1969 Maserati Ghibli - The Resurection
Discussion
windy1 said:
I would have chosen a 2K primer to go under any 2K top coat product as it is likely there will be adhesion issues if the solvent hasn't completely evaporated (i.e. it will need to have been there a few months). Also if you've applied etch to bare steel before the primer make sure it is a proper 50 / 50 mixed in a pot acid type etch. Some of the 1K high build primers / etches never seem to go off. The other problem you will likely have a few months down the line is the 1K primers will sink into any repairs and they'll show up through the top coat. You don't seem to get this with 2K as once it is set it is set hard like araldite.
I've got a similar build thread going here with some pictures of the painting if you've got a couple of hours to spare of an evening
http://forum.wscc.co.uk/forum/index.php?/topic/451...
WindyI've got a similar build thread going here with some pictures of the painting if you've got a couple of hours to spare of an evening
http://forum.wscc.co.uk/forum/index.php?/topic/451...
Edited by windy1 on Thursday 13th December 17:37
All valid points so thanks, I was aware of the 'so called' pitfalls with cellulose base and modern top coats. I say 'so called' because they are actually entirely compatible if you get it right, its just a little bit more tricky. I have plenty of experience of sinking paint, its avoidance and rectification, having sprayed a good few GRP cars, now they really do try your patience!
Nice project by the way, I've got a bit of solid colour envy, I would have avoided a whole lot of pitfall if I'd gone down that route which was one of the options a while ago (really liking the original metallic green though)
MarkS3 said:
Fantastic work so far Chadspeed, I'm simply amazed at your metalwork skills and how you can do so much complex stuff youself at home. You're an inspiration! This thread is really keeping me hooked, I can't wait to check each day for the next instalment! One question I have is if you paint the bonnet, boot, doors etc. separately from the bodyshell, won't you have colour match problems? I'm sure you've thought of this and have a solution but I'm intrigued....
A good question. If it were a solid colour there would be no issue at all, being metallic there are a few things you have to observe. The colour will always be the same but the metallic effect can vary depending on gun pressure, gun distance and angle from the panel, and seemingly how wet you put it on. Dusting the last colour coat on dryish, perpendicular to the panel, at a consistent pressure and distance, should give even results. Therein lies the skill of the sprayer and some of what you pay him for I guess.
I mentioned a page or so ago that very little remedial work can be done with the water based colour coat before the clear coat goes on. Not even a wipe down with panel wipe it seems.
Ignore the dark patch, that's just where it's still wet. These streaks appeared as it dried from the panel wipe, so many more things to learn than I imagined. This area got a 3rd blow over.
Ignore the dark patch, that's just where it's still wet. These streaks appeared as it dried from the panel wipe, so many more things to learn than I imagined. This area got a 3rd blow over.
Well JCW your timing is uncanny. My routine has been to type up the post in my lunchtime at work then put it up on PH when I get home. Here is what I've just written:
Some may have guessed that the advent calendar idea of posting a picture a day was a nice way of leading up to fantastic photo's of the finished article on the 24th/25th. Well that was the plan and when I posted the first picture I was almost certain it was achievable, sadly that wont be the case. I've had further set backs, not related to the ones I've overcome so far or climatic conditions but I will carry on posting till Christmas as I said I would.
Having had a polite "hope we're going to see you over Christmas?" comment from the Lady of the house, I'm going to give it a rest for a few weeks.
Don't worry, the Diva will eventually get her sparkly new frock even if I have to flat it all off and pay a pro, which as I've always said I'm quite prepared to do to get the result the car deserves - but I'm not down and out just yet!
Some may have guessed that the advent calendar idea of posting a picture a day was a nice way of leading up to fantastic photo's of the finished article on the 24th/25th. Well that was the plan and when I posted the first picture I was almost certain it was achievable, sadly that wont be the case. I've had further set backs, not related to the ones I've overcome so far or climatic conditions but I will carry on posting till Christmas as I said I would.
Having had a polite "hope we're going to see you over Christmas?" comment from the Lady of the house, I'm going to give it a rest for a few weeks.
Don't worry, the Diva will eventually get her sparkly new frock even if I have to flat it all off and pay a pro, which as I've always said I'm quite prepared to do to get the result the car deserves - but I'm not down and out just yet!
Work Christmas party today so an early post.
The weather has begun to deteriorate so its down with the make-shift spray tent and we're now painting inside.
A colder ambient temperature means its easier to control temperature and humidity inside. Typically raising the temperature from 6 to 15 degrees C drops the relative humidity from 85 to 55. Anything less than an RH of 60 is OK but 50 would be better. The £20 temp/humidity meter works remarkably well and the fly zapper is also worthwhile, zapping a good few bugs when left on over night before a day of spraying.
The weather has begun to deteriorate so its down with the make-shift spray tent and we're now painting inside.
A colder ambient temperature means its easier to control temperature and humidity inside. Typically raising the temperature from 6 to 15 degrees C drops the relative humidity from 85 to 55. Anything less than an RH of 60 is OK but 50 would be better. The £20 temp/humidity meter works remarkably well and the fly zapper is also worthwhile, zapping a good few bugs when left on over night before a day of spraying.
FUBAR said:
Being practically neighbours Chad (well, same county lol), and my love of Maseratis (one day a Merak SS will be in my garage) I'd love to come see this in the flash sometime 
Hi Nick, closer than the same County me thinks 
.Our paths have crossed before if only briefly when your awesome AJP8 spanked us Speed 6 boys a few years back at a RR day. Think it made something like 440 bhp 
, best we could muster was about 395 bhp 
.PM me, welcome to swing by early in the new year.
Mr_B said:
Don't you find you kick-up lots of dust from the floor of that work space ? I'm not trying to sound like a smart-arse, but the first thing I did when even just working on my car was paint the floor, as even when cleaned, you still couldn't stop the fine dust from a concrete floor.
Again, please don't think I'm just being critical, just can't help think it must make things easier and a nicer place to work.
Hi Mr B, yes dust is always a problem I have some plastic backed dust sheets that were not yet put down in that shot. Due to modern planning rules the extended garage had to be built to the same standards as a habitable room which meant a screed floor - utter crumbly rubbish it is that cant be painted, tiles is perhaps the answer one day. When painting the body inside I tripped more than once on the dust sheets, easily done with the tight space and restricted vision from the mask, which caused less than ideal results. All part of the challenge of home spraying I guess.Again, please don't think I'm just being critical, just can't help think it must make things easier and a nicer place to work.
JNR77 said:
A friend of mine would pour a bucket of water on the floor of the garage to stop the dust when spaying in the garage.
I have heard of that but also heard of problems from the water evaporating and causing local high humidity.uk66fastback said:
Epoxy resin floor paint. Voila! No dust ...
I think that's the answer but have you seen the price of it? - perhaps in the next workshop.
Globs said:
Very nice!
How do you avoid overspray - or did you paint them somewhere else?
Doors and bonnet were sprayed all at the same time in that area, a single garage albeit a nice warm dry one. The bonnet is moveable on the wheeled tool chest (Air 2000 hostess trolley) so I did the doors first then wheeled the bonnet into place, no over-spray at all. Do you mean over-spray or the fine air borne particles you get when spraying?How do you avoid overspray - or did you paint them somewhere else?
Also, all mixing, cleaning, the compressors etc were in another area. I sprayed in this area only then got out quick and didn't go back to it for a couple of hours to reduce air movement.
Edited by Chad speed on Sunday 23 December 10:33
Happy Christmas one and all, not quite the big reveal I had in mind at the start of December but life with a classic Maserati rarely runs smoothly. So just a taste of what I have been able to achieve on the home spraying front, the doors, bonnet and boot are to the same standard, shame about some area's of the shell. I will detail soon what the problems are but for now were going to end advent on positives.
Nose cone after wet sanding, wool mop and light polish.
Massive thanks to those who have posted tips and encouragement over the last 8 months and especially the ones going down the same rocky road with classic Maserati, there are quite a few.
Join me and raise a virtual glass of your favourite tipple
- to all home classic car restorers and their patient and supportive partners who know it'll all be worth in the end - honest!
Nose cone after wet sanding, wool mop and light polish.
Massive thanks to those who have posted tips and encouragement over the last 8 months and especially the ones going down the same rocky road with classic Maserati, there are quite a few.
Join me and raise a virtual glass of your favourite tipple
- to all home classic car restorers and their patient and supportive partners who know it'll all be worth in the end - honest!neutral 3 said:
Looking good, congrats on the progress so far. What colour did you chose ?
You just recovering from a spectacular lunch or only got a B&W monitor? - its green 
Seriously though I assume you mean what shade, I went for the original colour Verdi Bosco 106-G-15 (see page 16), dark in some light, remarkably light in others.
Happy New Year folks, hope you had a good break.
I managed to stay out of the garage for a few days and feel all the better for it so I’m now back with renewed enthusiasm. You may recall final painting was going well and I was sure I’d reach my goal of getting all the painting done by the end of 2012. The final clear coats went on the shell, doors, bonnet etc by the end of the first week in December but a week later I made a disappointing and unexpected discovery. So what happened? Well, I began wet sanding the rear nearside corner to remove any unevenness in the clear coat by blocking off to 2500 grit before polishing. All was going well up to this point but as I began to bring the shine up on the now super flat surface I could see some unusual lighter coloured areas and where I had removed a couple of runs, although the surface was perfectly flat, a hazy impression of the run remained. The unusual thing was the affected area’s only became apparent when the surface had been polished and then only at certain angles and under specific light conditions. To say I was hacked off was an understatement - so near yet so far.
Having had a few weeks to assess the situation and diagnose what and how it all went wrong I now know its not a complete disaster but the area’s affected will need respraying. The problem is air entrainment in one or more of the clear coats, only visible when light reflects off the microscopic air bubbles trapped inside. When I first discovered it I had no idea what it was or how extensive. The only way to see how much of the car is affected is to wet sand and polish the whole car which is a bit of a grind, especially so if I then find its back to square 1 in that area. So far I can say the bonnet, doors, boot and all horizontal parts of the shell are ok but the front off side and rear nearside wings plus rear panel are not.
It’s become clear the root cause of the problem was lack of space in the garage and not being able to get the gun consistently at the right distance from the panel, it seems this was compounded by my reluctance to use thinners after previous problems using it. I was spraying the clear coat a bit too thick, ok on horizontal panels where the minute bubbles can float to the top and disappear, not so on vertical ones. So in a nutshell all the panels where I had enough space are excellent and I am happy with them and the current task is blocking off and polishing.
Flat and shiny but all is not what it seems, if I'd gone for solid instead of metallic I'd be home and dry by now.
Look at the lower corner at the front of the fuel filler recess. The drips gone but entrained air still there.
Front wing looks ok in this shot before sanding/polishing.
The whole of the wing is down to 2500 grit but the entrained air is now clearly visible.
Same affect on the rear panel.
We’re more or less up to date now so progress posts will be real time and a bit slower but I’ll keep you posted.
Here’s to plain sailing in 2013.
I managed to stay out of the garage for a few days and feel all the better for it so I’m now back with renewed enthusiasm. You may recall final painting was going well and I was sure I’d reach my goal of getting all the painting done by the end of 2012. The final clear coats went on the shell, doors, bonnet etc by the end of the first week in December but a week later I made a disappointing and unexpected discovery. So what happened? Well, I began wet sanding the rear nearside corner to remove any unevenness in the clear coat by blocking off to 2500 grit before polishing. All was going well up to this point but as I began to bring the shine up on the now super flat surface I could see some unusual lighter coloured areas and where I had removed a couple of runs, although the surface was perfectly flat, a hazy impression of the run remained. The unusual thing was the affected area’s only became apparent when the surface had been polished and then only at certain angles and under specific light conditions. To say I was hacked off was an understatement - so near yet so far.
Having had a few weeks to assess the situation and diagnose what and how it all went wrong I now know its not a complete disaster but the area’s affected will need respraying. The problem is air entrainment in one or more of the clear coats, only visible when light reflects off the microscopic air bubbles trapped inside. When I first discovered it I had no idea what it was or how extensive. The only way to see how much of the car is affected is to wet sand and polish the whole car which is a bit of a grind, especially so if I then find its back to square 1 in that area. So far I can say the bonnet, doors, boot and all horizontal parts of the shell are ok but the front off side and rear nearside wings plus rear panel are not.
It’s become clear the root cause of the problem was lack of space in the garage and not being able to get the gun consistently at the right distance from the panel, it seems this was compounded by my reluctance to use thinners after previous problems using it. I was spraying the clear coat a bit too thick, ok on horizontal panels where the minute bubbles can float to the top and disappear, not so on vertical ones. So in a nutshell all the panels where I had enough space are excellent and I am happy with them and the current task is blocking off and polishing.
Flat and shiny but all is not what it seems, if I'd gone for solid instead of metallic I'd be home and dry by now.
Look at the lower corner at the front of the fuel filler recess. The drips gone but entrained air still there.
Front wing looks ok in this shot before sanding/polishing.
The whole of the wing is down to 2500 grit but the entrained air is now clearly visible.
Same affect on the rear panel.
We’re more or less up to date now so progress posts will be real time and a bit slower but I’ll keep you posted.
Here’s to plain sailing in 2013.
Edited by Chad speed on Wednesday 2nd January 19:48
CoolC said:
Do you envisage having this on the road in 2013? Is that realistic?
I would love to get the Diva on the road this year but that's absolutely unrealistic, even 2014 would be a mighty achievement and would require a good few sacrifices. Apart from work and keeping the Tuscan and 968 in good fettle I play a sport 2-3 times a week and the Lady of the House works as well so we share most house chores, guess I'll have to be patient (as the Lady is with me )Hello peeps
Progress on the paint halted due to low temperatures in the garage but I did manage to get a test panel sprayed in etch and primer so when the weather turns I'll be able to practice a few things before returning to the body shell.
Through the wonders of PH I've made a good few friends also bitten by the Italian Classic bug and I have recently learnt there is yet another Ghibli being restored on the South East of good old Blighty. It's right hand drive and is undergoing a full restoration at a well known specialist, I expect it to be a top notch contender when finished. That's now 4 Ghibli under restoration in a 30 mile radius plus one other spares car about to land from overseas.
With the permission of the owners I'd like to throw in a few photo's of their projects as and when time allows.
Progress has been made in other areas, here's a couple of photo's of the fuel filler caps and the dry sump oil tank cap. Two points of interest:
1 - In true Maserati fashion the oil tank cap is clearly a fuel filler cap that's been popped in a lathe and the face recessed to accept the Agipoil badge.
2 - One of these caps is a replica made by 'Two Ghibli's' Mark, a fantastic piece of work.
The replica is the one closest to the camera in the top photo, once it gains a bit of shine through use or a light polish it will be indistinguishable.
Progress on the paint halted due to low temperatures in the garage but I did manage to get a test panel sprayed in etch and primer so when the weather turns I'll be able to practice a few things before returning to the body shell.
Through the wonders of PH I've made a good few friends also bitten by the Italian Classic bug and I have recently learnt there is yet another Ghibli being restored on the South East of good old Blighty. It's right hand drive and is undergoing a full restoration at a well known specialist, I expect it to be a top notch contender when finished. That's now 4 Ghibli under restoration in a 30 mile radius plus one other spares car about to land from overseas.
With the permission of the owners I'd like to throw in a few photo's of their projects as and when time allows.
Progress has been made in other areas, here's a couple of photo's of the fuel filler caps and the dry sump oil tank cap. Two points of interest:
1 - In true Maserati fashion the oil tank cap is clearly a fuel filler cap that's been popped in a lathe and the face recessed to accept the Agipoil badge.
2 - One of these caps is a replica made by 'Two Ghibli's' Mark, a fantastic piece of work.
The replica is the one closest to the camera in the top photo, once it gains a bit of shine through use or a light polish it will be indistinguishable.
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