Are the left wing less tolerant of the views of others?
Discussion
FredClogs said:
I'm intolerant of anyone who thinks that the designators "left wing" and "right wing" hold any significant meaning other than for petty tribalism. That said as a pinko, liberal some would say "lefty", commie/anarcho syndicalist I would say I'm pretty tolerant of any views that are expressed without insult, bullying, abuse or intolerance, but if someone's wrong then they're wrong and it's not intolerant to point that out.
Do you mean factually wrong or ideologically wrong?anonymous said:
[redacted]
Yes. We are all different and have differing opinions and beliefs. We should not set out to punish others for not agreeing with our views or lifestyles as it makes us hypocrites and in many ways worse. The whole point of this thread is to debate whether leftists are incapable of considering or accepting other peoples opinions or beliefs.
Lets not get into a whole gay debate and go totally off topic i simply used it as an example point.
Smollet said:
Do you mean factually wrong or ideologically wrong?
Ideologically I think. I've been called names by a staunch labour voter purely because I asked her some questions regarding her opinions. Just questioning them meant the response was "You sound like a Tory", her exact words. I'm not, but the fact I didn't agree with her meant I must have been.That's the sort of mindset I can't stand, it removes any form of debate, and, as far as I'm concerned, is designed to put you in a box that isn't the one they live in such that they can, in their mind, blank out any other opinion.
On the flip-side there are those that like to post things on Facebook, such as "f
k Tory scum" regarding the refugee problem (I'm not sure how the Conservatives caused that problem, but I think they mean their response, or lack of, in their mind, but, oh I'm not going to get into that), and regarding the 4000 that were supposedly fit to work, but then died, I've read about the "Tory mass murder".I wonder if I should say this, but all of that is from one person, who, at the time was deemed not fit to work by her doctor because of mental health issues (which is fair enough, I know how bad that can be via second-hand experience), yet she was fit enough - whilst still signed off work - to be at the front of the last big BBC protest, waving a huge flag with a big smile on her face. I'm sure I'm just misunderstanding something, but to my mind, if I was signed off work by my doctor, the last thing I'd consider would be to travel to my employer's front gate - who are still paying me full wage despite being signed off sick - to protest against them.
Smollet said:
FredClogs said:
I'm intolerant of anyone who thinks that the designators "left wing" and "right wing" hold any significant meaning other than for petty tribalism. That said as a pinko, liberal some would say "lefty", commie/anarcho syndicalist I would say I'm pretty tolerant of any views that are expressed without insult, bullying, abuse or intolerance, but if someone's wrong then they're wrong and it's not intolerant to point that out.
Do you mean factually wrong or ideologically wrong?FredClogs said:
Both, most peoples ideology's are built on a conception of matters of fact, and pure faith sometimes as well but not so much, so to espouse the scientology religion you have to hold certain incorrect facts a true or the whole ideology c crumbles, likewise conservatism.
Perhaps I should've said political ideology as religious ideology defies all factual logic as far as I can.Smollet said:
FredClogs said:
Both, most peoples ideology's are built on a conception of matters of fact, and pure faith sometimes as well but not so much, so to espouse the scientology religion you have to hold certain incorrect facts a true or the whole ideology c crumbles, likewise conservatism.
Perhaps I should've said political ideology as religious ideology defies all factual logic as far as I can.There is as many brain fart ideas in political ideology as there is in religion, they're just not universally held and more often debated which kind of waters down that many people do actually hold and believe them to be facts, Conservatism has a whole set of axioms that people believe and regurgitate that are incredibly silly if actually interrogated - belief in the divine right of the Monarchy is just one of them.
FredClogs said:
So the support of Monarchical rule by divine right is logical is it?
There is as many brain fart ideas in political ideology as there is in religion, they're just not universally held and more often debated which kind of waters down that many people do actually hold and believe them to be facts, Conservatism has a whole set of axioms that people believe and regurgitate that are incredibly silly if actually interrogated - belief in the divine right of the Monarchy is just one of them.
You have more straw men than ever envisioned by the CAP. Divine right was removed during the English civil war (well some would say as far back as the Magna Carta) .There is as many brain fart ideas in political ideology as there is in religion, they're just not universally held and more often debated which kind of waters down that many people do actually hold and believe them to be facts, Conservatism has a whole set of axioms that people believe and regurgitate that are incredibly silly if actually interrogated - belief in the divine right of the Monarchy is just one of them.
Jinx said:
FredClogs said:
So the support of Monarchical rule by divine right is logical is it?
There is as many brain fart ideas in political ideology as there is in religion, they're just not universally held and more often debated which kind of waters down that many people do actually hold and believe them to be facts, Conservatism has a whole set of axioms that people believe and regurgitate that are incredibly silly if actually interrogated - belief in the divine right of the Monarchy is just one of them.
You have more straw men than ever envisioned by the CAP. Divine right was removed during the English civil war (well some would say as far back as the Magna Carta) .There is as many brain fart ideas in political ideology as there is in religion, they're just not universally held and more often debated which kind of waters down that many people do actually hold and believe them to be facts, Conservatism has a whole set of axioms that people believe and regurgitate that are incredibly silly if actually interrogated - belief in the divine right of the Monarchy is just one of them.
FredClogs said:
The divine right to rule may have been lost with the introduction of Lords and Parliament but the divine right of a Monarch to be a Monarch is still very much part of Conservative ideology, isn't it? As are hereditary peerages.
Short answer no. You are confusing Conservative with the Aristocracy - easy mistake to make but not interchangeable.Anyone see Panorama on Corbyn last night? The filming at the socialist labour festival was truly frightening, a baying mob of anarchists complete with soap dodger waving her Maggie Thatcher coffin in the air while Len McCluskey spout his vile anti-Tory eulogy.
Not something you see at the Tory party conference.
Not something you see at the Tory party conference.
Jinx said:
FredClogs said:
The divine right to rule may have been lost with the introduction of Lords and Parliament but the divine right of a Monarch to be a Monarch is still very much part of Conservative ideology, isn't it? As are hereditary peerages.
Short answer no. You are confusing Conservative with the Aristocracy - easy mistake to make but not interchangeable.jogon said:
Anyone see Panorama on Corbyn last night? The filming at the socialist labour festival was truly frightening, a baying mob of anarchists complete with soap dodger waving her Maggie Thatcher coffin in the air while Len McCluskey spout his vile anti-Tory eulogy.
Not something you see at the Tory party conference.
Remember the scenes, not shown on TV much but reported widely, when Labour won in 1997 and the Conservative staff were vacating ministerial offices, there were lines of Labour supporters hurling abuse as they walked past and many admin staff basically young women were in tears. Charming stuff and again we didn't see that from Tory supporters when Labour were booted out in 2010. The UK political Left may have a tolerant and polite element but it must be in permanent hiding.Not something you see at the Tory party conference.
turbobloke said:
Remember the scenes, not shown on TV much but reported widely, when Labour won in 1997 and the Conservative staff were vacating ministerial offices, there were lines of Labour supporters hurling abuse as they walked past and many admin staff basically young women were in tears. Charming stuff and again we didn't see that from Tory supporters when Labour were booted out in 2010. The UK political Left may have a tolerant and polite element but it must be in permanent hiding.
Errr... Have you read the Dianne Abbott thread on here?FredClogs said:
Both, most peoples ideology's are built on a conception of matters of fact, and pure faith sometimes as well but not so much, so to espouse the scientology religion you have to hold certain incorrect facts a true or the whole ideology c crumbles, likewise conservatism.
Perhaps I should've said political ideology as religious ideology defies all factual logic as far as I can.Jinx said:
FredClogs said:
Errr... Have you read the Dianne Abbott thread on here?
Does she read Pistonheads' Forums?It's one of the these I find admirable about the "left", the belief ingrained in "leftism" about the importance of direct action and confrontation - it's necessary. The Conservative types do get a bit heated when it comes to countryside stuff though, those country side alliance types don't mind a bit of shouting - but apart from that their lack of visibilty has more to do with them not having much to complain about rather than any genetic propensity to violence. But you're right you'd never find the British "right" shouting insults at people in the street, would you?
FredClogs said:
Jinx said:
FredClogs said:
Errr... Have you read the Dianne Abbott thread on here?
Does she read Pistonheads' Forums?It's one of the these I find admirable about the "left", the belief ingrained in "leftism" about the importance of direct action and confrontation - it's necessary. The Conservative types do get a bit heated when it comes to countryside stuff though, those country side alliance types don't mind a bit of shouting - but apart from that their lack of visibilty has more to do with them not having much to complain about rather than any genetic propensity to violence. But you're right you'd never find the British "right" shouting insults at people in the street, would you?
Confrontation is surely only 'necessary' when you've lost the debate, or in 1997, won an election and want to abuse the other Party's staff. Or with the Left any number of excuses to cause mayhem, destroy property, assault police and so on.
Edited by turbobloke on Tuesday 8th September 10:15
Gassing Station | News, Politics & Economics | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff