45th President of the United States, Donald Trump. Vol 2
Discussion
jsf said:
interesting meet the Press hour and 1/4.
Some of it was bonkers, some of it was OK.
The glint in his eye when he said he wont tell you what he is going to do about North Korea should have a few in that region s
tting bricks.
It's was probably because he hasn't got a fSome of it was bonkers, some of it was OK.
The glint in his eye when he said he wont tell you what he is going to do about North Korea should have a few in that region s
tting bricks.king clue what to do.He hasn't been told yet.
Greg66 said:
Are you fking kidding?
If MI6 or 5 leaked information that someone no 10 Downing Street had potentially been doing secret deals with a military enemy, had potentially received private benefits from those deals, and there was a question mark over whether PM might be involved too, of course I would want that leaked. It's called acting in the public interest: it is in the public interest to know about wrongdoing of that order, and the public interest in that example clearly outweighs public interest in keeping dealings of govt officials confidential.
Completely obvious, IMO.
You are ignoring two points.king kidding?If MI6 or 5 leaked information that someone no 10 Downing Street had potentially been doing secret deals with a military enemy, had potentially received private benefits from those deals, and there was a question mark over whether PM might be involved too, of course I would want that leaked. It's called acting in the public interest: it is in the public interest to know about wrongdoing of that order, and the public interest in that example clearly outweighs public interest in keeping dealings of govt officials confidential.
Completely obvious, IMO.
Firstly Russia is not formally our enemy. Secondly the only fact that has been proved is that Flynn was in private talks with Russian officials when he shouldn't have been (when still a private citizen). Once formally in office he would have been quite entitled to have the talks he did.
Everything else in your post is speculation and you make an assumption as to private benefit that is unsupported by any facts revealed to date. If we leave aside this obsession with private benefits what exactly in his utterances since becoming a candidate has led you to believe that Trump would be willing to sacrifice either American lives or treasure to guarantee the territorial integrity of the Ukraine?, and so, were it not for these secret "private interests", would be leading the good fight against Russia.
I voted Remain but when the vote went against me (and nearly half the population) I thought it wuld probably not end up as badly as I thought.
I didn't want Trump elected, when he was I thought it might not be as bad as we all expected and we might have some fun. It seems I was half right. He is by no means as bad as we all expected. If only.
I didn't want Trump elected, when he was I thought it might not be as bad as we all expected and we might have some fun. It seems I was half right. He is by no means as bad as we all expected. If only.
JagLover said:
Greg66 said:
Are you fking kidding?
If MI6 or 5 leaked information that someone no 10 Downing Street had potentially been doing secret deals with a military enemy, had potentially received private benefits from those deals, and there was a question mark over whether PM might be involved too, of course I would want that leaked. It's called acting in the public interest: it is in the public interest to know about wrongdoing of that order, and the public interest in that example clearly outweighs public interest in keeping dealings of govt officials confidential.
Completely obvious, IMO.
You are ignoring two points.king kidding?If MI6 or 5 leaked information that someone no 10 Downing Street had potentially been doing secret deals with a military enemy, had potentially received private benefits from those deals, and there was a question mark over whether PM might be involved too, of course I would want that leaked. It's called acting in the public interest: it is in the public interest to know about wrongdoing of that order, and the public interest in that example clearly outweighs public interest in keeping dealings of govt officials confidential.
Completely obvious, IMO.
Firstly Russia is not formally our enemy.
JagLover said:
Secondly the only fact that has been proved is that Flynn was in private talks with Russian officials when he shouldn't have been (when still a private citizen). Once formally in office he would have been quite entitled to have the talks he did.
He may have been, and if it was so innocent, why lie to the VP and them allow him to make a fool of himself in front of the media? Perhaps because it wasn't innocent at all.JagLover said:
Everything else in your post is speculation and you make an assumption as to private benefit that is unsupported by any facts revealed to date. If we leave aside this obsession with private benefits what exactly in his utterances since becoming a candidate has led you to believe that Trump would be willing to sacrifice either American lives or treasure to guarantee the territorial integrity of the Ukraine?, and so, were it not for these secret "private interests", would be leading the good fight against Russia.
Yes, we will see what else turns out to be true, I'm sure the secret services will have no qualms about ensuring Trump gets indicted if they feel he is committing treason by being in the pay of a foreign government. 
Classical liberal Dennis Kucinich, principled as always, points out that the intelligence deep state is pushing for war and to upend Trump admin.
Neocon/lib thuggery is alive and well.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N2yTkqwg-cE
Neocon/lib thuggery is alive and well.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N2yTkqwg-cE
JagLover said:
Greg66 said:
Are you fking kidding?
If MI6 or 5 leaked information that someone no 10 Downing Street had potentially been doing secret deals with a military enemy, had potentially received private benefits from those deals, and there was a question mark over whether PM might be involved too, of course I would want that leaked. It's called acting in the public interest: it is in the public interest to know about wrongdoing of that order, and the public interest in that example clearly outweighs public interest in keeping dealings of govt officials confidential.
Completely obvious, IMO.
You are ignoring two points.king kidding?If MI6 or 5 leaked information that someone no 10 Downing Street had potentially been doing secret deals with a military enemy, had potentially received private benefits from those deals, and there was a question mark over whether PM might be involved too, of course I would want that leaked. It's called acting in the public interest: it is in the public interest to know about wrongdoing of that order, and the public interest in that example clearly outweighs public interest in keeping dealings of govt officials confidential.
Completely obvious, IMO.
Firstly Russia is not formally our enemy. Secondly the only fact that has been proved is that Flynn was in private talks with Russian officials when he shouldn't have been (when still a private citizen). Once formally in office he would have been quite entitled to have the talks he did.
Everything else in your post is speculation and you make an assumption as to private benefit that is unsupported by any facts revealed to date. If we leave aside this obsession with private benefits what exactly in his utterances since becoming a candidate has led you to believe that Trump would be willing to sacrifice either American lives or treasure to guarantee the territorial integrity of the Ukraine?, and so, were it not for these secret "private interests", would be leading the good fight against Russia.
On the basis of what is now known, it is extraordinarily difficult to avoid the conclusion that Flynn spoke to Russia about Trump's administration lifting the sanctions that Obama had imposed. And then insulated Pence by not telling him. But Trump did know. And must have known Flynn was not entitled to talk about lifting those sanctions.
Now ask yourself: would Trump, the arch businessman, give something away? Or would he want something in return?
This is why I think it is important that this material is given publicity. There may be nothing in it, but it asks questions - lots - which deserve to be answered. I do not subscribe to the view that we can be confident that it's all legit, or that the fact that there may also be a political reason to leak de-legitimizes the enquiry, or the claim that "it's speculation" as if that is a complete answer.
The two points you make don't really seem to help you. "Not formally our enemy"? What does that mean? And the second one is undermined by your own statement: Flynn wasn't entitled to do what he did.
scherzkeks said:
Classical liberal Dennis Kucinich, principled as always, points out that the intelligence deep state is pushing for war and to upend Trump admin.
Neocon/lib thuggery is alive and well.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N2yTkqwg-cE
What did you think of his press conference performance?Neocon/lib thuggery is alive and well.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N2yTkqwg-cE
scherzkeks said:
FredClogs said:
Make no mistake Trump is stupid
Cognitive dissonance getting Fred again. He's in double-down mode!
He may be bad for the nation - opinions will differ - but he's smart as hell, and has good instincts.
I have to admit I thought it was quite funny when he was elected... just like Brexit it was a total slap in the face to the establishment and media. However this is no longer amusing... Trump is clearly unbalanced and I mean that in a "somebody needs to call the doctor" type of way... absolutely off his trolley. That press conference would make brilliant TV if the show was comedy/satire and not real life live news.
It can't be long before he gets impeached or the security services have him meet with a little accident can it?
It can't be long before he gets impeached or the security services have him meet with a little accident can it?
Just been watching his live stream on Youtube..
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y0f-v3Gmp-c
..Hillary had the questions to the debates in advance?!
Haha...sock it to 'em Trumpy.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y0f-v3Gmp-c
..Hillary had the questions to the debates in advance?!
Haha...sock it to 'em Trumpy.
VolvoT5 said:
I have to admit I thought it was quite funny when he was elected... just like Brexit it was a total slap in the face to the establishment and media. However this is no longer amusing... Trump is clearly unbalanced and I mean that in a "somebody needs to call the doctor" type of way... absolutely off his trolley. That press conference would make brilliant TV if the show was comedy/satire and not real life live news.
It can't be long before he gets impeached or the security services have him meet with a little accident can it?
It can't be long before he gets impeached or the security services have him meet with a little accident can it?
968 said:
Yes, we will see what else turns out to be true, I'm sure the secret services will have no qualms about ensuring Trump gets indicted if they feel he is committing treason by being in the pay of a foreign government.
Fire pan jumping.When "the spooks" select/deselect the elected then we are really in trouble.
Who would you want, Joe Stalin ?
Good to see true libertarians supporting democracy and the rightfully elected.
AmitG said:
IMHO Trump is many things, but stupid he is not. Despite having zero political experience, despite starting off as the joke candidate, and despite breaking all the rules in the "how to run for president" book, he beat every single candidate - including one who had effectively been interviewing for this job for years - and got the prize. He did so in a way that nobody had done before, and likely nobody will be able to repeat.
He may be bad for the nation - opinions will differ - but he's smart as hell, and has good instincts.
No, he's not smart, hence his incoherent ramblings whenever interviewed or giving a speech. What he does have on his side, however, is a team that have a clever strategy and have used media and (ironically) fake news cleverly to dupe disaffected voters into believing an (alleged) billionaire businessman is looking out for them. Conveniently the American public know him well as they see him on reality TV, which is his real occupation, so he's a 'trusted' face to many average americans. He may be bad for the nation - opinions will differ - but he's smart as hell, and has good instincts.
Stickyfinger said:
Fire pan jumping.
When "the spooks" select/deselect the elected then we are really in trouble.
Who would you want, Joe Stalin ?
Good to see true libertarians supporting democracy and the rightfully elected.
I fully support democracy but come on... the POTUS has to at least be a fit and proper person. How could anybody watch that press conference and not see the guy is unhinged? This is the guy with the codes to half the nukes in the world ffs. I reckon you could pull a random person off the street and it would be highly likely they would make a better (safer) POTUS than Trump.When "the spooks" select/deselect the elected then we are really in trouble.
Who would you want, Joe Stalin ?
Good to see true libertarians supporting democracy and the rightfully elected.
Funkycoldribena said:
968 said:
No, he's not smart, hence his incoherent ramblings whenever interviewed or giving a speech. What he does have on his side, however, is a team that have a clever strategy and have used media and (ironically) fake news cleverly to dupe disaffected voters into believing an (alleged) billionaire businessman is looking out for them. Conveniently the American public know him well as they see him on reality TV, which is his real occupation, so he's a 'trusted' face to many average americans.
I'm sure you've achieved similar...At least I haven't been bankrupt 6 times, or even once.
AmitG said:
IMHO Trump is many things, but stupid he is not. Despite having zero political experience, despite starting off as the joke candidate, and despite breaking all the rules in the "how to run for president" book, he beat every single candidate - including one who had effectively been interviewing for this job for years - and got the prize. He did so in a way that nobody had done before, and likely nobody will be able to repeat.
He may be bad for the nation - opinions will differ - but he's smart as hell, and has good instincts.
I will admit for a while I thought this too. I thought Trump was a very smart guy who was absolutely playing the media and winning hands down. He may be bad for the nation - opinions will differ - but he's smart as hell, and has good instincts.
I now realise he is actually an uneducated fool who came along at the right time and that he probably has some kind of personality disorder or other mental health issue. I honestly don't think he even knows fact from fiction half the time and I actually wonder if deep down he really wants to be president. He reminds me of Corbyn in a way - he is a guy who likes to be the outsider / protester but doesn't really want to take on responsibility for actually doing anything.
Stickyfinger said:
Fire pan jumping.
When "the spooks" select/deselect the elected then we are really in trouble.
Who would you want, Joe Stalin ?
Good to see true libertarians supporting democracy and the rightfully elected.
Yes, it'll be like in Russia where the FSB run things, including the media. Oh wait....When "the spooks" select/deselect the elected then we are really in trouble.
Who would you want, Joe Stalin ?
Good to see true libertarians supporting democracy and the rightfully elected.
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