Help Facel Vega, Facel 2
Discussion
Facelvega said:
I also think that it's overpriced by a silly amount but it's great to see Facels finaly being valued closer to what I think they are worth. If you compare them to coach built Rolls Royces or Aston Martins, Facels still offer great value for money. Obviously though not at the £250,000 mark but in real world prices. The down side is the fact that now I may never be able to add a Facel 11 to my stable unless I sell a kidney? Maybe it's time to find a Facelia????????? or a Gordon Keeble, Bristol, Monteverdi????????
I do agree that it is good to see Facel prices getting more sensible.They are one of the most complex and difficult cars to restore,therefore there has been little incentive to carry out expensive restorations costing more than the cars were selling for.Now at least the quality of the restorations is better and the vicious circle is broken.justin-banks said:
This is my personal car, not for sale....well....maybe, I am a dealer after all!
I am reliably informed I will have it back after two years of resto in the next couple of weeks. Will upload some pics when I get it back. How is yours coming along?
Mine run fine, great handling since the Borrani restoration. I just completed 4000 miles since it's back on the road two years ago. You know, it's not an economical car.I am reliably informed I will have it back after two years of resto in the next couple of weeks. Will upload some pics when I get it back. How is yours coming along?
This weekend, we are going for our traditionnal rally in Poitou for Sport & Collection (http://www.sportetcollection.info), John are you in the place ?
Edited by d.wilde on Tuesday 31st May 16:04
d.wilde said:
Mine run fine, great handling since the Borrani restoration. I just completed 4000 miles since it's back on the road two years ago. You know, it's not an economical car.
This weekend, we are going for our traditionnal rally in Poitou for Sport & Collection (http://www.sportetcollection.info), John are you in the place ?
my daughter and I will be there with our bugatti's.you have my mobile number so we can meet up.This weekend, we are going for our traditionnal rally in Poitou for Sport & Collection (http://www.sportetcollection.info), John are you in the place ?
Edited by d.wilde on Tuesday 31st May 16:04
facelman said:
my daughter and I will be there with our bugatti's.you have my mobile number so we can meet up.
It was a very disapointing weekend at Le Vigeant.It seems that the organiser has upset everybody and there were very few nice cars.A couple of hundred Ferrari's and three replica bugatti's.The LR roadster D type replica and a similar c type made up for it.facelman said:
It was a very disapointing weekend at Le Vigeant.It seems that the organiser has upset everybody and there were very few nice cars.A couple of hundred Ferrari's and three replica bugatti's.The LR roadster D type replica and a similar c type made up for it.
Sorry to hear that, the red stuff is a plague.I saw some FVs (Excellence, HK500 and Facel II) in Belgium. Very nice too.
bosscerbera said:
Sorry to hear that, the red stuff is a plague.
I saw some FVs (Excellence, HK500 and Facel II) in Belgium. Very nice too.
The D type owner owns also some TVRs...V8's including a Vixen with a V8 fitted [or should I say shoehorned?]I saw some FVs (Excellence, HK500 and Facel II) in Belgium. Very nice too.
Edited by facelman on Tuesday 7th June 19:35
bosscerbera said:
Sorry to hear that, the red stuff is a plague.
Hi Boss 
Agreed, was disappointing - the 'racing' was also terrible, glorified Sunday driving for most of it.Just because it makes me look so cool, I'll sign off with my full real name...
Louise-Facellia (thanks Facelman)
x
20 pix here taken on the Three Castles Welsh Classic Trial early June.
Facel Vega HK500 - Three Castles 2011 - 01 by Rally Pix, on Flickr
Facel Vega HK500 - Three Castles 2011 - 02 by Rally Pix, on Flickr
Facel Vega HK500 - Three Castles 2011 - 01 by Rally Pix, on Flickr
Facel Vega HK500 - Three Castles 2011 - 02 by Rally Pix, on Flickr
d.wilde said:
It would be horrid to see that restored, recommission it and wasft around, marvellous, might raid the piggy bank!Should you consider buying or bidding for this car, might I point out a couple of anomalies in its description?
Firstly, this is not the second ever HK500. It may be the second right hand drive HK500, but I am reliably informed that it is the 47th HK500.
Secondly, the expiry of the MoT in 1982 and 'regularly used until 2000' don't quite match up unless 1) it was used illegally on the road for 18 years; 2) it was regularly used on private roads - which rather restricts its use or 3) it was used on foreign roads.
Firstly, this is not the second ever HK500. It may be the second right hand drive HK500, but I am reliably informed that it is the 47th HK500.
Secondly, the expiry of the MoT in 1982 and 'regularly used until 2000' don't quite match up unless 1) it was used illegally on the road for 18 years; 2) it was regularly used on private roads - which rather restricts its use or 3) it was used on foreign roads.
Thank you Bob for that. Perhaps this should be the offical Facel Forum now? That looks like a great car that I hope somebody buys it and gets it up and running as is, rather than restores it to as new. As some one who is coming to the end of a five year restoration of an HK500 please do not under estimate the amount of work and money that goes into doing one of these cars properly. Not only that but I have not seen an unrestored car on the road for many, many years! I would love it, but I'm just getting through the pain of the last one. My Silver car is currently at the trimmers so hopefully ready for Goodwood in September. Perhaps a few of us can meet up on the Friday at Goodwood?
Bob CD said:
Should you consider buying or bidding for this car, might I point out a couple of anomalies in its description?
Firstly, this is not the second ever HK500. It may be the second right hand drive HK500, but I am reliably informed that it is the 47th HK500.
Secondly, the expiry of the MoT in 1982 and 'regularly used until 2000' don't quite match up unless 1) it was used illegally on the road for 18 years; 2) it was regularly used on private roads - which rather restricts its use or 3) it was used on foreign roads.
Not wishing to be pedantic [!] the Bonhams brief for this car simply says that there is an old expired MOT with the lot.Which happens to be 1982,maybe they lost the other 17 MOT's ! Was this car not at Brooklands of Byfleet for some years? Maybe "tested" on trade plates for an extended period.Not an uncommon thing,my first T37 was "tested" on TP's for six years.Incidentally there is another error in Bonhams blurb,As you all know,the bodies of the V8 Facels are not "welded" to the tubular chassis,had they been then the doors might have fitted and closed better.[and stayed closed]Firstly, this is not the second ever HK500. It may be the second right hand drive HK500, but I am reliably informed that it is the 47th HK500.
Secondly, the expiry of the MoT in 1982 and 'regularly used until 2000' don't quite match up unless 1) it was used illegally on the road for 18 years; 2) it was regularly used on private roads - which rather restricts its use or 3) it was used on foreign roads.
Edited by facelman on Friday 17th June 16:06
facelman said:
Not wishing to be pedantic [!] the Bonhams brief for this car simply says that there is an old expired MOT with the lot.Which happens to be 1982,maybe they lost the other 17 MOT's ! Was this car not at Brooklands of Byfleet for some years? Maybe "tested" on trade plates for an extended period.Not an uncommon thing,my first T37 was "tested" on TP's for six years.Incidentally there is another error in Bonhams blurb,As you all know,the bodies of the V8 Facels are not "welded" to the tubular chassis,had they been then the doors might have fitted and closed better.[and stayed closed]
All very interesting stuff and I'd very much like to have it, however, I'd need to sell a 911 and an e-type in double quick time to be able to have it.Edited by facelman on Friday 17th June 16:06
Hi. I've been watching this thread from the beginning and it's great to have an active Facel forum in English! However, I'd also recommend the French thread on forum-auto.com to anyone who is interested in the marque.
I'd agree that nobody should enter into an HK500 restoration without really understanding what's involved. I thought my car (HK D2, above) could be back on the road in six months...that was 12 years ago!!
Now for the anorak bit...
The Bonhams car, HK F2 is the 47th HK as already mentioned but my guess is there are up to half a dozen RHD cars that preceeded it. I'm not even sure my car is the first RHD, although it was the original UK demonstrator, as I recall someone telling me there is an earlier one that is now in Germany. What I do know is that mine was bought as part of a batch of three RHD cars by Intercontinental Motors who held the UK franchise. I'm sure these all preceeded HK F2 (not that it really matters).
Does anyone know how many RHD HKs were produced and from a personal point of view, whether mine really was the first one? I'd love to know please!
The other thing I'd like to know is whether anyone can identify the man in the old picture of my car. I think it was taken in 1961 at Aintree and the person in question could be George Abecassis, the racing driver who owned Intercontinental Motors.
Finally, I agree it would be a shame to fully restore the Bonhams car as there really is something special about originality.
Thanks for an interesting read so far on this thread.
I'd agree that nobody should enter into an HK500 restoration without really understanding what's involved. I thought my car (HK D2, above) could be back on the road in six months...that was 12 years ago!!
Now for the anorak bit...
The Bonhams car, HK F2 is the 47th HK as already mentioned but my guess is there are up to half a dozen RHD cars that preceeded it. I'm not even sure my car is the first RHD, although it was the original UK demonstrator, as I recall someone telling me there is an earlier one that is now in Germany. What I do know is that mine was bought as part of a batch of three RHD cars by Intercontinental Motors who held the UK franchise. I'm sure these all preceeded HK F2 (not that it really matters).
Does anyone know how many RHD HKs were produced and from a personal point of view, whether mine really was the first one? I'd love to know please!
The other thing I'd like to know is whether anyone can identify the man in the old picture of my car. I think it was taken in 1961 at Aintree and the person in question could be George Abecassis, the racing driver who owned Intercontinental Motors.
Finally, I agree it would be a shame to fully restore the Bonhams car as there really is something special about originality.
Thanks for an interesting read so far on this thread.
OK, it's a wet day here in Sussex, so I thought I'd put on my anorak, let the lawn grow another inch, waste some time and see if I can clarify this HK500 thing...
Do we agree that Hans Ruhe's Register, published in 1990, is the bible when it comes to things Facel? (There are a lot of respected Facel people here who know a lot more than me, who have agreed that HKF2 is second RHD in line, and I'm very wary of contradicting them...)
But if we are to believe The Register, we have a little reconsidering to do. According to the Register/bible, the first right hand drive HK500 was HKC4 followed by C5, C9, D1, D2, D3, D4, D5 etc. So the car for sale, HKF2, isn't the second RHD but the 11th - easily confused when you write Facel 11. It is, however, the 47th overall, so that bit is correct. (There were another five conduit a droite produced after it).
So according to that list, theadman's D2 is therefore the fifth RHD in line.
Right, I've put my neck on the block, I'll go and exchange my anorak for a flak jacket (too many mixed metaphors?)
A vous messieurs.
Do we agree that Hans Ruhe's Register, published in 1990, is the bible when it comes to things Facel? (There are a lot of respected Facel people here who know a lot more than me, who have agreed that HKF2 is second RHD in line, and I'm very wary of contradicting them...)
But if we are to believe The Register, we have a little reconsidering to do. According to the Register/bible, the first right hand drive HK500 was HKC4 followed by C5, C9, D1, D2, D3, D4, D5 etc. So the car for sale, HKF2, isn't the second RHD but the 11th - easily confused when you write Facel 11. It is, however, the 47th overall, so that bit is correct. (There were another five conduit a droite produced after it).
So according to that list, theadman's D2 is therefore the fifth RHD in line.
Right, I've put my neck on the block, I'll go and exchange my anorak for a flak jacket (too many mixed metaphors?)
A vous messieurs.
theadman said:
The other thing I'd like to know is whether anyone can identify the man in the old picture of my car. I think it was taken in 1961 at Aintree and the person in question could be George Abecassis, the racing driver who owned Intercontinental Motors.
You could ask his son David Abecassis, see here: http://uk.linkedin.com/pub/david-abecassis/20/84a/...If it is George Abecassis, then the lady stood next to him will in all probability be Angela Abecassis (nee Brown, as in daughter of Sir David Brown one time owner of Aston Martin).
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