Flying Fortress?

Author
Discussion

Smiler.

Original Poster:

11,752 posts

232 months

Friday 1st June 2012
quotequote all
I think.

Just flew over Twyford.

Only caught it from that back, very long tail plane.

Edit: En route to Odiham.

Edited by Smiler. on Friday 1st June 13:48

Eric Mc

122,259 posts

267 months

Friday 1st June 2012
quotequote all
Family day there today. I was able to go last year when it was held in August.

The B-17 (Sally B) was there that day too -


TTwiggy

11,570 posts

206 months

Friday 1st June 2012
quotequote all
When I was a nipper, my dad was friends with a guy who was friends with the owner of Sally B. I've been all over the inside of her - there's a picture somewhere of a 10-year-old me in the tail gunner's seat.

Eric Mc

122,259 posts

267 months

Friday 1st June 2012
quotequote all
She's been in the UK since 1975 and is the last airworthy B-17 in Europe.

TTwiggy

11,570 posts

206 months

Friday 1st June 2012
quotequote all
Eric Mc said:
She's been in the UK since 1975 and is the last airworthy B-17 in Europe.
It would have been 1982 (ish) at Biggin Hill that I went inside her. I also got to climb around the inside of a Lancaster – much less space than the B17, even as a kid I had to turn sideways to get into the cockpit.

Eric Mc

122,259 posts

267 months

Friday 1st June 2012
quotequote all
TTwiggy said:
Eric Mc said:
She's been in the UK since 1975 and is the last airworthy B-17 in Europe.
It would have been 1982 (ish) at Biggin Hill that I went inside her. I also got to climb around the inside of a Lancaster – much less space than the B17, even as a kid I had to turn sideways to get into the cockpit.
The Lancaster devoted far more space to bomb carying than did the B-17 - hence the lack of space. Indeed, the other two British heavies of the period, the Halifax and Stirling, provided more space for the crew.

The Lanc reduced in priority every aspect of its design that was not directly involved in maximising the bomb load.

1982 was the last year Sally B performed in her original natural metal scheme. From 1983 onwards she was painted in a green/gray camouflage scheme.

TTwiggy

11,570 posts

206 months

Friday 1st June 2012
quotequote all
Eric Mc said:
1982 was the last year Sally B performed in her original natural metal scheme. From 1983 onwards she was painted in a green/gray camouflage scheme.
That helps me date it then, as she was definately 'silver' at the time.

davepoth

29,395 posts

201 months

Friday 1st June 2012
quotequote all
Eric Mc said:
The Lanc reduced in priority every aspect of its design that was not directly involved in maximising the bomb load.
Which was why it managed to loft the ten tonne "grand slam" I guess. B-17's bomb load was about the same as a Mosquito IIRC?

Simpo Two

85,845 posts

267 months

Friday 1st June 2012
quotequote all
Smiler. said:
Only caught it from that back, very long tail plane.
Or a tall fin.

Eric Mc

122,259 posts

267 months

Friday 1st June 2012
quotequote all
I think the maximum load of a B-17 was about 11,000 lbs. The Lancaster could carry a maximum load of 22,000 lbs - although the normal bomb load was around 14,000 lbs.

The B-17 was designed to a different philosophy to either the Lancaster or the Mosquito. It was also an older design to both.

The B-17 could fly quite a bit higher than the Lancaster and was faster. It was also more heavilly armed and armoured. So, the performance gains in speed, altitude and defence were at the cost of bomb carrying capability.

At the time the B-17 was originally designed (1932-35) it was a tremendously advanced aircraft. Consider what other bombers were being designed at the time. It was also assumed that the very sophisticated and semi-computerised Norden bombsight would give the B-17 unparallelled bombing accuracy from 30,000 feet.

The exigencies of war showed that, despite the speed, alttude, smart bombsights etc and defensive armament (which was substantially beefed up as a result), the B-17 turned out to be less effective than the US air chiefs had hoped. However, its crews were very grateful for the inherent structural strength of the airframe.

If you look at early B-17s you can see how slim and speedy they look. The later ones are much bulkier and ponderous in comparison.




Smiler.

Original Poster:

11,752 posts

232 months

Friday 1st June 2012
quotequote all
Simpo Two said:
Smiler. said:
Only caught it from that back, very long tail plane.
Or a tall fin.
Yep, one of them biggrin

jesta1865

3,448 posts

211 months

Friday 1st June 2012
quotequote all
TTwiggy said:
When I was a nipper, my dad was friends with a guy who was friends with the owner of Sally B. I've been all over the inside of her - there's a picture somewhere of a 10-year-old me in the tail gunner's seat.
my ex father in law was a 747 pilot and knew one of the guys involved with the Sally B. I got to travel in her a few years back, even in the height of summer you need a damn thick coat on in one of those at altitude.

its a tad disconcerting seeing the ground through the fuselage in places smile

TTwiggy

11,570 posts

206 months

Friday 1st June 2012
quotequote all
jesta1865 said:
TTwiggy said:
When I was a nipper, my dad was friends with a guy who was friends with the owner of Sally B. I've been all over the inside of her - there's a picture somewhere of a 10-year-old me in the tail gunner's seat.
my ex father in law was a 747 pilot and knew one of the guys involved with the Sally B. I got to travel in her a few years back, even in the height of summer you need a damn thick coat on in one of those at altitude.

its a tad disconcerting seeing the ground through the fuselage in places smile
I had the opportunity to go up, but there was only room for me, and my mum wasn't keen for an unsupervised 10-year-old (even a very well behaved one) to go flying 'solo'.

Eric Mc

122,259 posts

267 months

Friday 1st June 2012
quotequote all
jesta1865 said:
TTwiggy said:
When I was a nipper, my dad was friends with a guy who was friends with the owner of Sally B. I've been all over the inside of her - there's a picture somewhere of a 10-year-old me in the tail gunner's seat.
my ex father in law was a 747 pilot and knew one of the guys involved with the Sally B. I got to travel in her a few years back, even in the height of summer you need a damn thick coat on in one of those at altitude.

its a tad disconcerting seeing the ground through the fuselage in places smile
Imagine flying in one of those things at 30,000 feet - where the outside air temperature is 50 degrees below zero. The crews had to wear electrically heated boots and gloves, as well as the heavy sheepskin flying jackets. And they were unpressurised, so needed to be on oxygen for most of the flight -

and contend with fighters and flak

and find the target

and drop their bombs accurately

This can't have been much fun -


HoHoHo

15,007 posts

252 months

Friday 1st June 2012
quotequote all
Eric Mc said:
This can't have been much fun -

I bet that makes your arse go 50p, 5p yes

Very brave men.

Eric Mc

122,259 posts

267 months

Friday 1st June 2012
quotequote all
They were kids, in most cases - especially the gunners - who were usually 20 or younger.

Smiler.

Original Poster:

11,752 posts

232 months

Friday 1st June 2012
quotequote all
Where is the Sally B based?

Was hoping it would fly back the same way.

Eric Mc

122,259 posts

267 months

Friday 1st June 2012
quotequote all
Duxford.

Mr_B

10,480 posts

245 months

Friday 1st June 2012
quotequote all
I was once in a pub called the Flying Fortress when a Flying Fortress flew past. Are their any pubs caled the Spitfire or Hurricane to try and repeat this at ?
http://www.theflyingfortress.co.uk/

Was also outside the Startled Saint pub ( I was about 10 at the time , so to young to be drinking ) when a flight of Spitfires flew overhead. Quite nice given the pubs sign.
Not totally related to the thread topic, but thought I'd say it anyway.


Smiler.

Original Poster:

11,752 posts

232 months

Friday 1st June 2012
quotequote all
Arse - just missed it.