The **BOXING** thread Vol 2
Discussion
Yiliterate said:
tuscaneer said:
by the way......
for those of you that want to see the full stallone auction catalogue....
http://www.ha.com/
C'mon mate, you've just got to get yourself involved in that!!! There is so much brilliant stuff in there!!!for those of you that want to see the full stallone auction catalogue....
http://www.ha.com/
lord trumpton said:
If I were Froch I'd be thinking that I would lose against GGG and unless the money was life changing then I wouldn't risk the harm to my legacy
Froch went into the super six (all those years ago) a big underdog, he's never ducked anyone and possibly had the hardest run of scraps of any British boxer, I doubt the fear of loosing is a big thing for him, I think he'd be more bothered about being labeled as taking easy bouts... I do have a bit of a man crush on him though, he can't do much wrong in my eyes ;-) just imagine he does do golovkin, where does that put him? (no reason he can't, he's bigger more experienced on the big stage and has some of the best coaching and help in boxing)FredClogs said:
lord trumpton said:
If I were Froch I'd be thinking that I would lose against GGG and unless the money was life changing then I wouldn't risk the harm to my legacy
Froch went into the super six (all those years ago) a big underdog, he's never ducked anyone and possibly had the hardest run of scraps of any British boxer, I doubt the fear of loosing is a big thing for him, I think he'd be more bothered about being labeled as taking easy bouts... I do have a bit of a man crush on him though, he can't do much wrong in my eyes ;-) just imagine he does do golovkin, where does that put him? (no reason he can't, he's bigger more experienced on the big stage and has some of the best coaching and help in boxing)
lord trumpton said:
If I were Froch I'd be thinking that I would lose against GGG and unless the money was life changing then I wouldn't risk the harm to my legacy
I would have thought that the money for such a fight would certainly end up being 'life changing.' - every month that goes by would make such a fight less likely though. FredClogs said:
lord trumpton said:
If I were Froch I'd be thinking that I would lose against GGG and unless the money was life changing then I wouldn't risk the harm to my legacy
Froch went into the super six (all those years ago) a big underdog, he's never ducked anyone and possibly had the hardest run of scraps of any British boxer, I doubt the fear of loosing is a big thing for him, I think he'd be more bothered about being labeled as taking easy bouts... I do have a bit of a man crush on him though, he can't do much wrong in my eyes ;-) just imagine he does do golovkin, where does that put him? (no reason he can't, he's bigger more experienced on the big stage and has some of the best coaching and help in boxing)Edited by Yiliterate on Tuesday 10th November 08:40
Yes I remeber being puzzled at that Eubanks/Thompson fight as Eubanks had Thompson down twice & never followed it up like he used to against other opponenets ?
Re Froch/ Eubanks analogy, I think thompson is no wher near as dangerous as GGG & TBH Kovalev for Froch or Ward would be suicide IMO.
Re Froch/ Eubanks analogy, I think thompson is no wher near as dangerous as GGG & TBH Kovalev for Froch or Ward would be suicide IMO.
Gerradi said:
Yes I remeber being puzzled at that Eubanks/Thompson fight as Eubanks had Thompson down twice & never followed it up like he used to against other opponenets ?
Re Froch/ Eubanks analogy, I think thompson is no wher near as dangerous as GGG & TBH Kovalev for Froch or Ward would be suicide IMO.
Thompson wasn't anywhere near the fighter that Golovkin is, but Eubank was stepping up two divisions from Super-Middleweight (i.e. from 168lbs to 200lbs....which is a hell of a difference) to take on a natural Cruiserweight who was always described as being 'teak-tough' (as David Haye later found to his cost). Whereas it would be Golovkin stepping up in weight, and he isn't exactly a huge Middleweight either...though clearly that's not to say the fight isn't without it's danger for Froch. But the point I was trying to make - in reference to the concern raised that Froch could damage his legacy if he fought Golovkin - was that even though Eubank was stopped by Thompson, it didn't harm his standing or reputation in the slightest...indeed, it actually enhanced it as the boxing public appreciated the guts and bravery he showed that night.Re Froch/ Eubanks analogy, I think thompson is no wher near as dangerous as GGG & TBH Kovalev for Froch or Ward would be suicide IMO.
Reading the short bit on the BBC it sounds like Froch is specifically targeting DeGale, this does make sense for him, De Gale vs Groves 2 is now a lot less attractive as Groves brings very little since his loss and apparent crisis in confidence, and although they're not the same year group De Gale and Froch is a good sort of "passing of the baton between the generations" type bout, I'd certainly like to see it. You have to say should De Gale get and win against Badou Jack (I've no doubt he'll beat Bute next week or whenever it is) then he'll be in quite a good position to start chuntering about being the best British super middle of the era, something that's undoubtedly not true and would wind up Froch if he truly doesn't feel "retired". It's been said before (on this page probably) but with the prospect of Martin Murray and Callum Smith as well there are umpteen great bouts to be made in Britain at super middle - Tournament!!!
FredClogs said:
Reading the short bit on the BBC it sounds like Froch is specifically targeting DeGale, this does make sense for him, De Gale vs Groves 2 is now a lot less attractive as Groves brings very little since his loss and apparent crisis in confidence, and although they're not the same year group De Gale and Froch is a good sort of "passing of the baton between the generations" type bout, I'd certainly like to see it. You have to say should De Gale get and win against Badou Jack (I've no doubt he'll beat Bute next week or whenever it is) then he'll be in quite a good position to start chuntering about being the best British super middle of the era, something that's undoubtedly not true and would wind up Froch if he truly doesn't feel "retired". It's been said before (on this page probably) but with the prospect of Martin Murray and Callum Smith as well there are umpteen great bouts to be made in Britain at super middle - Tournament!!!
just seen that myself and was coming here to post the article. looks like my spidey senses were on target when i was musing that degale would be the most likely target for a comeback bout.i actually want to see it the more i think about it.
couldn't possibly tell you where as it was a top secret underground mission but when i met carl "somewhere" recently he was still in tip top shape. when i put my hand on his back for the obligatory photo it felt like f
king warm marble.tuscaneer said:
when i put my hand on his back for the obligatory photo it felt like fking warm marble.
Oooh matron, behave king warm marble.
It does make you wonder how "retired" he can be if he's keeping in that shape, it used to take Ricky Hatton about 48 hours after a fight to be looking like Bobbie Ball again.
Yes i know Thompson was not in the dame league as GGG, I remember watching the fight, I thought Eubanks would win...as for Haye, he lost the fight Thompson did not win it, he was out classing Thompson all the way through & he got careless( arrogant) & the Cat pounced!
Tuscaneer: ref: Holmes rated 8th. he should be higher than Foreman if its boxing skills imo, I remeber watching the Holmes/Carl Williams fight, Williams outboxed Holmes, which takes some doing but Holmes caught up with him in the last two rounds, I agree that Holmes is /was very underated.
Tuscaneer: ref: Holmes rated 8th. he should be higher than Foreman if its boxing skills imo, I remeber watching the Holmes/Carl Williams fight, Williams outboxed Holmes, which takes some doing but Holmes caught up with him in the last two rounds, I agree that Holmes is /was very underated.
Gerradi said:
Yes i know Thompson was not in the dame league as GGG, I remember watching the fight, I thought Eubanks would win...as for Haye, he lost the fight Thompson did not win it, he was out classing Thompson all the way through & he got careless( arrogant) & the Cat pounced!
Again, I'm really not sure you've caught my drift. I'm not trying to assess the relative merits of Carl Thompson and Gennady Golovkin. The reference to the David Haye fight was to back up the assertion that Thompson was a genuine tough-as-old-boots Cruiserweight...whether Haye outclassed him or not is irrelevant; the point is Haye threw everything he could at Thompson (and Haye certainly wasn't what you would call feather-fisted) and yet Thompson took it all and, when Haye had exhausted himself, put him away.My point simply was this; (leave aside the DeGale rumours for a second) Froch appears to be considering coming out of retirement for one more mammoth challenge - taking on the highly skilled, renowned KO artist, GGG. Similarly, Eubank came out of retirement for one more mammoth challenge - stepping up two weight divisions to take on hard-as-nails Cruiserweight champion Carl Thompson. Though ultimately it didn't end well for Eubank, being stopped for the first time in their second fight, him going out on his shield like that enhanced his reputation rather than detracted from it. Similarly, if Froch were to lose to Golovkin, even if he were to be stopped for the first time on his career, it wouldn't necessarily damage his legacy.
Indeed, from the legacy perspective, I actually see both more downside risk and less upside reward in taking the DeGale fight. Leave aside the legacy to his bank balance, if he were to win, it doesn't really add much more to a CV that already lists the like of Pascal, Taylor, Dirrell, Abraham, Bute and Kessler as victims, as well as a big KO win over another 'domestic upstart' (location and attendance tbc). Whereas lose and it brings further into doubt the case for him being the best British SMW of the lot...if he can't beat DeGale, what would a prime Calzaghe have done to him?!
Fight Golovkin, however, and he's already adding to the 'credit' column for coming out of retirement to take on arguably the best P4P fighter currently active. Win and his record goes from brilliant to bloody sensational; lose and as long as he gives it his all and goes down with honour (and let's face it, this is Carl Froch we're talking about here), his reputation as a true warrior and competitor will be further cemented. Probably the worst that can happen is he gets outclassed and, while not ideal, that's already happened against Ward so not exactly new territory, and still credit goes to him for coming out and taking on the biggest challenge around...
Edited by Yiliterate on Tuesday 10th November 20:18
Yiliterate said:
Gerradi said:
Yes i know Thompson was not in the dame league as GGG, I remember watching the fight, I thought Eubanks would win...as for Haye, he lost the fight Thompson did not win it, he was out classing Thompson all the way through & he got careless( arrogant) & the Cat pounced!
Again, I'm really not sure you've caught my drift. I'm not trying to assess the relative merits of Carl Thompson and Gennady Golovkin. The reference to the David Haye fight was to back up the assertion that Thompson was a genuine tough-as-old-boots Cruiserweight...whether Haye outclassed him or not is irrelevant; the point is Haye threw everything he could at Thompson (and Haye certainly wasn't what you would call feather-fisted) and yet Thompson took it all and, when Haye had exhausted himself, put him away.My point simply was this; (leave aside the DeGale rumours for a second) Froch appears to be considering coming out of retirement for one more mammoth challenge - taking on the highly skilled, renowned KO artist, GGG. Similarly, Eubank came out of retirement for one more mammoth challenge - stepping up two weight divisions to take on hard-as-nails Cruiserweight champion Carl Thompson. Though ultimately it didn't end well for Eubank, being stopped for the first time in their second fight, him going out on his shield like that enhanced his reputation rather than detracted from it. Similarly, if Froch were to lose to Golovkin, even if he were to be stopped for the first time on his career, it wouldn't necessarily damage his legacy.
Indeed, from the legacy perspective, I actually see both more downside risk and less upside reward in taking the DeGale fight. Leave aside the legacy to his bank balance, if he were to win, it doesn't really add much more to a CV that already lists the like of Pascal, Taylor, Dirrell, Abraham, Bute and Kessler as victims, as well as a big KO win over another 'domestic upstart' (location and attendance tbc). Whereas lose and it brings further into doubt the case for him being the best British SMW of the lot...if he can't beat DeGale, what would a prime Calzaghe have done to him?!
Fight Golovkin, however, and he's already adding to the 'credit' column for coming out of retirement to take on arguably the best P4P fighter currently active. Win and his record goes from brilliant to bloody sensational; lose and as long as he gives it his all and goes down with honour (and let's face it, this is Carl Froch we're talking about here), his reputation as a true warrior and competitor will be further cemented. Probably the worst that can happen is he gets outclassed and, while not ideal, that's already happened against Ward so not exactly new territory, and still credit goes to him for coming out and taking on the biggest challenge around...
Edited by Yiliterate on Tuesday 10th November 20:18
In addition, Golovkin has never faced anyone near as hard as Froch. I hope it is Golovkin and not DeGale. Would be some scrap....
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