Discussion
This is crazy. I've spent the last ten minutes writing my opinion on 'dano Ms Engine Rebuild Update' thread. Then have just read it again before submitting it and deleted it. Why? Because I'm scared. If too many of us complain on forums like this then we're just shooting ourselves in the foot come resale time.
Why not focus our efforts on Wheeler. Anyone who has/ has had a problem of any kind (no matter how large or small) with their Tuscan should write to Wheeler to complain.
Isolated complaints won't get a response. I know. I wrote to him 6 weeks ago and got fobbed of with his minions (Oxley), who merely said he'd look into it (then silence).
But if the volume of complaints rises then surely the
must have to pay some attention to his customers.
So, don't complain on Pistonheads abuse Wheeler instead.
Why not focus our efforts on Wheeler. Anyone who has/ has had a problem of any kind (no matter how large or small) with their Tuscan should write to Wheeler to complain.
Isolated complaints won't get a response. I know. I wrote to him 6 weeks ago and got fobbed of with his minions (Oxley), who merely said he'd look into it (then silence).
But if the volume of complaints rises then surely the
must have to pay some attention to his customers. So, don't complain on Pistonheads abuse Wheeler instead.
So, don't complain on Pistonheads abuse Wheeler instead.
mmm….. can just see the next Tuscan challenge race, sitting the paddock is one PW getting ready to race than a bunch of unhappy protesters waving placards gather round the car vocalising their dissatisfaction at the build quality/reliability of the cars. The man is then followed into the TVR hospitality tent in the paddock for a further ear bashing. Not sure that you are likely to get anywhere trying to bend PW’s ear either in writing or in person.
Thought of trying to book a meeting with Ben to express concerns etc.? might be more worth while and more constructive than a thread on these lines. This will likely degenerate into one of those I have this problem, well I have that problem, I’ve never had a problem – end result is another poor thread about TVR’s
Just a thought….
I don't think calls such as this are particularly condusive to achieving results and if anything just bring PH into disrepute with TVR.
I appreciate the concerns (I spend my life talking to TVR owners and own one myself) so am fully aware of the frustrations out there.
Constructive suggesions about what to do are welcome. Suggestions of personal abuse are not.
I appreciate the concerns (I spend my life talking to TVR owners and own one myself) so am fully aware of the frustrations out there.
Constructive suggesions about what to do are welcome. Suggestions of personal abuse are not.
Just a perspective.....
I met up with some old friends I hadn't met for about 10 years at the weekend. I went in my TVR and met them in the pub. As soon as they found out I had a TVR all the usual came out (first name terms with your dealer, blah, blah, blah). My point is that they didn't know which TVR I was driving or anything about it - their perception is that all TVRs are unreliable.
Now in here, we get into "debates" about Rover V8 cars being more reliable than a block of wood, and the TVR engined cars being the opposite. Have you popped into the BMW/Porsche forums ? I was surprised about the number of problems those guys come across. I guess the difference is that they tend to get fixed quicker.
The only complaint / protest that you can make is not to buy the cars. We do. That's it really - he's got you by the short and curleys.
I met up with some old friends I hadn't met for about 10 years at the weekend. I went in my TVR and met them in the pub. As soon as they found out I had a TVR all the usual came out (first name terms with your dealer, blah, blah, blah). My point is that they didn't know which TVR I was driving or anything about it - their perception is that all TVRs are unreliable.
Now in here, we get into "debates" about Rover V8 cars being more reliable than a block of wood, and the TVR engined cars being the opposite. Have you popped into the BMW/Porsche forums ? I was surprised about the number of problems those guys come across. I guess the difference is that they tend to get fixed quicker.
The only complaint / protest that you can make is not to buy the cars. We do. That's it really - he's got you by the short and curleys.
Not really gonna work though is it - it'll just piss off PW & drop the resale value of your car.
raceboy said: So has anyone wrote to WatchDog yet then
I think d_drinks idea is the best - you need a constructive dialogue rather than confrontation. If you can get enough of you all saying the same thing, something may come of it.
The strength of TVR is that PW does exactly as he sees fit & doesn't have to answer to anybody.
The weakness of TVR is that PW does exactly as he sees fit & doesn't have to answer to anybody.
I'm sure in PW's eyes, the Speed 6 engine is great, he's just let down by suppliers & dealers....
I side with Ted on this one - personal attacks solve
nothing and are childish.
TVR is a company (of employees) and not one individual.
To move the product forward to match Porsche / Ferrari
and others TVR really had to make their own engines to
obtain the driving chareristics that they wanted.
Anyone who has had the pleasure of driving a speed 6
engine in anger will know that the engine is actually
a very good match for a sports car of this weight.
The old Rover V8 and I love it .. really when we get down to it has the wrong kind of delivery. Great
for 0 ~ 60 times but lacking in other areas.
I'll be the first one here to say well done Peter &
his team.
It's a very brave and risky move.
Bloody whingers! If you don't want to buy the cars, then don't. You all know lots about TVR's and still buy them. Why not take TVR-critic's advice, and go buy something else.
Inciting people to abuse others does not help. Sort things out however you like through the correct channels.
I'm sick to death of people coming on here and moaning about TVR's, how crap and unreliable they are etc. etc. GO BUY SOMETHING ELSE!!!
Any more suggestions regarding personal abuse of TVR staff will result in closure of this thread, O.K.?
Inciting people to abuse others does not help. Sort things out however you like through the correct channels.
I'm sick to death of people coming on here and moaning about TVR's, how crap and unreliable they are etc. etc. GO BUY SOMETHING ELSE!!!
Any more suggestions regarding personal abuse of TVR staff will result in closure of this thread, O.K.?
TVR were featured on 'Watchdog' a few years ago when Anne Robinson was presenting the programme. A couple of irate owners complained about constant breakdowns and bits falling off. Ben Samuelson gave the usual 'small, handbuilt car company, etc etc' but Tiff Needell praised TVR for their value-for-money performance, etc, etc. Conclusion was that you get what you pay for.
raceboy said: So has anyone wrote to WatchDog yet then
I have a 328Ci which is coming up to 4 years old and 75000 miles. Last week the throttle cable went as I was on my way to work. Quick call to BMW Assistance, car was recovered in 15 minutes to my local dealer and a new cable was fitted within the hour. All under warranty. Normally I wouldn't compare anything TVR with BMW but Andy mentioned it and, yes, even BMWs go wrong occasionally but they have the back up and resources to deal with problems efficiently and professionaly, in my experience.
andyvdg said: Have you popped into the BMW/Porsche forums ? I was surprised about the number of problems those guys come across. I guess the difference is that they tend to get fixed quicker.
My TVR is almost 25 years old now, so is out of warranty
and I can't blame Peter for anything that goes wrong as he never owned the company back then. 
TVR-critic said: Any new car should offer the purchaser trouble free motoring for at least 60,000 miles, yes we can all forgive minor parts playing up, but engines! and any main component failures are just unacceptable in this day and age.
>> Edited by TVR-critic on Wednesday 21st May 14:49
How come a lot of F1 cars don't make it through a single race ?
But Colin isn't your chassis nearly 30 years old..sorry to let on.
Going back to the point. All motor manufacturers have issues some more commonly talked about than others. However customer service is the key, a marginal product can be made good with good support and likewise a good product made bad with poor support.
Often it is the approach of the purchasers to the supplier that causes a lot of the bad feeling, in my experience politeness is the key. Now don't get me wrong I'm not prejudging any of the posters in the this thread.
Just remember that things do go wrong, with a TVR you have purchased a brilliant pounds(£) vs performance machine, but is not built in the same way as equivalent performance cars that cost sometimes several times as much. If you are patient and approach things in a diplomatic manner, issues will get resolved.
Get all het up and resorting to personal abuse does nothing apart from wind you up (shortening your life with the stress induced) and make you look stupid.
Peter Wheeler has done some very brave things, he bought an ailing car company making about 140 cars a year, invested his own personal fortune in it and it took many years to turn it round. That he wants to do his own engine is the next logical step.
Most of you knew (potential) issues surrounding TVRs, so you bought with your eyes wide open, just because something doesn't go to plan or it costs you more, please don't resort to personal attacks.
I've had half a dozen TVRs over 12 years and if you treat them right, ie stay on top of all the maintenance and don't thrash them until they are thoroughly warmed up, they'll treat you right. I personally have had more issues (and bigger bills) with Volvo's and Audi's.
As Nubbins says, if TVRs aren't for you go and buy something else.
davidy
Going back to the point. All motor manufacturers have issues some more commonly talked about than others. However customer service is the key, a marginal product can be made good with good support and likewise a good product made bad with poor support.
Often it is the approach of the purchasers to the supplier that causes a lot of the bad feeling, in my experience politeness is the key. Now don't get me wrong I'm not prejudging any of the posters in the this thread.
Just remember that things do go wrong, with a TVR you have purchased a brilliant pounds(£) vs performance machine, but is not built in the same way as equivalent performance cars that cost sometimes several times as much. If you are patient and approach things in a diplomatic manner, issues will get resolved.
Get all het up and resorting to personal abuse does nothing apart from wind you up (shortening your life with the stress induced) and make you look stupid.
Peter Wheeler has done some very brave things, he bought an ailing car company making about 140 cars a year, invested his own personal fortune in it and it took many years to turn it round. That he wants to do his own engine is the next logical step.
Most of you knew (potential) issues surrounding TVRs, so you bought with your eyes wide open, just because something doesn't go to plan or it costs you more, please don't resort to personal attacks.
I've had half a dozen TVRs over 12 years and if you treat them right, ie stay on top of all the maintenance and don't thrash them until they are thoroughly warmed up, they'll treat you right. I personally have had more issues (and bigger bills) with Volvo's and Audi's.
As Nubbins says, if TVRs aren't for you go and buy something else.
davidy
Having lived a few hundred yards from the Edinburgh Porsche/Ferrari/Maserati dealer, I can vouch for that - all sorts of expensive cars with low mileage & big mechanical bills go in there - maybe their owners are less vocal because:
andyvdg said:Have you popped into the BMW/Porsche forums ? I was surprised about the number of problems those guys come across.
a)They have more money & it's not a big deal
b)They don't want to shout about unreliability in a car they spent lots of dosh on (I imagine that some TVR owners are in this boat too
) Plenty of TVR owners get excellent service as well, you know! TMS, Topcats, Racing Green, to mention just a few, have had recent high praise on these pages.
Some people can get very twisted, and end up generalising about TVR attitudes and service. My experience is that if you smile, talk properly, treat people with respect, and occassionally gently insist, you get what you want.
Some people can get very twisted, and end up generalising about TVR attitudes and service. My experience is that if you smile, talk properly, treat people with respect, and occassionally gently insist, you get what you want.
I'm sure a lot of it is down to the dealer.
Before I bought my Tuscan I discussed the history (fishy fingers etc) with my dealer. Apart from assuring me all problems were in the past
his view was that not everyone was well treated by thir dealer and that will have caused a lot of the antagonism in those cases. It's how people react when things go wrong that determine how we as consumers view them.
I had a new Jag XJS once. V badly built, went back to the dealer a number of times in the first year. The service was excellent, complimentary car (sometimes a better model than mine), car delivered / collected, valeted etc.. etc.. Because of that I tend to think warmly about my dealings with Jaguar although the product was not that great. Perhaps TVR's PR could be better?
Before I bought my Tuscan I discussed the history (fishy fingers etc) with my dealer. Apart from assuring me all problems were in the past
his view was that not everyone was well treated by thir dealer and that will have caused a lot of the antagonism in those cases. It's how people react when things go wrong that determine how we as consumers view them. I had a new Jag XJS once. V badly built, went back to the dealer a number of times in the first year. The service was excellent, complimentary car (sometimes a better model than mine), car delivered / collected, valeted etc.. etc.. Because of that I tend to think warmly about my dealings with Jaguar although the product was not that great. Perhaps TVR's PR could be better?
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