Getrag 996 C2 Transaxle
Discussion
If like me you have gone for the Getrag option there are some issues that you should be aware of concerning this box.
I think that we are all aware of the gearing issues that have been discussed at length on here, but there is also the issue of reliability of this box that people should be made aware of.
In my case I had my car on the road for only 1500 miles when I noticed that when changing to 4th it would 'crunch' into gear and then sometimes 'pop' out if not held in with the gear lever when releasing the clutch. I had a few gearbox specialist look at the box and they all confirmed that 4th gear synchro was worn, to which all said that was unusual as it is normally 2nd gear that goes first!!! Then I was told that these boxes were 'throw away' boxes as no one has made a repair that lasts (if you could find some one to repair it in the first place). One place quoted me 600-700GBP just to strip the box but with no guarantee to repair it, and all were quite willing to sell me a box (with no warranty) for around 2000GBP plus VAT, from a scrapper.
Not wanting to lose 5000GBP or spend another 2-3K and possibly be in the same position a year down the line I looked further a field, the States. I eventually came in contact with a company called GBOX LLC in Colorado, that part exchange or repair these boxes and they were at great pains to tell me that these boxes are not throw away and can be repaired, here is an extract of their reply to me:
We will have no problem taking care of your request. You are experiencing a typical problem with these gearboxes, and yes they are very hard to repair effectively. We have developed some proprietary machining, procedure to repair and enhance the shifting performance of the 996 series of Getrag designed gearbox. We are modifying stock Porsche supplied internals to alleviate gear clash, synchro wear and guarantee the performance of the gear selection. Just replacing the internals with stock supplied Porsche parts 9 times out of 10 does not cure the problem The reason these gearboxes are so hard to repair effectively is inherent within the nature of their design. They are an interference fit, which means all tolerances are press fit, and sometimes require temperature manipulation to shrink and expand parts so they fit together like intended. This gearbox also requires the minimum of a 100 ton press to remove the gear stack correctly. It is an amazing amount of force that is required to remove the gear stack and then fit it back together.
Here is a little bit of information regarding GBOX. We are an owner operated company with no investors, so we self finance. This leaves us free to develop our ideas without bank or investor interference. We are all enthusiasts and love every second of what we do. We pride ourselves on our service and maintain an attention to detail that is among the best. We are not your average transaxle rebuilder, we are above the rest.
All of our gearboxes will come with a 12k 12 month warranty, and your gearbox is guaranteed once repaired to perform. We supply transaxles to some of the highest performing supercars, and have gearboxes behind 1000 hp power plants that live everyday without failure. Our attention to detail and no-compromise attitude is what maintains our nearly 100% success rate, and so far in the last 7 months of business we have had only 1 come back due to an OEM. part failure. This was replaced free of charge for the customer, even though it was neither our fault nor his. We just care about our customer’s driveline, and I hope we can get the opportunity to solve your problem
We can also prepare a C2 gearbox for you and send it out. I can supply apply a core charge if you would like to resell yours or we can accept it in trade for the core charge. It is completely up to you. The easiest thing to do is probably send it over, I have a carrier that can pickup overseas and send it over to me insured. From there I will inspect the gearbox and notify you of the estimate to repair the problem. You can then make the decision to have it repaired or to purchase a rebuilt unit from us, (either way they both carry the same guarantee of performance and attention to detail that every customer gets when doing business with GBOX.
Receiving this email was like a breath of fresh air after dealing with some UK companies, I have since called GBOX and spoke to a guy called Ryan Zielinski, he went on to explain why they modify the parts for the rebuild and the benefits it gives etc. . . . . . . we also discussed other options, like a GT3 box he has for 15000USD that he was prepared to modify or add a 6th gear to for me if I wanted it, but that would have entailed a complete flywheel/clutch/starter/adaptor plate change over which would have been too much for me. I did ask about the final drive gearing but he said that nothing was around at the moment and a substantial order would be needed to get anything moving.
With the good exchange rate at the moment it means that I could get my box repaired with warranty in the States for less than a box out of a scrapper with no warranty in the UK!
I'll let you know how I progress.
Graham
I think that we are all aware of the gearing issues that have been discussed at length on here, but there is also the issue of reliability of this box that people should be made aware of.
In my case I had my car on the road for only 1500 miles when I noticed that when changing to 4th it would 'crunch' into gear and then sometimes 'pop' out if not held in with the gear lever when releasing the clutch. I had a few gearbox specialist look at the box and they all confirmed that 4th gear synchro was worn, to which all said that was unusual as it is normally 2nd gear that goes first!!! Then I was told that these boxes were 'throw away' boxes as no one has made a repair that lasts (if you could find some one to repair it in the first place). One place quoted me 600-700GBP just to strip the box but with no guarantee to repair it, and all were quite willing to sell me a box (with no warranty) for around 2000GBP plus VAT, from a scrapper.
Not wanting to lose 5000GBP or spend another 2-3K and possibly be in the same position a year down the line I looked further a field, the States. I eventually came in contact with a company called GBOX LLC in Colorado, that part exchange or repair these boxes and they were at great pains to tell me that these boxes are not throw away and can be repaired, here is an extract of their reply to me:
We will have no problem taking care of your request. You are experiencing a typical problem with these gearboxes, and yes they are very hard to repair effectively. We have developed some proprietary machining, procedure to repair and enhance the shifting performance of the 996 series of Getrag designed gearbox. We are modifying stock Porsche supplied internals to alleviate gear clash, synchro wear and guarantee the performance of the gear selection. Just replacing the internals with stock supplied Porsche parts 9 times out of 10 does not cure the problem The reason these gearboxes are so hard to repair effectively is inherent within the nature of their design. They are an interference fit, which means all tolerances are press fit, and sometimes require temperature manipulation to shrink and expand parts so they fit together like intended. This gearbox also requires the minimum of a 100 ton press to remove the gear stack correctly. It is an amazing amount of force that is required to remove the gear stack and then fit it back together.
Here is a little bit of information regarding GBOX. We are an owner operated company with no investors, so we self finance. This leaves us free to develop our ideas without bank or investor interference. We are all enthusiasts and love every second of what we do. We pride ourselves on our service and maintain an attention to detail that is among the best. We are not your average transaxle rebuilder, we are above the rest.
All of our gearboxes will come with a 12k 12 month warranty, and your gearbox is guaranteed once repaired to perform. We supply transaxles to some of the highest performing supercars, and have gearboxes behind 1000 hp power plants that live everyday without failure. Our attention to detail and no-compromise attitude is what maintains our nearly 100% success rate, and so far in the last 7 months of business we have had only 1 come back due to an OEM. part failure. This was replaced free of charge for the customer, even though it was neither our fault nor his. We just care about our customer’s driveline, and I hope we can get the opportunity to solve your problem
We can also prepare a C2 gearbox for you and send it out. I can supply apply a core charge if you would like to resell yours or we can accept it in trade for the core charge. It is completely up to you. The easiest thing to do is probably send it over, I have a carrier that can pickup overseas and send it over to me insured. From there I will inspect the gearbox and notify you of the estimate to repair the problem. You can then make the decision to have it repaired or to purchase a rebuilt unit from us, (either way they both carry the same guarantee of performance and attention to detail that every customer gets when doing business with GBOX.
Receiving this email was like a breath of fresh air after dealing with some UK companies, I have since called GBOX and spoke to a guy called Ryan Zielinski, he went on to explain why they modify the parts for the rebuild and the benefits it gives etc. . . . . . . we also discussed other options, like a GT3 box he has for 15000USD that he was prepared to modify or add a 6th gear to for me if I wanted it, but that would have entailed a complete flywheel/clutch/starter/adaptor plate change over which would have been too much for me. I did ask about the final drive gearing but he said that nothing was around at the moment and a substantial order would be needed to get anything moving.
With the good exchange rate at the moment it means that I could get my box repaired with warranty in the States for less than a box out of a scrapper with no warranty in the UK!
I'll let you know how I progress.
Graham
Thats great news Graham nice to see there is light at the end of the tunnel !!!! still very dissapointing that the box has given you a problem after such a small amount of use !!! even more so when you consider it was recommended to you and the original supplier has not offered to compensate you for the repairs needed !!!!!
Hi Clive, here's their web site address
http://gboxweb.com/
Thanks for the offer I'll let you know.
Andy:
He did say that maybe in about another year things could have moved on and there could be something available, but it would still be expensive to do.
Si:
Yep the light at the end of the tunnel doesn't look like a train!!! (at the moment)
Graham
http://gboxweb.com/
Thanks for the offer I'll let you know.
Andy:
He did say that maybe in about another year things could have moved on and there could be something available, but it would still be expensive to do.
Si:
Yep the light at the end of the tunnel doesn't look like a train!!! (at the moment)
Graham
Edited by Graham-P on Friday 11th January 20:28
Hi
Just a word of warning ....
I have recently bought an engine from the states and like you i thought these guys are great!! They were great upto the time they had all the monies and then to be honest there attitude changed!! I have managed to sort it all out.
I think they say all the correct things prior to purchase, almost what you want to hear. I'm not saying they are a bad company just check them out buddy... Im becoming more and more cynical in my old age!!
but yep it does look good, you could even say that the box is being returned to them under warrenty and they could return it again under warrenty repair thus saving you 20 odd% import and vat duty!!!
im looking forward to May as long as we all have cars that are mobile!!
Just a word of warning ....
I have recently bought an engine from the states and like you i thought these guys are great!! They were great upto the time they had all the monies and then to be honest there attitude changed!! I have managed to sort it all out.
I think they say all the correct things prior to purchase, almost what you want to hear. I'm not saying they are a bad company just check them out buddy... Im becoming more and more cynical in my old age!!
but yep it does look good, you could even say that the box is being returned to them under warrenty and they could return it again under warrenty repair thus saving you 20 odd% import and vat duty!!!
im looking forward to May as long as we all have cars that are mobile!!
kylemrushall said:
Hi
Just a word of warning ....
I have recently bought an engine from the states and like you i thought these guys are great!! They were great upto the time they had all the monies and then to be honest there attitude changed!! I have managed to sort it all out.
I think they say all the correct things prior to purchase, almost what you want to hear. I'm not saying they are a bad company just check them out buddy... Im becoming more and more cynical in my old age!!
but yep it does look good, you could even say that the box is being returned to them under warrenty and they could return it again under warrenty repair thus saving you 20 odd% import and vat duty!!!
im looking forward to May as long as we all have cars that are mobile!!
You talking about the Kit car show or something else ?Just a word of warning ....
I have recently bought an engine from the states and like you i thought these guys are great!! They were great upto the time they had all the monies and then to be honest there attitude changed!! I have managed to sort it all out.
I think they say all the correct things prior to purchase, almost what you want to hear. I'm not saying they are a bad company just check them out buddy... Im becoming more and more cynical in my old age!!
but yep it does look good, you could even say that the box is being returned to them under warrenty and they could return it again under warrenty repair thus saving you 20 odd% import and vat duty!!!
im looking forward to May as long as we all have cars that are mobile!!
Hi Graham
I'm glad your getting your gearbox sorted out.
Graham already knows this information but just to let others know! Roger Brown of CMS (California Motorsports) used to work for GBOX and says they are a good bunch of engineers and will do a good job. As Graham has already mentioned the G96 box is indeed repairable and just to give you an idea CMS usually charge around $3400 to do a complete rebuild on the box.
While on the sublect of gearboxes some of you may know I was looking into fitting a squential box to my Can-Am. The box is made by Elite. Unfortunately I did not pursue this as there were too many unkowns as this box has yet to be fitted to a SBC. Technocars have used the box with the Audi V8. My main concern was that the output flanges fron the box would be much further back than a G96 or G50. This is not a problem with the shorter Audi V8.
I have decided instead to go for a custom built G96/50 from CMS. This box has a larger 9" crownwheel instead of the standard 7.5" in a G50.
For those of you interested, here are my new gear ratios and speeds at 6,500rpm.
1st 3.81 42mph
2nd 2.04 71mph
3rd 1.40 103mph
4th 1.11 130mph
5th 0.85 171mph
6th 0.66 222mph
The new box is having a lot of modifications to take the extra power.
Regards Dave
I'm glad your getting your gearbox sorted out.
Graham already knows this information but just to let others know! Roger Brown of CMS (California Motorsports) used to work for GBOX and says they are a good bunch of engineers and will do a good job. As Graham has already mentioned the G96 box is indeed repairable and just to give you an idea CMS usually charge around $3400 to do a complete rebuild on the box.
While on the sublect of gearboxes some of you may know I was looking into fitting a squential box to my Can-Am. The box is made by Elite. Unfortunately I did not pursue this as there were too many unkowns as this box has yet to be fitted to a SBC. Technocars have used the box with the Audi V8. My main concern was that the output flanges fron the box would be much further back than a G96 or G50. This is not a problem with the shorter Audi V8.
I have decided instead to go for a custom built G96/50 from CMS. This box has a larger 9" crownwheel instead of the standard 7.5" in a G50.
For those of you interested, here are my new gear ratios and speeds at 6,500rpm.
1st 3.81 42mph
2nd 2.04 71mph
3rd 1.40 103mph
4th 1.11 130mph
5th 0.85 171mph
6th 0.66 222mph
The new box is having a lot of modifications to take the extra power.
Regards Dave
Edited by CanAm Dave on Friday 11th January 23:02
CanAm Dave said:
Hi Graham
I'm glad your getting your gearbox sorted out.
Graham already knows this information but just to let others know! Roger Brown of CMS (California Motorsports) used to work for GBOX and says they are a good bunch of engineers and will do a good job. As Graham has already mentioned the G96 box is indeed repairable and just to give you an idea CMS usually charge around $3400 to do a complete rebuild on the box.
While on the sublect of gearboxes some of you may know I was looking into fitting a squential box to my Can-Am. The box is made by Elite. Unfortunately I did not pursue this as there were too many unkowns as this box has yet to be fitted to a SBC. Technocars have used the box with the Audi V8. My main concern was that the output flanges fron the box would be much further back than a G96 or G50. This is not a problem with the shorter Audi V8.
I have decided instead to go for a custom built G96/50 from CMS. This box has a larger 9" crownwheel instead of the standard 7.5" in a G50.
For those of you interested, here are my new gear ratios and speeds at 6,500rpm.
1st 3.81 42mph
2nd 2.04 71mph
3rd 1.40 103mph
4th 1.11 130mph
5th 0.85 171mph
6th 0.66 222mph
The new box is having a lot of modifications to take the extra power.
Regards Dave
Hi Dave,I'm glad your getting your gearbox sorted out.
Graham already knows this information but just to let others know! Roger Brown of CMS (California Motorsports) used to work for GBOX and says they are a good bunch of engineers and will do a good job. As Graham has already mentioned the G96 box is indeed repairable and just to give you an idea CMS usually charge around $3400 to do a complete rebuild on the box.
While on the sublect of gearboxes some of you may know I was looking into fitting a squential box to my Can-Am. The box is made by Elite. Unfortunately I did not pursue this as there were too many unkowns as this box has yet to be fitted to a SBC. Technocars have used the box with the Audi V8. My main concern was that the output flanges fron the box would be much further back than a G96 or G50. This is not a problem with the shorter Audi V8.
I have decided instead to go for a custom built G96/50 from CMS. This box has a larger 9" crownwheel instead of the standard 7.5" in a G50.
For those of you interested, here are my new gear ratios and speeds at 6,500rpm.
1st 3.81 42mph
2nd 2.04 71mph
3rd 1.40 103mph
4th 1.11 130mph
5th 0.85 171mph
6th 0.66 222mph
The new box is having a lot of modifications to take the extra power.
Regards Dave
Edited by CanAm Dave on Friday 11th January 23:02
What's the low-down on cost, timescale and specifics on changes for strength ?
If you want ratios try these for size, not cheap but then again nothing is that's worth having....
7200rpm shift point (Modified LS7 with 640bhp)
1st 62 mph
2nd 102 mph
3rd 141 mph
4th 178 mph
5th 214 mph
and that all important top speed gear !!!
6th 251 mph..... and great for cruising with 35mph/1000rpm
and no it's not a Porsche box..... But it is sitting in my garage now next to my LS7 Crate...
7200rpm shift point (Modified LS7 with 640bhp)
1st 62 mph
2nd 102 mph
3rd 141 mph
4th 178 mph
5th 214 mph
and that all important top speed gear !!!
6th 251 mph..... and great for cruising with 35mph/1000rpm
and no it's not a Porsche box..... But it is sitting in my garage now next to my LS7 Crate...
CanAm Dave said:
Hi Graham
I'm glad your getting your gearbox sorted out.
Graham already knows this information but just to let others know! Roger Brown of CMS (California Motorsports) used to work for GBOX and says they are a good bunch of engineers and will do a good job. As Graham has already mentioned the G96 box is indeed repairable and just to give you an idea CMS usually charge around $3400 to do a complete rebuild on the box.
While on the sublect of gearboxes some of you may know I was looking into fitting a squential box to my Can-Am. The box is made by Elite. Unfortunately I did not pursue this as there were too many unkowns as this box has yet to be fitted to a SBC. Technocars have used the box with the Audi V8. My main concern was that the output flanges fron the box would be much further back than a G96 or G50. This is not a problem with the shorter Audi V8.
I have decided instead to go for a custom built G96/50 from CMS. This box has a larger 9" crownwheel instead of the standard 7.5" in a G50.
For those of you interested, here are my new gear ratios and speeds at 6,500rpm.
1st 3.81 42mph
2nd 2.04 71mph
3rd 1.40 103mph
4th 1.11 130mph
5th 0.85 171mph
6th 0.66 222mph
The new box is having a lot of modifications to take the extra power.
Regards Dave
Hi Dave,I'm glad your getting your gearbox sorted out.
Graham already knows this information but just to let others know! Roger Brown of CMS (California Motorsports) used to work for GBOX and says they are a good bunch of engineers and will do a good job. As Graham has already mentioned the G96 box is indeed repairable and just to give you an idea CMS usually charge around $3400 to do a complete rebuild on the box.
While on the sublect of gearboxes some of you may know I was looking into fitting a squential box to my Can-Am. The box is made by Elite. Unfortunately I did not pursue this as there were too many unkowns as this box has yet to be fitted to a SBC. Technocars have used the box with the Audi V8. My main concern was that the output flanges fron the box would be much further back than a G96 or G50. This is not a problem with the shorter Audi V8.
I have decided instead to go for a custom built G96/50 from CMS. This box has a larger 9" crownwheel instead of the standard 7.5" in a G50.
For those of you interested, here are my new gear ratios and speeds at 6,500rpm.
1st 3.81 42mph
2nd 2.04 71mph
3rd 1.40 103mph
4th 1.11 130mph
5th 0.85 171mph
6th 0.66 222mph
The new box is having a lot of modifications to take the extra power.
Regards Dave
Edited by CanAm Dave on Friday 11th January 23:02
What's the low-down on cost, timescale and specifics on changes for strength ?
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