The moon doesn't cause ocean tides, claims UKIP MP Carswell
Discussion
Pesty said:
I can't tell if he's mental purple track suit wearer or he really is a tidal expert talking about deeper cutting edge physics he's spent years looking into and the science is just about to recognise hip..
Anybody help me out? I'm leaning one way at the moment but we mock what we do not understand. So is there about to be a new breakthrough in science?
No.Anybody help me out? I'm leaning one way at the moment but we mock what we do not understand. So is there about to be a new breakthrough in science?
HTH.
It's intriguing that the usual remain wonks are now weighing in on Donal. You're all talking about exactly the same thing, of course you know that right? The only force involved is gravity. Whether you picture it in your head as a static system where the moon 'pulls' on the ocean nearest the most, then the earth , then the furthest ocean creating 2 ocean 'bulges' or whether you imagine a system in motion spinning around a center mass, each other with the nearest ocean pulled toward the moon and the furthest ocean on the outside 'flung' away creating, er, 2 ocean bulges. It's all the same thing, the forces and maths are the same regardless.
fblm said:
It's intriguing that the usual remain wonks are now weighing in on Donal. You're all talking about exactly the same thing, of course you know that right? The only force involved is gravity. Whether you picture it in your head as a static system where the moon 'pulls' on the ocean nearest the most, then the earth , then the furthest ocean creating 2 ocean 'bulges' or whether you imagine a system in motion spinning around a center mass, each other with the nearest ocean pulled toward the moon and the furthest ocean on the outside 'flung' away creating, er, 2 ocean bulges. It's all the same thing, the forces and maths are the same regardless.
I did wonder this myself, he never actually said the moon wasn't responsible for the tides iirc, just that it wasn't solely responsible? Oakey said:
fblm said:
It's intriguing that the usual remain wonks are now weighing in on Donal. You're all talking about exactly the same thing, of course you know that right? The only force involved is gravity. Whether you picture it in your head as a static system where the moon 'pulls' on the ocean nearest the most, then the earth , then the furthest ocean creating 2 ocean 'bulges' or whether you imagine a system in motion spinning around a center mass, each other with the nearest ocean pulled toward the moon and the furthest ocean on the outside 'flung' away creating, er, 2 ocean bulges. It's all the same thing, the forces and maths are the same regardless.
I did wonder this myself, he never actually said the moon wasn't responsible for the tides iirc, just that it wasn't solely responsible? Aha - maybe I can see what the problem is.
There are two meanings for "tide" -
i) the proper astronomical meaning - which is the effect of the gravitational gradient between two or more astronomical bodies.
ii) the more "common usage" meaning which involves the sea going in and out twice a day.
In i), there is no additional explanation. It is all to do with the gravitational pull of the bodies and how it acts over the distance between them
In ii), the gravitational aspect only explains some of the local phenomenon we associate with sea going in and out - such as different timings on different parts of the same coastline or different heights depending on local topography.
The strictly correct meaning is i).
There are two meanings for "tide" -
i) the proper astronomical meaning - which is the effect of the gravitational gradient between two or more astronomical bodies.
ii) the more "common usage" meaning which involves the sea going in and out twice a day.
In i), there is no additional explanation. It is all to do with the gravitational pull of the bodies and how it acts over the distance between them
In ii), the gravitational aspect only explains some of the local phenomenon we associate with sea going in and out - such as different timings on different parts of the same coastline or different heights depending on local topography.
The strictly correct meaning is i).
fblm said:
It's intriguing that the usual remain wonks are now weighing in on Donal. You're all talking about exactly the same thing, of course you know that right? The only force involved is gravity. Whether you picture it in your head as a static system where the moon 'pulls' on the ocean nearest the most, then the earth , then the furthest ocean creating 2 ocean 'bulges' or whether you imagine a system in motion spinning around a center mass, each other with the nearest ocean pulled toward the moon and the furthest ocean on the outside 'flung' away creating, er, 2 ocean bulges. It's all the same thing, the forces and maths are the same regardless.
Ah, I see, he's completely right, but the "remain wonks" and the scientists (mere experts, after all, and probably remain wonks too) are saying he's wrong out of spite because leave won the referendum.Is that it?
Zod said:
Ah, I see, he's completely right, but the "remain wonks" and the scientists (mere experts, after all, and probably remain wonks too) are saying he's wrong out of spite because leave won the referendum.
Is that it?
Save your breath and read my subsequent post. I'm just amused watching PH's resident remainers round on a flailing UKIPer. That'll teach them!Is that it?
fblm said:
I'm just amused watching PH's resident remainers round on a flailing UKIPer.
Not as hilarious as UKIPers trying to prove their sole hero MP is not wrong when he says the tides are not caused by the moon.It is almost as if Carswell is making a point. "We made them all believe the EU and migrants were bogey men, our power is now complete, watch me change the laws of physics, and they'll lap it up without question!"
And right on cue they prove him right. Baaaaa!
Only joking obviously.
This is a long 9 minutes but he reckons it explains it all: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pwChk4S99i4
fblm said:
Zod said:
Ah, I see, he's completely right, but the "remain wonks" and the scientists (mere experts, after all, and probably remain wonks too) are saying he's wrong out of spite because leave won the referendum.
Is that it?
Save your breath and read my subsequent post. I'm just amused watching PH's resident remainers round on a flailing UKIPer. That'll teach them!Is that it?
julianm said:
This is a long 9 minutes but he reckons it explains it all: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pwChk4S99i4
I tend to accept that it will sort itself out in the end.
julianm said:
This is a long 9 minutes but he reckons it explains it all: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pwChk4S99i4
Excellent video. Don watch that. Great channel that's going to kill a few hours
TwigtheWonderkid said:
elster said:
TwigtheWonderkid said:
s2art said:
You really, really dont understand. Newton figured all this out hundreds of years ago. Find a physics textbook and read up on the subject.
It's unreal. People are actually arguing about something that was proved beyond all doubt several hundred f
king years ago!!!!Brian Cox explains it here in a way that my cat could grasp.
Ffs.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WGKgKayuC2M
That is why science constantly is proven wrong, the whole point of science is just because you agree with something doesn't mean there shouldn't be people constantly trying to disprove the theorem.
And how is science constantly proven wrong? Is the world actually flat then, and does the Sun orbit the Earth. Science says not, when do you think it will be proven wrong?
Using the example of Newton above, scientists are constantly trying to disprove such a theory look at modified newton dynamics for example.
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