Chemotherapy - cancer? You're fit.
Discussion
johnfm said:
crankedup said:
Then post up my remark where I have said box lifting is not a valid test. Frankly you are over exaggerating my posts, why I do not know, however, I have acknowledged the fact that the ill/disabled may want to work, indeed many do. If you can read back my posts you will read that I have tried to be reasonable in acknowledging that not all those affected by illness/disabilities would want nothing else but to work. But the debate is not about those people, it is about those unable to work being deemed fit to do so.
Don't preach to me about how the ill/disabled feel about ethics, my kid Sister suffered a brain tumour at 16 years of age, she passed away in a hospice at 24 years of age with her family at her bedside, including me, so don't you dare preach to me. My eldest Brother is also suffering from an inoperable brain tumour, he collapsed at work and since then 13 years have passed by. He is on constant medication to keep him alive, he suffers dreadful effects from the tumour and medication. He is currently awaiting his ESA assessment interview and is worried out of his life asking me how he will get by if his benefit is stopped. This is real life and personal examples which affect lives. People like you who post crap because you are unable to debate on a sensible level piss me off completely.
It is patently obvious to me that you have never dealt with the chronically sick/disabled people.
ps the cardboard box moving exercise is just one of the tests, not the be all end all.
So, the real point of your original post is that you have a brother on SIckness Benefit and he (and you) are worried that the new criteria may mean he loses some or all of it.Don't preach to me about how the ill/disabled feel about ethics, my kid Sister suffered a brain tumour at 16 years of age, she passed away in a hospice at 24 years of age with her family at her bedside, including me, so don't you dare preach to me. My eldest Brother is also suffering from an inoperable brain tumour, he collapsed at work and since then 13 years have passed by. He is on constant medication to keep him alive, he suffers dreadful effects from the tumour and medication. He is currently awaiting his ESA assessment interview and is worried out of his life asking me how he will get by if his benefit is stopped. This is real life and personal examples which affect lives. People like you who post crap because you are unable to debate on a sensible level piss me off completely.
It is patently obvious to me that you have never dealt with the chronically sick/disabled people.
ps the cardboard box moving exercise is just one of the tests, not the be all end all.
If he is unable to work, due to a 13 year brain tumour with substantial ill effects, do your really think he will be assessed fit to work?
Really?
Not all "work" is manual labour, in fact in the UK now aren't we supposed to be a service industry country - call centres, finance, IT etc... and a lot of those jobs don't require full physical ability: mental ability, yes, physical no. If you can get yourself out of bed of a morning, then you can do a days work of some kind, even if its working for yourself at home.
mondeoman said:
I'd like to ask what he does all day? Without be-littleing your brother, there aren't many illnesses that stop you doing something 5 days a week.
Not all "work" is manual labour, in fact in the UK now aren't we supposed to be a service industry country - call centres, finance, IT etc... and a lot of those jobs don't require full physical ability: mental ability, yes, physical no. If you can get yourself out of bed of a morning, then you can do a days work of some kind, even if its working for yourself at home.
I could easily imagine someone with a tumour suffering from a multitude of issues making them incapable of both manual or desk based work.Not all "work" is manual labour, in fact in the UK now aren't we supposed to be a service industry country - call centres, finance, IT etc... and a lot of those jobs don't require full physical ability: mental ability, yes, physical no. If you can get yourself out of bed of a morning, then you can do a days work of some kind, even if its working for yourself at home.
I don't think it is a good idea to personalise this debate.
Regarding Chemotherapy, when my wife was being treated for breast cancer, she scheduled her Chemo for the last thing on a Friday afternoon.
That way, she would feel like crap all weekend on her own time but go back to work on the Monday.
Funnily enough, she was working for the local council at the time so she really could have took the piss and took 6 months off on the sick but chose not to and did it without complaint.
Well apart from moaning that her head was cold because her hair fell out
That way, she would feel like crap all weekend on her own time but go back to work on the Monday.
Funnily enough, she was working for the local council at the time so she really could have took the piss and took 6 months off on the sick but chose not to and did it without complaint.
Well apart from moaning that her head was cold because her hair fell out
johnfm said:
mondeoman said:
I'd like to ask what he does all day? Without be-littleing your brother, there aren't many illnesses that stop you doing something 5 days a week.
Not all "work" is manual labour, in fact in the UK now aren't we supposed to be a service industry country - call centres, finance, IT etc... and a lot of those jobs don't require full physical ability: mental ability, yes, physical no. If you can get yourself out of bed of a morning, then you can do a days work of some kind, even if its working for yourself at home.
I could easily imagine someone with a tumour suffering from a multitude of issues making them incapable of both manual or desk based work.Not all "work" is manual labour, in fact in the UK now aren't we supposed to be a service industry country - call centres, finance, IT etc... and a lot of those jobs don't require full physical ability: mental ability, yes, physical no. If you can get yourself out of bed of a morning, then you can do a days work of some kind, even if its working for yourself at home.
I don't think it is a good idea to personalise this debate.
k you over totally.The point I was trying to make was that, if you are mentally competent and have the physical strength to get yourself out of bed, then there are productive things that you can do that don't necessarily require you going into an office or a factory.
HD Adam said:
Regarding Chemotherapy, when my wife was being treated for breast cancer, she scheduled her Chemo for the last thing on a Friday afternoon.
That way, she would feel like crap all weekend on her own time but go back to work on the Monday.
Funnily enough, she was working for the local council at the time so she really could have took the piss and took 6 months off on the sick but chose not to and did it without complaint.
Well apart from moaning that her head was cold because her hair fell out
I've haven't chucked a sickie in my life but I really wouldn't begrudge someone with cancer taking advantage of whatever sick pay entitlements they have.That way, she would feel like crap all weekend on her own time but go back to work on the Monday.
Funnily enough, she was working for the local council at the time so she really could have took the piss and took 6 months off on the sick but chose not to and did it without complaint.
Well apart from moaning that her head was cold because her hair fell out
HundredthIdiot said:
HD Adam said:
Regarding Chemotherapy, when my wife was being treated for breast cancer, she scheduled her Chemo for the last thing on a Friday afternoon.
That way, she would feel like crap all weekend on her own time but go back to work on the Monday.
Funnily enough, she was working for the local council at the time so she really could have took the piss and took 6 months off on the sick but chose not to and did it without complaint.
Well apart from moaning that her head was cold because her hair fell out
I've haven't chucked a sickie in my life but I really wouldn't begrudge someone with cancer taking advantage of whatever sick pay entitlements they have.That way, she would feel like crap all weekend on her own time but go back to work on the Monday.
Funnily enough, she was working for the local council at the time so she really could have took the piss and took 6 months off on the sick but chose not to and did it without complaint.
Well apart from moaning that her head was cold because her hair fell out
rich1231 said:
crankedup said:
Then post up my remark where I have said box lifting is not a valid test. Frankly you are over exaggerating my posts, why I do not know, however, I have acknowledged the fact that the ill/disabled may want to work, indeed many do. If you can read back my posts you will read that I have tried to be reasonable in acknowledging that not all those affected by illness/disabilities would want nothing else but to work. But the debate is not about those people, it is about those unable to work being deemed fit to do so.
Don't preach to me about how the ill/disabled feel about ethics, my kid Sister suffered a brain tumour at 16 years of age, she passed away in a hospice at 24 years of age with her family at her bedside, including me, so don't you dare preach to me. My eldest Brother is also suffering from an inoperable brain tumour, he collapsed at work and since then 13 years have passed by. He is on constant medication to keep him alive, he suffers dreadful effects from the tumour and medication. He is currently awaiting his ESA assessment interview and is worried out of his life asking me how he will get by if his benefit is stopped. This is real life and personal examples which affect lives. People like you who post crap because you are unable to debate on a sensible level piss me off completely.
It is patently obvious to me that you have never dealt with the chronically sick/disabled people.
ps the cardboard box moving exercise is just one of the tests, not the be all end all.
How would you know what I have had to deal with or anyone else for that matter, please don't make assumptions, you really will just end up looking more of a tDon't preach to me about how the ill/disabled feel about ethics, my kid Sister suffered a brain tumour at 16 years of age, she passed away in a hospice at 24 years of age with her family at her bedside, including me, so don't you dare preach to me. My eldest Brother is also suffering from an inoperable brain tumour, he collapsed at work and since then 13 years have passed by. He is on constant medication to keep him alive, he suffers dreadful effects from the tumour and medication. He is currently awaiting his ESA assessment interview and is worried out of his life asking me how he will get by if his benefit is stopped. This is real life and personal examples which affect lives. People like you who post crap because you are unable to debate on a sensible level piss me off completely.
It is patently obvious to me that you have never dealt with the chronically sick/disabled people.
ps the cardboard box moving exercise is just one of the tests, not the be all end all.
t that you already do.Don't use specific examples if you don't want them challenged.
One day when you have grown up you may look back and think about your callous selfish and shallow mindedness. It is patently obvious that you have had zero experiences of dealing with sick/disabled from the tone of your replies throughout this debate. I suggest it is you that is looking like a fool.
johnfm said:
crankedup said:
Then post up my remark where I have said box lifting is not a valid test. Frankly you are over exaggerating my posts, why I do not know, however, I have acknowledged the fact that the ill/disabled may want to work, indeed many do. If you can read back my posts you will read that I have tried to be reasonable in acknowledging that not all those affected by illness/disabilities would want nothing else but to work. But the debate is not about those people, it is about those unable to work being deemed fit to do so.
Don't preach to me about how the ill/disabled feel about ethics, my kid Sister suffered a brain tumour at 16 years of age, she passed away in a hospice at 24 years of age with her family at her bedside, including me, so don't you dare preach to me. My eldest Brother is also suffering from an inoperable brain tumour, he collapsed at work and since then 13 years have passed by. He is on constant medication to keep him alive, he suffers dreadful effects from the tumour and medication. He is currently awaiting his ESA assessment interview and is worried out of his life asking me how he will get by if his benefit is stopped. This is real life and personal examples which affect lives. People like you who post crap because you are unable to debate on a sensible level piss me off completely.
It is patently obvious to me that you have never dealt with the chronically sick/disabled people.
ps the cardboard box moving exercise is just one of the tests, not the be all end all.
So, the real point of your original post is that you have a brother on SIckness Benefit and he (and you) are worried that the new criteria may mean he loses some or all of it.Don't preach to me about how the ill/disabled feel about ethics, my kid Sister suffered a brain tumour at 16 years of age, she passed away in a hospice at 24 years of age with her family at her bedside, including me, so don't you dare preach to me. My eldest Brother is also suffering from an inoperable brain tumour, he collapsed at work and since then 13 years have passed by. He is on constant medication to keep him alive, he suffers dreadful effects from the tumour and medication. He is currently awaiting his ESA assessment interview and is worried out of his life asking me how he will get by if his benefit is stopped. This is real life and personal examples which affect lives. People like you who post crap because you are unable to debate on a sensible level piss me off completely.
It is patently obvious to me that you have never dealt with the chronically sick/disabled people.
ps the cardboard box moving exercise is just one of the tests, not the be all end all.
If he is unable to work, due to a 13 year brain tumour with substantial ill effects, do your really think he will be assessed fit to work?
Really?
mondeoman said:
johnfm said:
crankedup said:
Then post up my remark where I have said box lifting is not a valid test. Frankly you are over exaggerating my posts, why I do not know, however, I have acknowledged the fact that the ill/disabled may want to work, indeed many do. If you can read back my posts you will read that I have tried to be reasonable in acknowledging that not all those affected by illness/disabilities would want nothing else but to work. But the debate is not about those people, it is about those unable to work being deemed fit to do so.
Don't preach to me about how the ill/disabled feel about ethics, my kid Sister suffered a brain tumour at 16 years of age, she passed away in a hospice at 24 years of age with her family at her bedside, including me, so don't you dare preach to me. My eldest Brother is also suffering from an inoperable brain tumour, he collapsed at work and since then 13 years have passed by. He is on constant medication to keep him alive, he suffers dreadful effects from the tumour and medication. He is currently awaiting his ESA assessment interview and is worried out of his life asking me how he will get by if his benefit is stopped. This is real life and personal examples which affect lives. People like you who post crap because you are unable to debate on a sensible level piss me off completely.
It is patently obvious to me that you have never dealt with the chronically sick/disabled people.
ps the cardboard box moving exercise is just one of the tests, not the be all end all.
So, the real point of your original post is that you have a brother on SIckness Benefit and he (and you) are worried that the new criteria may mean he loses some or all of it.Don't preach to me about how the ill/disabled feel about ethics, my kid Sister suffered a brain tumour at 16 years of age, she passed away in a hospice at 24 years of age with her family at her bedside, including me, so don't you dare preach to me. My eldest Brother is also suffering from an inoperable brain tumour, he collapsed at work and since then 13 years have passed by. He is on constant medication to keep him alive, he suffers dreadful effects from the tumour and medication. He is currently awaiting his ESA assessment interview and is worried out of his life asking me how he will get by if his benefit is stopped. This is real life and personal examples which affect lives. People like you who post crap because you are unable to debate on a sensible level piss me off completely.
It is patently obvious to me that you have never dealt with the chronically sick/disabled people.
ps the cardboard box moving exercise is just one of the tests, not the be all end all.
If he is unable to work, due to a 13 year brain tumour with substantial ill effects, do your really think he will be assessed fit to work?
Really?
Not all "work" is manual labour, in fact in the UK now aren't we supposed to be a service industry country - call centres, finance, IT etc... and a lot of those jobs don't require full physical ability: mental ability, yes, physical no. If you can get yourself out of bed of a morning, then you can do a days work of some kind, even if its working for yourself at home.
He tries to make light of his health problems, reads books as much as he can, enjoys his interest in flight and an all round good guy.
To all the people that shout out about ill health malingerers I suggest they spend a little time visiting some day hospitals on a voluntary basis for an insight into genuine health problems. Sign up with the Samaritans for a while perhaps.
Again I am not supporting malingerers, I am supporting all those that suggest the Governments current assessment program is deeply flawed.
HeatonNorris said:
I'd don't know if cranked up is lucky, unlucky, or making it up as he goes along.
Lucky that he's the only one of 3 siblings not to get a brain tumour.
Unlucky that he's the only one of 3 not to get one...
Or, if we believe in odds and statistics... not being entirely truthful.
Should you choose to call me a liar I can do little about it, other than assure you I do not lie. By the way, I do have three Bro's living and my Late Sister.Lucky that he's the only one of 3 siblings not to get a brain tumour.
Unlucky that he's the only one of 3 not to get one...
Or, if we believe in odds and statistics... not being entirely truthful.
crankedup said:
No he will not be deemed fit for work. But you try telling him that. He is irrational through illness.
Sure'y you've reassured him that whatever happens he'll be okay because, as his brother, you and the rest of your family will look out for him and ensure he's taken care of?
crankedup said:
His day may consist of normal morning ablutions, albeit at a slow pace. He may have been up for a couple of hours and he will suffer a seizure (otherwise known commonly as a fit). This will last possibly for 10 minutes or give and take a few minutes, and an hour to recover. This episode could be repeated for up to five or six times a day or on a good day just a couple of times if his 'lucky'. He may go for a short walk with his faithful dog in the knowledge he may suffer a 'fit' at any time. He has on many occasions collapsed and 'fitted', once in the middle of a road. He is well known and liked within the neighbourhood, invariably he will be seen and looked after, his dog by his side. His short term memory is almost non existent and levels of concentration extremely low. These are the obvious signs of his illness to me and they are 24/7, many times he 'fits' at night very rare I that he will get a nights sleep, if ever.
Sounds perfect for the council, perhaps in the post room.crankedup said:
Oakey said:
Do you really think he's going to be deemed fit for work?
No he will not be deemed fit for work. But you try telling him that. He is irrational through illness.andymadmak said:
So the problem is not that the assessment process - a process which you concede would not change his status, but rather your brothers irrational interpretation of it...... How is any change supposed to be made then, if the irrational are going to constantly missinterpret what is being put forward?
Given the 40% successful appeal rate*, it would appear that the degree of incorrect interpretation by those administering the tests is significant.- Not forgetting how much money this wastes.
Sticks. said:
andymadmak said:
So the problem is not that the assessment process - a process which you concede would not change his status, but rather your brothers irrational interpretation of it...... How is any change supposed to be made then, if the irrational are going to constantly missinterpret what is being put forward?
Given the 40% successful appeal rate*, it would appear that the degree of incorrect interpretation by those administering the tests is significant.- Not forgetting how much money this wastes.
Which further begs the questions "Is there any such thing as a 100% foolproof assessment program" and "How (can?) the present system be improved, given that there are always going to be people who set out to defraud the system and who will even find ways around the appeals process?"
turbobloke said:
HundredthIdiot said:
HD Adam said:
Regarding Chemotherapy, when my wife was being treated for breast cancer, she scheduled her Chemo for the last thing on a Friday afternoon.
That way, she would feel like crap all weekend on her own time but go back to work on the Monday.
Funnily enough, she was working for the local council at the time so she really could have took the piss and took 6 months off on the sick but chose not to and did it without complaint.
Well apart from moaning that her head was cold because her hair fell out
I've haven't chucked a sickie in my life but I really wouldn't begrudge someone with cancer taking advantage of whatever sick pay entitlements they have.That way, she would feel like crap all weekend on her own time but go back to work on the Monday.
Funnily enough, she was working for the local council at the time so she really could have took the piss and took 6 months off on the sick but chose not to and did it without complaint.
Well apart from moaning that her head was cold because her hair fell out
She didn't want to sit around at home and admit to herself that she was actually ill or recovering and secondly, she is a bit like the Black Knight from Monty Python.
Knight: Your leg is completely off
Wife: It's just a scratch, I've had worse etc
No sympathy in my house unless you are actually dead and then it wouldn't matter
Gassing Station | News, Politics & Economics | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff