The Wattage Thread

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andySC said:

Numbers are good. I don't race much tbh, hardly at all in 2012. I'm nearly 40 now & raced as a 1st Cat upto about 1998, then didn't hardly touch a bike until 2007. "if" I raced consistently & properly I could maybe do something with it but unfortunately the will to pin a number on isn't that strong as yet. I'll play around with it this year & see how I go. I'm lucky that I train regularly with some very handy lads who really do make you up yr game. One of whom is on a pro-conti team & remarked last year "Andy, you're one of the strongest riders I know but you're totally ste at racing"...couldn't argue with that tbh

Okgo...numbers recorded on a Wattbike Pro. It's on hire until March. Good pieces of kit.

Last thing I want to do is piss on your chips, but three people I know have struggled to get anywhere near the figs the wattbike spits out on the road. They don't seem to be terribly accurate (which is amazing given the cost and alleged credentials!) one blokes was 10% out and a girl in our club was 30% out, she had a readout of 400w for 20 mins lol!!

Still, you've obviously got the legs given your past, good work I need to find some top end soon, went out today and was trying pretty hard and didn't crack 400w for 5 mins at any point, which is surprising.

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matt-ITR said:

Is there any way to calibrate a Wattbike like a Powertap or SRM?

To me the most important thing with a power device is consistency, be it day to day or one device to another.
Quite surprised to hear Wattbikes are not as perfect as BC make out.

There is a way yes. But I don't think it fixes the issue if its underlying.

The reason I find it important to have numbers that are accurate is because in TT'ing I know what other riders have, so I have benchmarks etc, so I know if I get to x number then I should be pretty close to so and so aero pending.

Getting some of the top end back today, managed to do 400w for 5 mins on a few occasions highest being 420, which means its still there but not quite at the levels of summer (460), just a matter of pushing hard enough into that zone to get the benefits back as I've done nothing above 400w for any duration for a while now, but its getting to the time when I need that top end back! But I'm in a better place pre season that I was last season!

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Toscana said:

I read somewhere that for every 1 mph takes approx 10 watts.

What does the thread think about this?

I'm no good at physics, but no,that's not right.

Going from 20 to 21 mph is going to take a whole lot less watts than going from 30-31 mph. As you go up the power requirement for those extra few seconds is huge, its a very steep curve.

For instance, I could probably go round Richmond Park in about 15 mins with lets say 360 watts, I could probably go round there 1.30 slower with 330 but to go 1.30 faster and go as fast as David Millar did round there, I would imagine I would need around 60 watts minimum - around 410-420.

On the topic of this thread I am going to Majorca this week to have a crack on some of the mountains out there, hoping to get a lot of FTP work in, and might well enter a 10 mile TT the day after I get back, so hoping that a big jan and a solid block out there will yield some results. Reckon to be taking the club records in 10 and 25 I have enough power as it stands, but 5% or so should make it a lot more possible without having to go the lengths of the country for a fast TT course.

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Would say that yes around 270 or so for the average person who is on a TT bike.

But there have been people who do it on less all other things considered.

Faster you go the more the aero side of things matters. Out club record is 49.49 for 25 and he did it on under 330 watts @68kg super slippery.

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zebedee said:

Question. I am doing a 6 week turbo trainer course I saw in Cyclist. Part of it is 8x45 secs max with 90secs in between.

According to my Realaxiom, which I know is hardly realistic in terms of watts, but beside the point, when I first did it I went to the max and it was showing about 700-odd watts but declining as the 45 secs went past. By the 4th repetition I was at about 500 max and still declining and I couldn't do any more as I was about to die. (I am a climber rather than a power guy, hence doing this programme as it targets all aspects of riding).

The next time I tried it I thought maybe it means 45 seconds of the max you can hold for that, so I did around 460 watts for 45 seconds x 8 - it got harder but I could sustain it.

Is the latter what I should be doing to get the most benefit or should I be literally giving it full beans and fading away?

All training programs I've seen certainly advise dropping the power so you can complete the full workout, as you are doing, but you would have to check the exacts of the particular thing you are doing.

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How heavy/tall are you? I'm guessing pretty big for those wattages not to yield much quicker times...

Its certainly possible to get beat by smaller more aero people. A guy I know did 400w for a 10, and got beat by a guy 20kg lighter who did 320 on the same night!

The dangerous people are the ones with decent power and who are aero

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Yes he must be getting low readings I would have thought.

I have been doing turbo stuff on TT bike last couple of days and 340-350 feels fine for shorter intervals so hoping that on decent legs on the road I can easily get above my road 20 min power. I did 360 watts for 20 mins on 3 separate occasions last week in Majorca, and all on tired legs. Also managed 400 for almost 10 mins so I am confident numbers are moving in the right direction.

First sporting TT this weekend, about 30-35 mins in length, be happy with anything over 340/350 given the downhills etc.

Also had a retul fit which has made me a lot more comfy on the road bike, so going to do some vo2 stuff on that building up to races in march. Be happy if I can do 450+ for 5 mins on the road (hard on turbo - overheat). Early season form suggests I will be well able to get back up there. Weight almost down at 75 now, after weighing in at 83 on New Years Day.

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We will see. There's more to it than numbers. And most if the top 10 at the national 10 will do 400w so I'm still a little way from that. But that's where I would like to be.

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Go on time trialibg forum and do a search.

Hutch did 430 for the ten, wiggins 475 when they were in same race.

The sharp end of a national 10 is 400w territory.

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SRM is 30w less why?

Most people wil quote crank based, and I doubt there is a 30w difference in SRM/powertap - where does that leave quarq?

I know a couple if people who have had all of them and I've not heard such wild differences...

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Rocksteadyeddie said:

Poor man's random number generator?

I just think to claim SRM is universally 30w down on power-tap is bizarre, and if anything its powertap that isn't to be trusted as SRM is the gold standard and qaurq are well regarded too.

I've found the qaurq to be pretty good, it marries up with other people I ride with (most of the people I ride with have powermeters, some PT, some p2m, some SRM) for efforts up hills etc, so I have no reason to distrust it.

I've also used a powertap wheel and I found the figures to be in the same sort of ballpark as my Qaurq.

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This this from someone much smarter than me who has checked the slope of his unit regularly since buying it 8 months ago, and it actually makes good sense if you think about it.

Also he said that when he got it he tested it against a Power2Max and the same speed on the same turbo required exactly the same power, so I reckon you possibly have some incorrect info.

" It measures torque and cadence and derives power. A torque test verifies that torque is being measured correctly, and it's not going to get the cadence wrong unless it's obviously wrong, so power basically has to be right if those two things are right."

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Managed 350 today over a rolling TT course (360 normalised) for 45 mins on the TT bike and lost 90 secs to the winner and about 1 min to the known fast guys. Think I will be trying to new changes to my position, lower at the front perhaps.

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Had a full on 15 min effort on the turbo the other night. Slight issue meant I didn't get the full 20 in for a normal test, but for monitoring performance increase I can compare this 15 with previous best.

Managed just over 375w which is up on my best by nearly 10w which may be the benefits of Majorca showing. Most pleasing was that I did that in the aero position on my tt bike on the turbo, so hoping I may be able to get up on that a bit on the road. Just more evidence that I think FTP is nearer 360 than 350 now.

Interestingly I also set some new bests of 30-50 sec in my race last weekend just over 35 secs at 900w which was the full effort, most pleasing was that this came after being in a break for 20 mins @ 330w avg.

Sadly I've fallen off and done myself in a bit, but think that elusive 19 in a ten should be possible. Now just need to work out a way of cutting down the gap to some of the really quick testers.

Edited by okgo on Saturday 16th March 15:56

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Tried to adjust front guard on commuter while moving. Next thing I know my hand/wrist has been sucked into the front wheel and thrown me over bars nailing my shoulder on the Tarmac. Hurts

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Yes very silly of me. Reckon I was going 18 or so. Bounced my head off the road but the trusty kask sorted me. I numbed the pain by getting hammered from lunch onwards.

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Remember that losing muscle mass has no bearing on losing 'power' in cycling terms really - muscle strength only really comes into play in very short duration bursts (hence sprinters are more muscular etc). We are having this debate on the Front Cog thread, and a lot of people have the wrong idea about where power comes from, it isn't huge muscles, and losing muscle mass isn't an issue. I would say on the whole I am probably 50% weaker in the three major lifts (sqaut, dead, bench) than I was a year ago, but I'm much 'stronger' on the bike.

However I do agree that just riding around is only going to get you so far, people that tend to just ride around get good at just riding around, if you want to push yourself to a higher level then you need to ride at those levels at some point.

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Had a check up on the shoulder today which lasted all of 2 minutes and was a telling me what I already knew, it was healing up fine. I've been riding on it the last week, and raced twice this weekend, so although not 100% its probably 85% there.

The race on Saturday was an interesting one, not least because the normalised power for the 2hrs 45 mins was 345w, no doubt skewed by the hill, but average was over 260, and I felt pretty good for most of the time, so I think fitness is coming along.

This was further proved yesterday, in my quest to be able to do 400w for a ten mile TT (well its not a quest, just a nice round number which should see me go quick!!) I bridged to a breakaway at a race yesterday and to do so required 11 mins at 400w with a lot of downhill, so I'm fairly confident that I could see those sorts of numbers this season on a more constant course. I finished the race (solo in the end as I couldn't hack the break after that effort) with an average of 330 for the hour and normalized of 370 which again is a best for a solo ride.

The results are trickling in, but I still don't feel like I'm making the watts work for me as best I could just yet, but I am learning more and more each race. And knowing you've held off a bunch of riders for 40 mins on your own in the wind as it was yesterday does give you confidence.

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Went and did our club 10 last night, had already ridden 20 miles that morning, and arrived with only time for a 5 min warm up, but felt ok.

Managed 370 watts for the duration (21.05 - its not a fast course!), so quite pleased with that, it should translate into a 19 on a decent course I hope

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yonex said:

Saw the Strava feed, impressive numbers mate. Currently struggling to shift a cough/cold but am getting close to 300w over a 10, (290) last time out. I am targeting 22's on the local course which is also known as a 'slow' one. At the moment I am officially 'all over the place' and nowhere near my mid 23's I was doing last year. What with that and the sodding wind.......

I'm pleased with it, as my position is very aggressive, but bit miffed I didn't go quicker on the watts. But the conditions were not ideal.

To be honest its just good training and if I manage to set some good times, that is a bonus too. I have another couple of stage races with TT prologues, so its all good for those.