Scottish Referendum / Independence - Vol 5
Discussion
exitwound said:
Yes I'm a Scot, but I detest all the stuff that goes with it, the nationalism, flagwaving, braveheart crap..
I just want us to be running our own show, with whatever resources we have. I want our votes to count for something up here.
The virulent reactions to my original post says only one thing, ..the UK is running scared that we leave, ..you don't want us, thats obvious, so why not encourage the Yes vote, ..got a problem with that?? If so what?
Yes I work in the NHS at a high profile post, but I retire soon and am willing to take the leap of faith.. As I said, their is no alternative except more and more misery foisted upon us by Westminster.
Oddly enough, there are more Yes votes among the non-Scot settlers up here than the actual Scots, ..explain that one!
Personally, I don't believe that us Scots have the balls to go for it, they want it, but are too scared to take the chance..
Cheers..
A) What "Misery" ?? There is no "Misery" foisted upon Scotland by anyone. That is just an outright (and quite pathetic) lie.I just want us to be running our own show, with whatever resources we have. I want our votes to count for something up here.
The virulent reactions to my original post says only one thing, ..the UK is running scared that we leave, ..you don't want us, thats obvious, so why not encourage the Yes vote, ..got a problem with that?? If so what?
Yes I work in the NHS at a high profile post, but I retire soon and am willing to take the leap of faith.. As I said, their is no alternative except more and more misery foisted upon us by Westminster.
Oddly enough, there are more Yes votes among the non-Scot settlers up here than the actual Scots, ..explain that one!
Personally, I don't believe that us Scots have the balls to go for it, they want it, but are too scared to take the chance..
Cheers..
B) You are right, we don't want you if you are going to behave like whinging selfish t
ts (but who does?). We do want people who want to be on the team.C) Running scared? Doubtful.
D) Running your own show? Good for you but what exactly/specifically do you think can be done that can't be achieved now?
E) Leap of faith? Excellent - good for you (and I mean that). Just as long as you accept the consequences & costs and don't expect me to pay for any of it.
F) More yes votes amongst non-Scots? Proof/Source/References please (or is this another nationalist "fact" that's been plucked from the ether like so many others?)
Its the same old Nationlist "flounce" I'm afraid. Westminster misery/You don't want us, that's obvious.
What are you people? In kindergarten? FFS grow up.
Borghetto said:
exitwound said:
Yes I work in the NHS at a high profile post, but I retire soon and am willing to take the leap of faith..
So I guess you'll have a nice secure index linked pension then. So what is this leap of faith you are going to make? It's the younger generations who will have their opportunities reduced. Nicely secure selfish people like you don't mind the risks, because you aren't really taking any.exitwound said:
The virulent reactions to my original post says only one thing, ..the UK is running scared that we leave, ..you don't want us, thats obvious,
Thats a complete contradiction. Either we are running scared that you leave, or we don't want you..... Which is it? Make your mind up!Either way your comment is just hysterical nonsense. I sincerely hope you did not have any position in the NHS that put you in charge of peoples lives.. Your approach to this debate is typical Nat nonsense. Why on earth will you just not answer the questions about currency union, the EU, Plan B, Pensions (although I note you'll probably be alright with your public sector pension) shipbuilding jobs, defence, security, cross border trade?
Hell just answer ONE of them at least instead of this "you don't want us" crap that would disgrace a 5 year old!
Why do Scotland want to leave one union whilst being desperate to get into another?
Nationalists will say that they will get better representation in the EU, but why would it be better? Who's going to listen to the issues affecting a small, thinly populated country? Who's going to have anything in common with such a country so as to found alliances against the major powers?
If the nationalists tell us they are too different to be in a union with the UK, why would they think that anywhere in the EU would have anything in common with them?
Nationalists will say that they will get better representation in the EU, but why would it be better? Who's going to listen to the issues affecting a small, thinly populated country? Who's going to have anything in common with such a country so as to found alliances against the major powers?
If the nationalists tell us they are too different to be in a union with the UK, why would they think that anywhere in the EU would have anything in common with them?
Rollin said:
Why do Scotland want to leave one union whilst being desperate to get into another?
EASYAll explained here
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/scotland/41...
McWigglebum4th said:
Now he's a man of the people though:"However, a BBC poll published last week found 71 per cent of people would vote against joining the Euro if it were put to a referendum. Only 23 per cent would support the move, while six per cent were unsure."
Rollin said:
Why do Scotland want to leave one union whilst being desperate to get into another?
This is one of those important questions the Nats on here can't answer. On the one hand they want to leave the UK union to have more self determination. On the other hand they want to rejoin the EU.If that is allowed at all it will NOT be on the terms enjoyed by the Uk currently and from which Scotland benefits. Instead they will have to take the terms of new entrants, for example open borders, no rebate, submitting budgets for checking, and of course a commitment to take the Euro.
The result will be less self determination than now.
The irony is of course that their self determination is due to get a significant boost under the Scotland Act including taxation stuff, all due in 2016. So vote yes for less self determination and no for more.
I expect the Nats to agree to this forthwith seeng as how self determination, and not racism, is their driving force. Apparently.
steveatesh said:
Rollin said:
Why do Scotland want to leave one union whilst being desperate to get into another?
This is one of those important questions the Nats on here can't answer. On the one hand they want to leave the UK union to have more self determination. On the other hand they want to rejoin the EU.If that is allowed at all it will NOT be on the terms enjoyed by the Uk currently and from which Scotland benefits. Instead they will have to take the terms of new entrants, for example open borders, no rebate, submitting budgets for checking, and of course a commitment to take the Euro.
The result will be less self determination than now.
The irony is of course that their self determination is due to get a significant boost under the Scotland Act including taxation stuff, all due in 2016. So vote yes for less self determination and no for more.
I expect the Nats to agree to this forthwith seeng as how self determination, and not racism, is their driving force. Apparently.
SPITE TO BITE FACE NOSE OFF
Gaspode said:
The reality is, ..is that there is no choice for Scots, ..as if you vote Yes, your voting against your own country and as such, you aren't a Brit or don't wish to be.
Like 62% of my fellows I indicated that I felt Scottish only, not British at all, in the last Census.My country is Scotland, I have never been nor do I have any desire to be, a Brit.
I'll be voting "Yes".
Gaspode said:
Oh and BTW, did anyone else hear that Professor guy on Radio 4 yesterday morning point out that under international law Scotland would only be entitled to keep 8% of the oil revenue? Good luck with the Nats trying to 'negotiate' that percentage up
Nope, got any more info on that?Would blow another rather large hole in the yessers claims..
A.J.M said:
Gaspode said:
Oh and BTW, did anyone else hear that Professor guy on Radio 4 yesterday morning point out that under international law Scotland would only be entitled to keep 8% of the oil revenue? Good luck with the Nats trying to 'negotiate' that percentage up
Nope, got any more info on that?Would blow another rather large hole in the yessers claims..
http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/b609d594-97cc-11e3-ab60-...
fluffnik said:
Gaspode said:
The reality is, ..is that there is no choice for Scots, ..as if you vote Yes, your voting against your own country and as such, you aren't a Brit or don't wish to be.
Like 62% of my fellows I indicated that I felt Scottish only, not British at all, in the last Census.My country is Scotland, I have never been nor do I have any desire to be, a Brit.
I'll be voting "Yes".
How many felt European?
All sounds a bit UKIP/BNP to be honest.
fluffnik said:
Gaspode said:
The reality is, ..is that there is no choice for Scots, ..as if you vote Yes, your voting against your own country and as such, you aren't a Brit or don't wish to be.
Like 62% of my fellows I indicated that I felt Scottish only, not British at all, in the last Census.My country is Scotland, I have never been nor do I have any desire to be, a Brit.
I'll be voting "Yes".
I can't help feeling that Scots who like to brag about not being British are just, well, there isn't an easy way to say this, but well, a
holes? Am I wrong?fluffnik said:
Gaspode said:
The reality is, ..is that there is no choice for Scots, ..as if you vote Yes, your voting against your own country and as such, you aren't a Brit or don't wish to be.
Like 62% of my fellows I indicated that I felt Scottish only, not British at all, in the last Census.My country is Scotland, I have never been nor do I have any desire to be, a Brit.
I'll be voting "Yes".
Are you actually this misguided and completely unable to put aside the jingoism and look at the FACTS? It's been clearly shown that so many things the SNP insist will happen simply won't (a currency union will be political poison in the rUK, no party will touch it, the upper echelons of the EU 'command' have clearly stated that EU membership would be 'nearly impossible', requiring all member states to agree to it and even in the infinitesimally small case that you do get membership, you'll be required to cede so many rights and powers to Brussels it'll make your head spin and your wallet hurt) yet you'll still vote for it?
The SNP are taking Scots for mugs. Lies, bluff and bluster. If you're buying their bulls
t then I would strongly suggest that you take a step back and have a long, hard chat with yourself.Your argument should not be with us here in England, Wales and NI. You should be poking every hole you can in the SNP's policies, testing the strength of their assertions and asking, "In the event we do this, how can you be certain we're not just jumping into an abyss?"
The SNP have ZERO credibility in my view; why won't they tell you what plan B is on the currency (no £ - got that?) or the EU (no membership - got that?). Stop being jingoistic and ask yourself what's really in Scotland's best interests. What can you not do now that you want to, safe with the benefits our combined resources, risk mitigation and commonality of goals provides?
If you think we'll welcome you back with open arms or bail you out once the s
t hits the fans, you've got another think coming. rUK's feelings toward Scotland post-vote will frosty in the event of a 'no' but arctic in the event of a 'yes'.We don't want you to leave but if you do............you're on your own.
Funk said:
fluffnik said:
Gaspode said:
The reality is, ..is that there is no choice for Scots, ..as if you vote Yes, your voting against your own country and as such, you aren't a Brit or don't wish to be.
Like 62% of my fellows I indicated that I felt Scottish only, not British at all, in the last Census.My country is Scotland, I have never been nor do I have any desire to be, a Brit.
I'll be voting "Yes".
Are you actually this misguided and completely unable to put aside the jingoism and look at the FACTS? It's been clearly shown that so many things the SNP insist will happen simply won't (a currency union will be political poison in the rUK, no party will touch it, the upper echelons of the EU 'command' have clearly stated that EU membership would be 'nearly impossible', requiring all member states to agree to it and even in the infinitesimally small case that you do get membership, you'll be required to cede so many rights and powers to Brussels it'll make your head spin and your wallet hurt) yet you'll still vote for it?
The SNP are taking Scots for mugs. Lies, bluff and bluster. If you're buying their bulls
t then I would strongly suggest that you take a step back and have a long, hard chat with yourself.Your argument should not be with us here in England, Wales and NI. You should be poking every hole you can in the SNP's policies, testing the strength of their assertions and asking, "In the event we do this, how can you be certain we're not just jumping into an abyss?"
The SNP have ZERO credibility in my view; why won't they tell you what plan B is on the currency (no £ - got that?) or the EU (no membership - got that?). Stop being jingoistic and ask yourself what's really in Scotland's best interests. What can you not do now that you want to, safe with the benefits our combined resources, risk mitigation and commonality of goals provides?
If you think we'll welcome you back with open arms or bail you out once the s
t hits the fans, you've got another think coming. rUK's feelings toward Scotland post-vote will frosty in the event of a 'no' but arctic in the event of a 'yes'.We don't want you to leave but if you do............you're on your own.
All Al Queda needed to do to destabilise the UK was to shout "Freedom", buy some tartan, export some whiskey and Bob's your uncle..
Gaspode said:
A.J.M said:
Gaspode said:
Oh and BTW, did anyone else hear that Professor guy on Radio 4 yesterday morning point out that under international law Scotland would only be entitled to keep 8% of the oil revenue? Good luck with the Nats trying to 'negotiate' that percentage up
Nope, got any more info on that?Would blow another rather large hole in the yessers claims..
http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/b609d594-97cc-11e3-ab60-...
Gaspode said:
Pay firewall any chance you can post the detail. A.J.M said:
Gaspode said:
A.J.M said:
Gaspode said:
Oh and BTW, did anyone else hear that Professor guy on Radio 4 yesterday morning point out that under international law Scotland would only be entitled to keep 8% of the oil revenue? Good luck with the Nats trying to 'negotiate' that percentage up
Nope, got any more info on that?Would blow another rather large hole in the yessers claims..
http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/b609d594-97cc-11e3-ab60-...
Oh, you haven't? This is why paywalls don't work.
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