who brought the red GTR sold by the factory?

[LuckyP]

Wouldn't the 2k reduced offer be as much about the uncertainty of other parts of the car, knowing that a major compoment appears not as advertised?

A kinda risk reduction if you like?

All fair in my book.

Unless Scotch bloke or G'box tells us otherwise.

Lucky

[Stig]

deadscoob said:

But why would it be worth £2,000 more with an AS engine?

Despite what you may think of AS, the fact remains that they are the only engine supplier that the factory recommends.

If you have a problem with it - that can make the difference between a quick call to the factory and parts being with you within a few days and being left on your own to sort the problem out.

Ultima buyers tend to go for 'factory spec' for this reason.

[LuckyP]

Stig said:

deadscoob said:

But why would it be worth £2,000 more with an AS engine?

Despite what you may think of AS, the fact remains that they are the only engine supplier that the factory recommends.

If you have a problem with it - that can make the difference between a quick call to the factory and parts being with you within a few days and being left on your own to sort the problem out.

Ultima buyers tend to go for 'factory spec' for this reason.

Yep.

[crafty]

...I'd rather not have the engine break in the first place.


I contacted them in the beginning and told them I needed to have a EURO4 engine. They sent me a price for an injected SB. I asked if they had ever done EURO4 before - they said no. The fact is that the engine would never have passed.. they should have said they couldnt do it rather than give me a price for something that couldnt meet it.


....the whole matter of correction figures also put me completely off AS.

Edited by crafty on Tuesday 26th February 09:50

[gritbox]

When I brought the car, I didnt question the engine. I didnt have any experience with Ultimas and I was under the impression that the engine was an American speed. This was backed up by an invoice from the factory stating that they supplied an engine to the original builder for a Chevrolet engine. I didnt have any reason to doubt this until recently. Where the invoice came from is between the original builder and the factory to sort out. I have since found out that the engine was built by Napier Racing. Not that it matters to me, as it may do to some people. And as for you Robert advising people to stay away from my car, I am somewhat confused, particularly when you admitted to me that "it is a really nice car" You were more concerned at the resale value of it not having an American speed engine, as in your own words "I dont tend to keep my cars for more than a year". I wish you the best of luck with your new purchase.

[gritbox]

LuckyP said:

Wouldn't the 2k reduced offer be as much about the uncertainty of other parts of the car, knowing that a major compoment appears not as advertised?

A kinda risk reduction if you like?

All fair in my book.

Unless Scotch bloke or G'box tells us otherwise.

Lucky

Fortunately one can "see" most of the major components such as wheels, brakes, suspension. Fortunately there are few "non factory" (except the engine)parts on my car Seriously though, so what if the brake calipers are willwood rather than AP etc...does it REALLY matter? Purists may think so, but I bet there are loads of Ultimas out there with non factory parts. Does it make the car worse by comparison? I think not.

[crafty]

It seems that the discovery that the engine is not AS has taken you by surprise also.

If it were me that would not put me off that car - I remember seeing that car at the Factory day in '05... it was a tidy and well built car.

Edited by crafty on Tuesday 26th February 10:47

[kylemrushall]

So if a car isnt factory spec it is worth less??

That is complete rubbish imo!!!

Look at Can am Daves car, it is about as far away from factory spec as anything could be but it is fantastically engineered and imo far superior to the AS powered spec car he purchased.

I think a lot of people want their cars to be individual so to do this we need to move away from factory specs so it stands out. Look at Waynes car that is truly awesome (when it works;-) ) and so individual.

So imo to say something that is not factory spec is worth less is frankly an insult to many skilled builders who do have the skills to move away from factory specs. If you are limited in skills stick to the norm but if you want to buy a modified car find out about the owner, look at the receipts speak to as many people as you can to make an informed decision.

[crafty]

I notice it had a TOAD alarm... do you have a problem with toads where you live?

[kylemrushall]

deadscoob said:

But why would it be worth £2,000 more with an AS engine?

it isnt!!

[gritbox]

there is no doubt the original builder has done a very good job of building the car. I looked at four before settling on this one.. all had their good and bad points. This one was the best "all rounder".

[gritbox]

crafty said:

I notice it had a TOAD alarm... do you have a problem with toads where you live?

yes, we get a few around now and then... usually they wear hoodies

[kylemrushall]

crafty said:

I notice it had a TOAD alarm... do you have a problem with toads where you live?

ive got one of them too, our cars must only be worth a fiver then??

[gritbox]

crafty said:

It seems that the discovery that the engine is not AS has taken you by surprise also.

If it were me that would not put me off that car - I remember seeing that car at the Factory day in '05... it was a tidy and well built car.

Edited by crafty on Tuesday 26th February 10:47

Thanks for the compliment I need it, feeling a bit low with all this

[gritbox]

kylemrushall said:

crafty said:

I notice it had a TOAD alarm... do you have a problem with toads where you live?

ive got one of them too, our cars must only be worth a fiver then??

[LuckyP]

gritbox said:

LuckyP said:

Wouldn't the 2k reduced offer be as much about the uncertainty of other parts of the car, knowing that a major compoment appears not as advertised?

A kinda risk reduction if you like?

All fair in my book.

Unless Scotch bloke or G'box tells us otherwise.

Lucky

Fortunately one can "see" most of the major components such as wheels, brakes, suspension. Fortunately there are few "non factory" (except the engine)parts on my car Seriously though, so what if the brake calipers are willwood rather than AP etc...does it REALLY matter? Purists may think so, but I bet there are loads of Ultimas out there with non factory parts. Does it make the car worse by comparison? I think not.

Worse, probably not(even better in some cases). But it's the same with any car, people feel 'safer' with the std spec.

Just my t'pence.

[Stig]

kylemrushall said:

So if a car isnt factory spec it is worth less??

That is complete rubbish imo!!!

Look at Can am Daves car, it is about as far away from factory spec as anything could be but it is fantastically engineered and imo far superior to the AS powered spec car he purchased.

I think a lot of people want their cars to be individual so to do this we need to move away from factory specs so it stands out. Look at Waynes car that is truly awesome (when it works;-) ) and so individual.

So imo to say something that is not factory spec is worth less is frankly an insult to many skilled builders who do have the skills to move away from factory specs. If you are limited in skills stick to the norm but if you want to buy a modified car find out about the owner, look at the receipts speak to as many people as you can to make an informed decision.

Kyle - you may not like it, but it's a fact of resale most cars that's are non standard, no matter how well built/engineered, will be less attractive to the majority of buyers than one that uses all factory components.

There are some exceptions of course, which are driven by reputation (or should that be notoriety? ), track record etc. or use of 'recognised' exotic components . If luckyp were to sell for example, his CF Dymags would have a positive effect on the car's value. But in the main, the perception is that people who go non-standard are usually trying to save a few quid/bucks - as, it appears, is the case in this instance.

Bear in mind that a used buyer isn't usually a builder and as such, they want some sort of emotional re-assurance that the car is as the factory intended.

Exactly the same is true for any modified car, irrespective of the credentials/skills of the builder.

[kylemrushall]

Im have no doubt you know what you are talking about but....

Pete's wheels imo are not a plus point so using that as an example makes it all in the eye of the beholder.

The beauty of the kit car industry is you can make your own mark on your car, i would rather and im sure many others would buy something a little different rather than a factory clone. This is backed up by many people purchasing parts, engines from people like Jeff in the States??

I have nothing against the factory in fact quite the opposite i applaud them for developing such a great car but i dont like/understand the fact that they do not like people to move away from their specs. The development carried out by a lot of pioneer builders could be incorporated in future factory products/cars????

[LuckyP]

kylemrushall said:

Im have no doubt you know what you are talking about but....

Pete's wheels imo are not a plus point so using that as an example makes it all in the eye of the beholder.

The beauty of the kit car industry is you can make your own mark on your car, i would rather and im sure many others would buy something a little different rather than a factory clone. This is backed up by many people purchasing parts, engines from people like Jeff in the States??

I have nothing against the factory in fact quite the opposite i applaud them for developing such a great car but i dont like/understand the fact that they do not like people to move away from their specs. The development carried out by a lot of pioneer builders could be incorporated in future factory products/cars????

I don't fink he gets it.

[Stig]

kylemrushall said:

Im have no doubt you know what you are talking about but....

Pete's wheels imo are not a plus point so using that as an example makes it all in the eye of the beholder.

The beauty of the kit car industry is you can make your own mark on your car, i would rather and im sure many others would buy something a little different rather than a factory clone. This is backed up by many people purchasing parts, engines from people like Jeff in the States??

I have nothing against the factory in fact quite the opposite i applaud them for developing such a great car but i dont like/understand the fact that they do not like people to move away from their specs. The development carried out by a lot of pioneer builders could be incorporated in future factory products/cars????

You have to remember that the factory put their name to the product (which they've spent many years developing / testing / evolving) - as soon as people deviate from it (with for arguments sake - dire results) that reflects directly on them by association.

Otherwise you're not producing a product as such, just a bunch of parts that people can build into a car with no control over how good/terrible the result.

Unlike, say, certain software developers, Ultima don't believe in putting a product out into market and then let the users do all the development work! You can imagine how a 'blue screen of death' would translate to a high performance car in that instance!

As for Pete's wheels, yes beauty is in the eye of the beholder and whilst you may not like them, they do have a demonstrable performance benefit over the factory wheels as they reduce unsprung weight. This was the point I was alluding to and people will pay for it. However, the part in question would need to be demonstrably better than the factory equivalent for it to have a positive effect on the value.

Finally, I can tell you from first hand experience, that used buyers will look first and foremost for a known quantity in the cars - and that is factory spec.