Who is most hated - Thatcher or Blair

[sidicks]

MarshPhantom said:

Prove me wrong.

[TankRizzo]

MarshPhantom said:

Prove me wrong.

No evidence then, righto.

[MarshPhantom]

Ironic coming from a one trick pony such as yourself.

[MarshPhantom]

TankRizzo said:

Sorry, I haven't seen any evidence.

Please provide some links to credible sources to back up your claim.

I linked to carers getting less than the minimum wage earlier, not my fault if you can't find it.

[Rovinghawk]

MarshPhantom said:

Prove me wrong.

No. you've asserted without proof, I'll dismiss it without proof.

[sidicks]

MarshPhantom said:

I linked to carers getting less than the minimum wage earlier, not my fault if you can't find it.

Carers who are employed by the private sector.

Which does nothing to back up your claim.

Try again.

[TankRizzo]

MarshPhantom said:

I linked to carers getting less than the minimum wage earlier, not my fault if you can't find it.

I'm sorry, I was looking for some evidence that "government funding had been cut to the bone" as you asserted.

I'll assume you don't have any evidence.

[Ruskie]

sidicks said:

Ruskie said:

That's the one. That pre election promise that was a load of rubbish. My department of the NHS (ambulance service) has to make £10m of cuts in 4 years despite increased demand year on year.

People mock the unions but without them we would literally be steamrolled. I don't say that lightly. Think 13 hour shifts without breaks in a job that demands concentration for driving and life saving decision making.

How much was spent on the NHS in 2009 compared to 2010 to 2011 to 2012 to 2013...??

I would like to see the figures please.


Cameron's pre election promise of 'No frontline cuts'

http://www.newstatesman.com/politics/2013/11/pre-e...

I would say I'm pretty damn front line and £10m is a substantial cut.

[Ruskie]

NicD said:

Ruskie said:

That's the one. That pre election promise that was a load of rubbish. My department of the NHS (ambulance service) has to make £10m of cuts in 4 years despite increased demand year on year.

People mock the unions but without them we would literally be steamrolled. I don't say that lightly. Think 13 hour shifts without breaks in a job that demands concentration for driving and life saving decision making.

feel for you. I always pull well over to let you guys through easy.

Appreciated. It may seem like a little thing but it makes a big difference to making progress, especially if its literally a time critical emergency.

[sidicks]

Ruskie said:

I would like to see the figures please.


Cameron's pre election promise of 'No frontline cuts'

http://www.newstatesman.com/politics/2013/11/pre-e...

I would say I'm pretty damn front line and £10m is a substantial cut.

1) Who decides what the money is spent on (not the government)

2. What were the budget increases for other front line services?

3. 'substantial' can only be determined compared to the total budget.

[Ruskie]

sidicks said:

Ruskie said:

I would like to see the figures please.


Cameron's pre election promise of 'No frontline cuts'

http://www.newstatesman.com/politics/2013/11/pre-e...

I would say I'm pretty damn front line and £10m is a substantial cut.

1) Who decides what the money is spent on (not the government)

2. What were the budget increases for other front line services?

3. 'substantial' can only be determined compared to the total budget.

Can I see the figures you quoted please?

1) The government can decide not to give hard working and deserving staff a 1% pay rise though. I love my job but imam underpaid for the amount of stress I go through on a weekly basis and the post traumatic stress I suffer from. My choice certainly, but someone has to do it.

2) I'm not talking general. I'm talking specifically about that one promise 'NO frontline cuts' not some, or a few. No cuts full stop and the impact that lie has on the ambulance services.

3) Fair point.

[sidicks]

Ruskie said:

I would like to see the figures please.

UK Healthcare spending
2008 = 102.3bn
2009 = 108.8bn
2010 = 116.9bn
2011 = 119.8bn
2012 = 121.2bn
2013 = 124.3bn
2014 = 129.5bn
2015 = 133.0bn
2016 = 135.1bn

Source: www.ukpublicspending.co.uk

and yet previously you claimed:

Ruskie said:

As an aside the NHS is in complete disarray due to this government and its austerity

Edited by sidicks on Sunday 14th December 21:46

[Rovinghawk]

Ruskie said:

imam underpaid for the amount of stress I go through on a weekly basis

Aren't we all?

[sidicks]

Ruskie said:

I love my job but imam underpaid for the amount of stress I go through on a weekly basis and the post traumatic stress I suffer from. My choice certainly, but someone has to do it.

Indeed.

I am sure your job is very stressful, few would disagree.

However, when you consider yourself 'underpaid' have you increased your salary by c. 25-30% to take your pension into account??

[Rovinghawk]

sidicks said:

However, when you consider yourself 'underpaid' have you increased your salary by c. 25-30% to take your pension into account??

What percentage should be added for guaranteed job security?

[Ruskie]

sidicks said:

Ruskie said:

I would like to see the figures please.

UK Healthcare spending
2008 = 102.3bn
2009 = 108.8bn
2010 = 116.9bn
2011 = 119.8bn
2012 = 121.2bn
2013 = 124.3bn
2014 = 129.5bn
2015 = 133.0bn
2016 = 135.1bn

Source: www.ukpublicspending.co.uk

and yet previously you claimed:

Ruskie said:

As an aside the NHS is in complete disarray due to this government and its austerity

Edited by sidicks on Sunday 14th December 21:46

Annex A: Summary of correspondence about real terms health expenditure 1. The Rt. Hon Andy Burnham MP, Shadow Secretary of State for Health, wrote to Andrew Dilnot on 1 November 2012 expressing concern that statements made by the Prime Minister and Health Minister to Parliament were inconsistent with the underlying statistics about spending published by HM Treasury10, a Department of Health (DH) press release11 and a House of Commons Library note12. He considered there had not been an increase in health spending in real terms, as reported by the Prime Minister and the Health Minister. He also referred to a commitment in the Coalition Agreement13 to increase health spending in real terms, which he considered had not been met. He asked Andrew Dilnot to help in bringing clarity to the situation and for a recommendation on how to ensure that in future the debate on NHS spending could be accurate and reflect the facts. 2. In his letter to Andrew Dilnot, Mr Burnham quoted statements which he believed were inconsistent with the statistics published in Public Expenditure Statistical Analyses 2012, produced by HM Treasury: a. the following section of the Coalition Agreement: ‘We will guarantee that health spending increases in real terms in each year of the Parliament’. b. the following statement by the Prime Minister in the House of Commons on 27 April 201114: ‘The fact is, however, that at the last election only one party said that it would increase the NHS in real terms, and that is exactly what we are doing’. He also quoted a later statement by the Prime Minister in the House of Commons on 13 June 201215: ‘It is certainly not because the money in the NHS is being cut, because it is not being cut. The money in the NHS is being increased.’ c. the following statement made by the Health Secretary, Jeremy Hunt, in the House of Commons on 23 October 201216: ‘Real-terms spending on the NHS has increased across the country’. He also quoted comments made by Mr Hunt on BBC Daily Politics on 9 October 2012: ‘In real terms NHS spending is going up.... it is incredibly significant that in real terms this government has made a big, big choice to protect the NHS budget’. d. and further quoted the Conservative Party website17: ‘We have increased the NHS budget in real terms in each of the last two years’. 3. Mr Burnham included figures in his letter which had been taken from the National Statistics release Public Expenditure Statistical Analyses 2012. In particular, he used figures presented in Table 1.8 ‘Total Departmental Expenditure Limits, 2007-08 to 2011-12’ and Table 1.9 ‘Total Departmental Expenditure Limits in real terms.


https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploa...

Page 27

[sidicks]

Ruskie said:

Annex A: Summary of correspondence about real terms health expenditure 1. The Rt. Hon Andy Burnham MP, Shadow Secretary of State for Health, wrote to Andrew Dilnot on 1 November 2012 expressing concern that statements made by the Prime Minister and Health Minister to Parliament were inconsistent with the underlying statistics about spending published by HM Treasury10, a Department of Health (DH) press release11 and a House of Commons Library note12. He considered there had not been an increase in health spending in real terms, as reported by the Prime Minister and the Health Minister. He also referred to a commitment in the Coalition Agreement13 to increase health spending in real terms, which he considered had not been met. He asked Andrew Dilnot to help in bringing clarity to the situation and for a recommendation on how to ensure that in future the debate on NHS spending could be accurate and reflect the facts. 2. In his letter to Andrew Dilnot, Mr Burnham quoted statements which he believed were inconsistent with the statistics published in Public Expenditure Statistical Analyses 2012, produced by HM Treasury: a. the following section of the Coalition Agreement: ‘We will guarantee that health spending increases in real terms in each year of the Parliament’. b. the following statement by the Prime Minister in the House of Commons on 27 April 201114: ‘The fact is, however, that at the last election only one party said that it would increase the NHS in real terms, and that is exactly what we are doing’. He also quoted a later statement by the Prime Minister in the House of Commons on 13 June 201215: ‘It is certainly not because the money in the NHS is being cut, because it is not being cut. The money in the NHS is being increased.’ c. the following statement made by the Health Secretary, Jeremy Hunt, in the House of Commons on 23 October 201216: ‘Real-terms spending on the NHS has increased across the country’. He also quoted comments made by Mr Hunt on BBC Daily Politics on 9 October 2012: ‘In real terms NHS spending is going up.... it is incredibly significant that in real terms this government has made a big, big choice to protect the NHS budget’. d. and further quoted the Conservative Party website17: ‘We have increased the NHS budget in real terms in each of the last two years’. 3. Mr Burnham included figures in his letter which had been taken from the National Statistics release Public Expenditure Statistical Analyses 2012. In particular, he used figures presented in Table 1.8 ‘Total Departmental Expenditure Limits, 2007-08 to 2011-12’ and Table 1.9 ‘Total Departmental Expenditure Limits in real terms.


https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploa...

Page 27

And ?

I must have missed the section on 'massive cuts and austerity'....

[Ruskie]

sidicks said:

Ruskie said:

I love my job but imam underpaid for the amount of stress I go through on a weekly basis and the post traumatic stress I suffer from. My choice certainly, but someone has to do it.

Indeed.

I am sure your job is very stressful, few would disagree.

However, when you consider yourself 'underpaid' have you increased your salary by c. 25-30% to take your pension into account??

Your obviously aware Paramedics have to work to 68 now. Just let that sink in and think about that. A 67 year old paramedic making life and death calls at 5am in the morning. Does that sound safe to you?

[sidicks]

Ruskie said:

Your obviously aware Paramedics have to work to 68 now. Just let that sink in and think about that. A 67 year old paramedic making life and death calls at 5am in the morning. Does that sound safe to you?

No they don't.

The 1995 scheme has an NRA of 60. The 2008 scheme has an NRA of 65.

You can choose to retire before these dates and have an actuarially adjusted pension. Then you can do whatever you want between (say) 60 and 68....!

Same as the private sector individuals who don't have massively subsidised final salary pensions.

Edited by sidicks on Sunday 14th December 22:26

[Rovinghawk]

Ruskie said:

Stuff

1) There's no money due to G.Brown pissing it away on such things as PFI hospitals
2) Despite this, more money has been given to the NHS every year
3) The NHS is an inefficient monster that manages to swallow every last penny it gets & still feel the need for more- enough is never enough
4) Whenever pay rises are mentioned, the subject of annual increments magically never comes up

Money has been shovelled into the NHS by the bucketload- if you don't get as much as you want then either leave for greener pastures or improve the internal mechanisms of the organisation.