to have gone now.
In the wet the performance is excellent. I've had no sudden breakaway moments. Hope this helps.
I'm in the same boat as Jon. Can't say I'm entirely confident that the decision is spot on, but I'm going to go for S03s. Shpub thinks they are good which is a pretty solid recommendation in my book.
Noticed an alarming amount of wear on the inside of the front nearside tyre, so time for an alignment check too methinks.
Noticed an alarming amount of wear on the inside of the front nearside tyre, so time for an alignment check too methinks.
I've had SO3's on the back of mine for a while now and they are excellent.
Like you Jon I don't go mental on the road
but I have found wet and dry weather grip excellent, and if anything when they do break away they seem much more progressive you seem to get pleny of warning.
Go for it, you won't look back!
Like you Jon I don't go mental on the road
but I have found wet and dry weather grip excellent, and if anything when they do break away they seem much more progressive you seem to get pleny of warning. Go for it, you won't look back!
I put up a similar thread a month or so ago and got no end of response and opinions.
Like you, i purely use my car for road use (for now anyway) and the negative responses that came from Steve Heath (he was just conveying opinions he'd heard from trackday users) regarding the Toyo Proxes do not really come into play for general road use.
By all accounts they are an excellent tyre and an excellent alternative to the Bridgestone. That is alternative, NOT compromise. TVR now use them as their tyre on the Tuscan and this itself suggests it must be up to the performance levels - particularly on road use.
One other thing, whether relevant or not, is that they are a damn sight cheaper too. So an equally as good tyre for road use at a better price than the Bridgestone - you'd be mad not to.
For more info on the speed ratings debate, refer to recent threads - interesting stuff from people in the trade and in the know. (Sorry i'm not up to posting the title of the thread 'here' so you can click and read!!)
Good luck on finding the right tyre.
Like you, i purely use my car for road use (for now anyway) and the negative responses that came from Steve Heath (he was just conveying opinions he'd heard from trackday users) regarding the Toyo Proxes do not really come into play for general road use.
By all accounts they are an excellent tyre and an excellent alternative to the Bridgestone. That is alternative, NOT compromise. TVR now use them as their tyre on the Tuscan and this itself suggests it must be up to the performance levels - particularly on road use.
One other thing, whether relevant or not, is that they are a damn sight cheaper too. So an equally as good tyre for road use at a better price than the Bridgestone - you'd be mad not to.
For more info on the speed ratings debate, refer to recent threads - interesting stuff from people in the trade and in the know. (Sorry i'm not up to posting the title of the thread 'here' so you can click and read!!)
Good luck on finding the right tyre.
Jon, I have to concur with the thoughts of others on SO3s which I've had on my Chim since I bought it. They were new onto the car when I bought it and they are fantastic in the wet believe me. I've never had any breakaway in the wet - maybe that's because I'm not caning it too much the wet but I certainly don't pussyfootabout either.
After 6000 miles they look just like new tyres with stacks of tread. I'm sure if you wanted they'd be like any other tyre if abused enough
but honestly I coul.dn't wish for a better tyre IMO.
Don't see how SO2s could have been better? What was different about them to SO3s?
After 6000 miles they look just like new tyres with stacks of tread. I'm sure if you wanted they'd be like any other tyre if abused enough
but honestly I coul.dn't wish for a better tyre IMO. Don't see how SO2s could have been better? What was different about them to SO3s?
True, but I have also heard it said that TVR would endorse Fry's Crisp & Dry as their engine oil of choice if the sponsorship deal was good enough.
duncan hermer said:TVR now use them as their tyre on the Tuscan and this itself suggests it must be up to the performance levels - particularly on road use.
Keep the opinions coming folks - because I'm still not much closer to making a decision.
I put Eagle F1's on the Griff when the SO2's expired and can honestly say that I would put them my car again at the drop of a hat.
I've got SO2's on the Tuscan at the moment and they are brand new (David Gerald TVR got them for me) so they are still around.
However if I had known they were going to chuck in a set of tyres when I bought the car I would have asked for F1's...
F1's did seem to offer greater traction in both wet and dry conditions and I drove the Griff very hard on occasions and they never felt like they were going to break away...
Cheers
DC
I've got SO2's on the Tuscan at the moment and they are brand new (David Gerald TVR got them for me) so they are still around.
However if I had known they were going to chuck in a set of tyres when I bought the car I would have asked for F1's...
F1's did seem to offer greater traction in both wet and dry conditions and I drove the Griff very hard on occasions and they never felt like they were going to break away...
Cheers
DC
Chnaged from S02's to S03's on the back of the Griffith after track day at Anglesey ... The S02's were very good.
The S03's are just as good and suit my driving even better. They are absolutely superb on the Griffith. I am now on my second set of rears (1st set last 6-7000 miles
)
They are very senseitive to tyre pressures and indeed if the set up is wrong (alignment) they will never perform as they should.
Just had 4 x S03's fitted and precision balanced along with 24,000 service at Racing Green which includes their fantastic alignment machine.
The Griffith is now totally sorted and fantastic to drive. The tyres are working for the car rather than against.
I wholly recommend them, but I may say that if I had F1's. My dad has those on the front of his Chimaera and rates them highly. They were on the car when he bought it ... so that's not very comparative either.
The breakaway on the S03's I do not find to be that fast at all. I have yet to have a nasty surprise and it is more to do with how the whole car is feeling. I have found them superb on track with the Griffith and a 4.2 Cerberra I have had the chance to drive on them aswell.
IMHO of course ...
The S03's are just as good and suit my driving even better. They are absolutely superb on the Griffith. I am now on my second set of rears (1st set last 6-7000 miles
) They are very senseitive to tyre pressures and indeed if the set up is wrong (alignment) they will never perform as they should.
Just had 4 x S03's fitted and precision balanced along with 24,000 service at Racing Green which includes their fantastic alignment machine.
The Griffith is now totally sorted and fantastic to drive. The tyres are working for the car rather than against.
I wholly recommend them, but I may say that if I had F1's. My dad has those on the front of his Chimaera and rates them highly. They were on the car when he bought it ... so that's not very comparative either.
The breakaway on the S03's I do not find to be that fast at all. I have yet to have a nasty surprise and it is more to do with how the whole car is feeling. I have found them superb on track with the Griffith and a 4.2 Cerberra I have had the chance to drive on them aswell.
IMHO of course ...
yep...S03's are fine on a griff.
loads of track time AND road use. 6-7k miles rear 10k miles on the front.
now on my 2nd set.
break away is excellent, but as has been said before the cars set up is important (i have driven some DOG griffs - HAS to be down to the set up.
i do run them 2psi down for personal preference.
don't know about proxes - only used bridgies.
loads of track time AND road use. 6-7k miles rear 10k miles on the front.
now on my 2nd set.
break away is excellent, but as has been said before the cars set up is important (i have driven some DOG griffs - HAS to be down to the set up.
i do run them 2psi down for personal preference.
don't know about proxes - only used bridgies.
JonRB said: Fair enough Steve, but I did say road use and with the greatest of respect the paddock / sprint track is not really the public road.
I will probably fit S03s though, but there was no harm in starting this thread to gauge opinion.
No but the cars are deliberately restricted to road tyres by the MSA. In other words they can't use any of the super sticky stuff. In addition these are cars that double as everyday drivers and are not specials that come out to play. They are road cars that their owners like to enjoy. The main difference is that they come out onto a track and do it legally rather than try and find a private road somewhere
If a tyre offers something a bit special, then the sprinters will find it PDQ and as a result they are a pretty good barometer for what is a good tyre.
Don't forget that good grip is essential not only for acceleration but also braking. OK road driving is not as frantic but when you need to stop, it is nice to know that the car has the best there is. Afterall the tyre is only thing between you and the road.
Buy any of the well known alternatives and get to know the level of grip afforded by them.
I had S02s on my M Roadster, changed to Toyos and couldn't tell the difference. I had Michelin Pilot Sports on before that, and guess what, I couldn't tell the difference in normal everyday driving.
I agree that in the controlled conditions of a track, when the driver is able to consistently lap within a few tenths every time, changing the tyres may make a discernable difference and an objective judgement can be made.
However, everybody's driving style is different, their cars are different, and they may want different things out of their tyres (wet v dry grip, longeviety etc).
So again, buy something decent, then make sure you check pressures regularly. If anyone drives in a manner that frequently explores the outer limits of the tyres' performance on the road (other than in emergency situations) then its not just new tyres they'll need, it'll be the services of a TVR bodyshop, and hopefully not the hospital.
P.S. If you are like me, you'll want the very best for your car - which I imagine is why the question was asked. But I cannot believe there is one definitive answer that applies to all people, or that the S03 is so clearly superior to all alternatives that it is the only one to even consider.
I had S02s on my M Roadster, changed to Toyos and couldn't tell the difference. I had Michelin Pilot Sports on before that, and guess what, I couldn't tell the difference in normal everyday driving.
I agree that in the controlled conditions of a track, when the driver is able to consistently lap within a few tenths every time, changing the tyres may make a discernable difference and an objective judgement can be made.
However, everybody's driving style is different, their cars are different, and they may want different things out of their tyres (wet v dry grip, longeviety etc).
So again, buy something decent, then make sure you check pressures regularly. If anyone drives in a manner that frequently explores the outer limits of the tyres' performance on the road (other than in emergency situations) then its not just new tyres they'll need, it'll be the services of a TVR bodyshop, and hopefully not the hospital.
P.S. If you are like me, you'll want the very best for your car - which I imagine is why the question was asked. But I cannot believe there is one definitive answer that applies to all people, or that the S03 is so clearly superior to all alternatives that it is the only one to even consider.
as a further to steve...
5th Gear recently did a report on tyres. they took a pug (i think) to bedford aerodome and gave it to mr palmer. he did laps on crap tyres, factory spec tyres and decent performance tyres.
Guess what!
crap tyres ruined the cars handling, so it cornered atrotiously and gave a bad time (nearly leaving the black stuff at one point!)
standards were ok.
performance tyres made the car handle better, brake better and turn in better giving a faster lap time.
Buy the best you can! they cost more, but as steve says, they're the only thing keeping you on the road!
the only time you will think about these tyres is when you need them, and then you'll be VERY GLAD you fitted the best available!
can't really differenciate between makes as i've always used bridgies on my griff. as they work so well, and seem to be the one used by everyone in the know in the pitlane, i havn't had the money or courage to swap around! going into paddock at speed is NOT the time to find out if the tyres you've bought are crap! even if they were £30-00 a corner cheaper!!
by the way, my griff can lap brands indy 5 seconds slower than the recent touring car leg did, and they're on slicks! so grip MUST be good.
only my opinion, of course, but tyres are the ONE area you don't wany to skimp!
(by the way, also sprinters and racers also race in the wet)
ask some more people / dealers etc and make your own mind up!
andyr
(isn't the the S03 based on the compound F1 Ferrari were using on wet tyres in 99-2000? they did ok)
5th Gear recently did a report on tyres. they took a pug (i think) to bedford aerodome and gave it to mr palmer. he did laps on crap tyres, factory spec tyres and decent performance tyres.
Guess what!
crap tyres ruined the cars handling, so it cornered atrotiously and gave a bad time (nearly leaving the black stuff at one point!)
standards were ok.
performance tyres made the car handle better, brake better and turn in better giving a faster lap time.
Buy the best you can! they cost more, but as steve says, they're the only thing keeping you on the road!
the only time you will think about these tyres is when you need them, and then you'll be VERY GLAD you fitted the best available!
can't really differenciate between makes as i've always used bridgies on my griff. as they work so well, and seem to be the one used by everyone in the know in the pitlane, i havn't had the money or courage to swap around! going into paddock at speed is NOT the time to find out if the tyres you've bought are crap! even if they were £30-00 a corner cheaper!!
by the way, my griff can lap brands indy 5 seconds slower than the recent touring car leg did, and they're on slicks! so grip MUST be good.
only my opinion, of course, but tyres are the ONE area you don't wany to skimp!
(by the way, also sprinters and racers also race in the wet)
ask some more people / dealers etc and make your own mind up!
andyr
(isn't the the S03 based on the compound F1 Ferrari were using on wet tyres in 99-2000? they did ok)
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