Rio 2016 Paralympic Games
Discussion
Trabi601 said:
FlyingMeeces said:
Sarah Storey absolutely obliterated that. Outstanding.
I remain to be convinced that she should be competing. She is proof that, in many sports and categories at the paralympics, it's a competition to find the least disabled competitor.Storey effectively has one working hand - the other, small and without fingers, can bear weight on the handlebar but not grip or manipulate anything. Cyclists on road and track rely heavily on both of their arms being in full working order - particularly but not only both when climbing and sprinting. It can't be argued not to have an effect on her riding and indeed while she rides with a nondisabled team, she doesn't and cannot win stuff - she can't outclimb or outsprint someone with two working hands, for all that her legs clearly do a considerably better job than even the majority of nondisabled professional cyclists. As such seems fair she gets a Paralympic spot and once every 4 years is the best of her ilk, for a bit longer at least - the passing of time doesn't seem to have done anything bad to her yet!
Keep you eyes on Karen Dark, her bike this year is something else.....
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/paralympic-sport/2016/0...
I did ask to be called legend rather than expert!!!!!
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/paralympic-sport/2016/0...
I did ask to be called legend rather than expert!!!!!
Edited by IN51GHT on Friday 9th September 08:28
As a British non-disabled champion and record holder, I still say it's very marginal that she should be competing. At the 2012 games it was obvious from the start of every race that she was nowhere near as impaired as her competitors. It was almost embarrassingly mis-matched at times.
You really can't draw a comparison with able bodied events - yes, it's a test to find out who has the best physique for their chosen sport, but the paralymic categories do very often pitch people with relatively minor disabilities against those who have a fairly severe impairment.
I love watching the paralympics, just wish it was a more level playing field, but admit it's bloody hard to work out equivalencies!
You really can't draw a comparison with able bodied events - yes, it's a test to find out who has the best physique for their chosen sport, but the paralymic categories do very often pitch people with relatively minor disabilities against those who have a fairly severe impairment.
I love watching the paralympics, just wish it was a more level playing field, but admit it's bloody hard to work out equivalencies!
Trabi601 said:
As a British non-disabled champion and record holder, I still say it's very marginal that she should be competing. At the 2012 games it was obvious from the start of every race that she was nowhere near as impaired as her competitors. It was almost embarrassingly mis-matched at times.
You really can't draw a comparison with able bodied events - yes, it's a test to find out who has the best physique for their chosen sport, but the paralymic categories do very often pitch people with relatively minor disabilities against those who have a fairly severe impairment.
I love watching the paralympics, just wish it was a more level playing field, but admit it's bloody hard to work out equivalencies!
As a roadie she's never been British non-disabled champion, closest she got is third in ITT. Did take a track pursuit jersey in 2008 - before the crop of really world-class nondisabled riders came through, although if she ever sees this I hope she takes it in the spirit I intend it. She couldn't win it now - as in, even at her absolute peak as a track rider, she would never win against the current crop. She's never held a non-Paralympic record.You really can't draw a comparison with able bodied events - yes, it's a test to find out who has the best physique for their chosen sport, but the paralymic categories do very often pitch people with relatively minor disabilities against those who have a fairly severe impairment.
I love watching the paralympics, just wish it was a more level playing field, but admit it's bloody hard to work out equivalencies!
I have really mixed feelings too about events like C1-C3 all together - but that's a pretty limited effect of the decision to lump classifications together (and, generally then apply some sort of time weighting to even it out) rather than drop some events totally. It really doesn't happen much - all the track and field classifications and all the swimming ones are really well delineated with fairly minor steps up from one classification to the next (compare eg T35 and T36 hundred metre runners), doping-by-classification-fiddle notwithstanding. (Grrr b
ds.) The swimming classification can look reeeeally squiffy until you realise that they're literally applying some sort of biomechanical formula that lets them see that moderate-severe cerebral palsy has about the same effect on your speed as amputation of 3 and a half limbs or partial paralysis of 4 limbs etc etc.
Boccia can be interestingly weird because alongside three fairly straightforward impairment groupings there's a catch-all classification for everyone that can't lob a ball halfway up a badminton court (they use a chute/ramp to roll it instead) and so the diversity of players can be really huge.
I know wiki isn't the font of all knowledge, however:
"Storey also competes against non-disabled athletes and won the 3 km national track pursuit championship in 2008, eight days after taking the Paralympic title,[49] and defended her title in 2009.[50] In 2014 she added a third national track title with a win in the points race.[51]"
"Storey attempted to break the world hour record at the Lee Valley VeloPark in London on 28 February 2015. She set a distance of 45.502 km, which was 563m short of Leontien Zijlaard-van Moorsel's 2003 overall world record – however Storey's distance did set a new world record in the C5 Paralympic cycling class as well as a new British record.[62]"
Now, given the restriction on 'pilot' cyclists in the visually impaired events (can't have been active in pro-cycling for 2 years, I recall) - how does this level with the above?
"Storey also competes against non-disabled athletes and won the 3 km national track pursuit championship in 2008, eight days after taking the Paralympic title,[49] and defended her title in 2009.[50] In 2014 she added a third national track title with a win in the points race.[51]"
"Storey attempted to break the world hour record at the Lee Valley VeloPark in London on 28 February 2015. She set a distance of 45.502 km, which was 563m short of Leontien Zijlaard-van Moorsel's 2003 overall world record – however Storey's distance did set a new world record in the C5 Paralympic cycling class as well as a new British record.[62]"
Now, given the restriction on 'pilot' cyclists in the visually impaired events (can't have been active in pro-cycling for 2 years, I recall) - how does this level with the above?
Trabi601 said:
I know wiki isn't the font of all knowledge, however:
"Storey also competes against non-disabled athletes and won the 3 km national track pursuit championship in 2008, eight days after taking the Paralympic title,[49] and defended her title in 2009.[50] In 2014 she added a third national track title with a win in the points race.[51]"
"Storey attempted to break the world hour record at the Lee Valley VeloPark in London on 28 February 2015. She set a distance of 45.502 km, which was 563m short of Leontien Zijlaard-van Moorsel's 2003 overall world record – however Storey's distance did set a new world record in the C5 Paralympic cycling class as well as a new British record.[62]"
Now, given the restriction on 'pilot' cyclists in the visually impaired events (can't have been active in pro-cycling for 2 years, I recall) - how does this level with the above?
Oo, I withdraw my comment about not winning stuff nowadays then - genuinely impressed by that. "Storey also competes against non-disabled athletes and won the 3 km national track pursuit championship in 2008, eight days after taking the Paralympic title,[49] and defended her title in 2009.[50] In 2014 she added a third national track title with a win in the points race.[51]"
"Storey attempted to break the world hour record at the Lee Valley VeloPark in London on 28 February 2015. She set a distance of 45.502 km, which was 563m short of Leontien Zijlaard-van Moorsel's 2003 overall world record – however Storey's distance did set a new world record in the C5 Paralympic cycling class as well as a new British record.[62]"
Now, given the restriction on 'pilot' cyclists in the visually impaired events (can't have been active in pro-cycling for 2 years, I recall) - how does this level with the above?
British record for the hour is because almost nobody bothers - I gather from Michael Hutchinson's (hilarious) book that sorting it all out with the UCI is a weapons-grade ballache - were I capable of sitting on a bike and coordinating the required bumf I'm fairly sure I could have spent a respectable period as British record-holder before Dame Sarah got around to her go.
Not sure how the pilot thing compares as they specifically need to be contributing eyes and not really legs to proceedings, stops everyone from just offering Wiggo et al a wodge of cash to pilot for them, which is obviously really different from what a not-very-impaired Paralympian might get up to on the most-of-every-year that there's no paracycling, and very few credible C5 opponents to compete against. Similar thing with running guides and whatever the hell they're going to be doing for the swim bit of the triathlon - guess professional head-dobbers like they use in the pool probably wouldn't cut it.
(Okay, probably not literally Wiggo, can't see that line of work suiting him…)
I find the tandem track cycling incredible to watch. When I was at uni I used to help with a cycling club for visually impaired cyclists, I would pilot a tandem and we'd go out all over Leicestershire. Tandems are "interesting" to steer at the best of times, even more so trying to negotiate traffic lights, junction etc. with someone that can't see what's going on. I only dropped the bike once- the guy on the back was about 3 stone heavier than me, he was daydreaming and missed me shouting that we were coming up to a junction, I physically couldn't hold the bike up and we clattered to the floor in a heap, he was cool about it though 
I can't imagine trying to pilot one round a track at those speeds, would be terrifying!
I can't imagine trying to pilot one round a track at those speeds, would be terrifying!
cranford10 said:
Sorry but this leaves me cold. Whilst I don't doubt the commitment of the competitors, I have no interest in whether our dwarf can swim faster than yours.
Cranford10, sometimes thoughts/opinions are best left to ones self. Your crass and ultimately shameful comment being one of those times!This Totally!! Troll Off!!
Today was phenomenal… Kindred and Simmonds taking gold within minutes of each other, Aled Jones and whatshername his female equivalent with I think silver too.
Only wish I could spend more time watching, know I'm missing so much.
Rotten luck for the GB boccia squads - all 3 teams came away without a medal, the BC4 pair got damned close in the bronze medal match tho, coming 4th with a 3-2 loss must be maddening. Hopefully it'll go a bit better in the individual events, David Smith and Stephen McGuire must be a fair bet for medals.
Only wish I could spend more time watching, know I'm missing so much.
Rotten luck for the GB boccia squads - all 3 teams came away without a medal, the BC4 pair got damned close in the bronze medal match tho, coming 4th with a 3-2 loss must be maddening. Hopefully it'll go a bit better in the individual events, David Smith and Stephen McGuire must be a fair bet for medals.
I know we're all Team GB, but I love this ...
The Independent said:
A disabled middle-distance runner shattered the 1500m world record after winning gold at the Rio Paralympic Games, beating Olympic champion Matthew Centrowitz by more than 1.7 seconds.
Abdellatif Baka of Algeria won the T13 1500m final on Monday night in a stunning performance that not only set a new Paralympic world record, but stands as the fastest 1500m time ever recorded by an able-bodied or disabled athlete.
...
The feat was made all the more stunning given the fact that the second, third and fourth-placed finishers all recorded times faster than Centrowicz, meaning that four Paralympic athletes had run times fast enough to win gold had they competed in the Olympic Games.
Abdellatif Baka of Algeria won the T13 1500m final on Monday night in a stunning performance that not only set a new Paralympic world record, but stands as the fastest 1500m time ever recorded by an able-bodied or disabled athlete.
...
The feat was made all the more stunning given the fact that the second, third and fourth-placed finishers all recorded times faster than Centrowicz, meaning that four Paralympic athletes had run times fast enough to win gold had they competed in the Olympic Games.
bigandclever said:
I know we're all Team GB, but I love this ...
Fantastic race but some really dodgy reporting there, the T13 winning time was about 23 seconds off overall world record pace. Also the 1500m at the Olympics was a very slow tactical race so the time is kind of irrelevant (winning time 3:50, I was an ok middle distance runner in my late teens and did a 3:54, but I was nowhere near international standard). Not to take anything away from the performance of the Paralympians, but the way they have reported it there is very misleading.The Independent said:
A disabled middle-distance runner shattered the 1500m world record after winning gold at the Rio Paralympic Games, beating Olympic champion Matthew Centrowitz by more than 1.7 seconds.
Abdellatif Baka of Algeria won the T13 1500m final on Monday night in a stunning performance that not only set a new Paralympic world record, but stands as the fastest 1500m time ever recorded by an able-bodied or disabled athlete.
...
The feat was made all the more stunning given the fact that the second, third and fourth-placed finishers all recorded times faster than Centrowicz, meaning that four Paralympic athletes had run times fast enough to win gold had they competed in the Olympic Games.
Abdellatif Baka of Algeria won the T13 1500m final on Monday night in a stunning performance that not only set a new Paralympic world record, but stands as the fastest 1500m time ever recorded by an able-bodied or disabled athlete.
...
The feat was made all the more stunning given the fact that the second, third and fourth-placed finishers all recorded times faster than Centrowicz, meaning that four Paralympic athletes had run times fast enough to win gold had they competed in the Olympic Games.
Just been doing some reading about the visual impairment classifications. I wear a pretty hefty prescription for short sightedness, and without my glasses I'd be eligible to run in the T13 classification (obviously my sight can be corrected so I can't) but no wonder I used to get so upset when teacher at school made me play rugby etc. with no glasses on. I effectively had the vision of someone that would be legally blind.
Edited by lufbramatt on Tuesday 13th September 11:56
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