The Tennis Thread
Discussion
amare32 said:
Horsey McHorseface said:
amare32 said:
Horsey McHorseface said:
Ostapenko hits faster forehands than the men's world #1
(women use lighter balls though)
Murray plays with a lot more variety than the other main guys on tour so his average is lower. Don't think for a minute Murray can't hit a big forehand. Murray hit one of the fastest shots on tour in 2011 at Cincinnati when he clubbed a forehand past Mardy Fish @ 124mph.
Ostapenko is a fabulous ball striker and plays 100% aggressive. Murray can serve 145mph and hit 100mph+ FHs should he choose to, he just hits lower for margin and safety. If you ever play tennis at a decent level, you want to add a bit of safety and margin in your rallies rather than go all out Ball bashing.
By slagging off Murray I'm guessing you're still stinging from teenager Murray's comments about England football team
I'm sure most ordinary people can't even win more than 2-3 points playing a set against Murray let alone dealing with his 'pushing'. That includes you and I.
If this thread is no more than fan factions having a pop at each other, count me out.
anonymous said:
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I know what you mean but none of the top players apart from maybe Federer and Wawrinka flatten their forehands. Murray has to hit the ball softer because a combination of his frame, strings, tension, grip and swing doesn't allow the margin for error with pace like other players. The faster surfaces definitely favour Murray so hopefully Wimbledon will be good for him.
I'm not saying Murray can't flatten out his forehand. I think all the top players are able to do pretty much anything including playing with their wrong hand but Murray certainly has more difficulty hitting big forehands than some of the other players. When Lendl came on the team initially it was one of the things they worked on - lots of killer forehand drills.
Djokovic had similar issues, in 2014 he changed from full poly to gut/poly and dropped the tension 3lbs even though he was winning slams he knew a bigger forehand could give him another edge. Murray still strings around 62lb; for comparison Djokovic 56, Nadal 55 and Federer 48/50. All those players have a much faster swing speed with a more powerful string equates to a bigger forehand. Stan who has groundstrokes like a canon strings at 61lbs.
I'm pretty sure Murray realises this but his game is based around consistency and variety so it is what it is. His backhand makes up for it often though, that is his real weapon.
Djokovic had similar issues, in 2014 he changed from full poly to gut/poly and dropped the tension 3lbs even though he was winning slams he knew a bigger forehand could give him another edge. Murray still strings around 62lb; for comparison Djokovic 56, Nadal 55 and Federer 48/50. All those players have a much faster swing speed with a more powerful string equates to a bigger forehand. Stan who has groundstrokes like a canon strings at 61lbs.
I'm pretty sure Murray realises this but his game is based around consistency and variety so it is what it is. His backhand makes up for it often though, that is his real weapon.
The setup of Murray's raquet does make sense as there is just no way he is weaker than Djokovic who can and does generate more pop on his unleashed forehand. Federer just has a very natural and loose backhand and forehand and Nadal generates so much topspin he can hammer it to death and keep it in. I don't think Murray's grip and hand positioning is an issue as at times his power can be staggering when he opens his shoulders and he switches from topspin to flat quite comfortably, but I'm a bit surprised bearing in mind what a perfectionist he is, that he's not been able to perfect and rely on his full fat forehand far more....especially at this stage of his career with a bit of pressure off.
Easy to say I guess but he's not going to equal Fed, Nadal or Djokovic in terms of GS so aside from Wawrinka (sort of close in GS) he's on his own level of achievement when you look at their whole careers to date.
Murray's game in my opinion is not one of a pusher he just reels in his shots as others have said by 10-15% to give him margin as he knows most of the time he can defend well enough to gain himself plenty of chances to break....but when he has one,two or three chances to finish a point bouncing at a nice height with no work on it and a metre inside the base line, it pisses me off when he then lays a not so great short ball and gets picked off....and his bloody first serve of course although when it does go in is better than it was.
I love watching highlights of Murrays games on repeat but live its torture....FFS Murray is usually shouted at the tv once or twice a set in my house. When it comes to drama though and entertainment he delivers virtually every time and I'll miss watching and supporting him massively when he hangs up the raquet...so I should probably stop moaning about his forehand and serve reliability and sort out my own
Easy to say I guess but he's not going to equal Fed, Nadal or Djokovic in terms of GS so aside from Wawrinka (sort of close in GS) he's on his own level of achievement when you look at their whole careers to date.
Murray's game in my opinion is not one of a pusher he just reels in his shots as others have said by 10-15% to give him margin as he knows most of the time he can defend well enough to gain himself plenty of chances to break....but when he has one,two or three chances to finish a point bouncing at a nice height with no work on it and a metre inside the base line, it pisses me off when he then lays a not so great short ball and gets picked off....and his bloody first serve of course although when it does go in is better than it was.
I love watching highlights of Murrays games on repeat but live its torture....FFS Murray is usually shouted at the tv once or twice a set in my house. When it comes to drama though and entertainment he delivers virtually every time and I'll miss watching and supporting him massively when he hangs up the raquet...so I should probably stop moaning about his forehand and serve reliability and sort out my own
anonymous said:
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Yes agree with that, it is only selected agression required, he's so mentally wired for defence that it seems he has to really think his aggression which makes it an unatural shot and you always hit or in that respect play better in any sport off instinct.Maybe the only way for him get comfortable is to introduce the aggression early in competition as you say, he's done it before to a degree with good effect but then switches back. When Lendl arrived the first time yes he did play more offensively and it worked, but on return from back surgery he crept back to old ways a bit.
I heard that in practice he goes for shots a lot, especially straight winners off second serves, so you do wonder why he doesn't employ the offensive play in a couple of more minor competitions to see how he gets on and to acclimatise to that way of play.
The other problem I see is that players know to beat Murray you need one game plan and thats to dictate play and hit winners or drop shots which makes there preparation easier...he then becomes over passive and his defensive game becomes somewhat redundant. Usually the other player misses a few and Murray works out he needs to be more offensive and he wins through but it doesn't always work against the very best and surely after the Stan match he must realise that again. His defence most of the time was as good as I've seen anyone play against Stan in the first four sets and it still wasn't enough even if he was playing below his best game.
anonymous said:
[redacted]
Perhaps not as much as that but are you saying that sportsman like him should be allowed to do this and be let off with just a minor slap on the wrist?He is not setting a very good example to young players. Other players like Sharapova should have been banned longer after testing positive for meldonium.
I can see Fed being there or there abouts this year, Rafa its possible but Its not his best surface obviously, Djokovic could make inroads but I don't think he's done the miles this year to win it. Wawrinka I think will be out mid tournament. Cilic and lopez playing well and have an outside chance, Cilic I feel has to get lucky to win it and by that I mean not meeting one of the big five including wawrinka. Zverev and Dimitrov...no.
The draw is going to be particularly important this year...Its definately more open than it has been for some while, I'm expecting Murray to turn it on though and be there at the end but whether he will win it will depend on his early rounds and if he gets there, his final opponent, I don't know I just feel he has a shot over 5 sets, even if queens was a car crash.
The draw is going to be particularly important this year...Its definately more open than it has been for some while, I'm expecting Murray to turn it on though and be there at the end but whether he will win it will depend on his early rounds and if he gets there, his final opponent, I don't know I just feel he has a shot over 5 sets, even if queens was a car crash.
From what I've heard its all surrounding his book and questions he was asked about best female player ever, of which he said no question Serena is the best but she could not be considered the best tennis player of all time if you then bring the men into the mix. In his opinion she would be ranked around 700 or words to that effect.
Serena didn't take his honest opinion very well and signed off her tweet good day sir. His comment of boys playing against girls was to settle the argument...basically lets see just how good she is against everyone.
She's built like a guy so I think she has a physical advantage over most female players anyway...not that I deny how good she is.
Serena didn't take his honest opinion very well and signed off her tweet good day sir. His comment of boys playing against girls was to settle the argument...basically lets see just how good she is against everyone.
She's built like a guy so I think she has a physical advantage over most female players anyway...not that I deny how good she is.
Bit gutted for Heather today, losing her semi-final, but it was great watching her this week as she's hit some good form which will hopefully lead to a good Wimbledon and it's good to see her enjoying herself too based on the interviews she's given
Also gutted for Konta too - looks like her back injury, from that nasty fall in her quarter final, could mean she's a doubt for Wimbledon
Also gutted for Konta too - looks like her back injury, from that nasty fall in her quarter final, could mean she's a doubt for Wimbledon
Edited by AlexRS2782 on Friday 30th June 23:25
Exactly - Laura's only 23 - she's got quite a few years ahead of her yet and time to get back to her pre wrist injury form.
It's also worth noting that a few weeks ago Laura had a decent run in the ladies doubles at Nottingham, alongside another talented Brit Jocelyn Rae, and they got to the final. So I don't think it's fair to write her off.
On the ladies side, Jo, Heather & Naomi are all in action later this afternoon / evening as they appear to be the last scheduled games on their respective courts. Hoping for some positive results there.
Pretty good wide spread coverage from Wimbledon this year via the BBC. Loads of different matches / streams to flick through spread between BBC1 & 2, 6 more streams on the red button and others via the website.
Edit - Murray through and playing Dustin Brown next - that should be a good match to watch.
It's also worth noting that a few weeks ago Laura had a decent run in the ladies doubles at Nottingham, alongside another talented Brit Jocelyn Rae, and they got to the final. So I don't think it's fair to write her off.
On the ladies side, Jo, Heather & Naomi are all in action later this afternoon / evening as they appear to be the last scheduled games on their respective courts. Hoping for some positive results there.
Pretty good wide spread coverage from Wimbledon this year via the BBC. Loads of different matches / streams to flick through spread between BBC1 & 2, 6 more streams on the red button and others via the website.
Edit - Murray through and playing Dustin Brown next - that should be a good match to watch.
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