Farage in Brussels - a national embarrassment

[danllama]

Interesting interview with Farage on Fox here

https://mediamatters.org/video/2016/06/27/fox-news...

[SeeFive]

eharding said:

Based on the information you've provided, that he's been fined for allowing his company to bring in illegal immigrants, and been suspected of people trafficking?

If I'm insinuating anything, it's that he was an idiot for letting his passport out of his sight, and that idiocy seems to be a family trait.

Yes, he made an error. In his defence, he was sick and getting out at a station to get on a train home and left his passport in the cab. He and his business is fully above board.

There was no formal accusation of people trafficking, they were concerned that ONE of TWO stowaways bore a resemblance to his passport. His driver did not bring them in. They were spotted the other side, his driver made an error, left a door unlocked coming back empty, hence Clouseau phoning my brother. There were two in a big and empty lorry, hardly the approach of a people trafficker I would suggest.

I can assure you that from his background to the success he has had in business, he is no idiot, and there is no family trait. I will leave others to form their opinion of you however from your rude and accusatory exchange on this.

[eharding]

SeeFive said:

eharding said:

Based on the information you've provided, that he's been fined for allowing his company to bring in illegal immigrants, and been suspected of people trafficking?

If I'm insinuating anything, it's that he was an idiot for letting his passport out of his sight, and that idiocy seems to be a family trait.

Yes, he made an error. In his defence, he was sick and getting out at a station to get on a train home and left his passport in the cab. He and his business is fully above board.

There was no formal accusation of people trafficking, they were concerned that ONE of TWO stowaways bore a resemblance to his passport. His driver did not bring them in. They were spotted the other side, his driver made an error, left a door unlocked coming back empty, hence Clouseau phoning my brother. There were two in a big and empty lorry, hardly the approach of a people trafficker I would suggest.

I can assure you that from his background to the success he has had in business, he is no idiot, and there is no family trait. I will leave others to form their opinion of you however from your rude and accusatory exchange on this.

So, has his company been fined for bringing in illegal immigrants, or hasn't it?

Let's be clear. We're having this conversation because of information you've cheerfully provided.

Maybe your brother isn't a habitual idiot, but he patently has a brother who is.

[lostkiwi]

eharding said:

SeeFive said:

eharding said:

Based on the information you've provided, that he's been fined for allowing his company to bring in illegal immigrants, and been suspected of people trafficking?

If I'm insinuating anything, it's that he was an idiot for letting his passport out of his sight, and that idiocy seems to be a family trait.

Yes, he made an error. In his defence, he was sick and getting out at a station to get on a train home and left his passport in the cab. He and his business is fully above board.

There was no formal accusation of people trafficking, they were concerned that ONE of TWO stowaways bore a resemblance to his passport. His driver did not bring them in. They were spotted the other side, his driver made an error, left a door unlocked coming back empty, hence Clouseau phoning my brother. There were two in a big and empty lorry, hardly the approach of a people trafficker I would suggest.

I can assure you that from his background to the success he has had in business, he is no idiot, and there is no family trait. I will leave others to form their opinion of you however from your rude and accusatory exchange on this.

So, has his company been fined for bringing in illegal immigrants, or hasn't it?

Let's be clear. We're having this conversation because of information you've cheerfully provided.

Maybe your brother isn't a habitual idiot, but he patently has a brother who is.

Come on guys... enough name calling.

[SeeFive]

lostkiwi said:

Let me spell it out.
1. I said the photo is misleading as it was used in the context of EU migration.
2. I provided a link to the photographer being interviewed where he said it's usage was misleading.
3. I used the word refugee where the photographer used migrant. Fair do's but given they were from (in the photographer's words and he was there) Syria and Afghanistan it's not unreasonable.
4. I gave details of how to view the rest of the images so they can be viewed in context.


The discussions about the EU handling of the refugee (or migrant if you prefer) crisis is irrelevant in the context of the image as that was never part of the Brexit marketing or a major topic of discussion in the same way as immigration from EU migrants.

I am pretty sure most people would agree given the above the photo was intended to mislead.

Bored with this as I am sure others are. Feel free to have the last word. I am feeling that this is being turned into hit picking when there is an important issue raised here for those that truly care about refugees and properly managed immigration. It sounds like you are part of that group, so we are on the same side.

The quote at the bottom is what you said. This is what I object to as it weakens the case for true refugees equating them to economic migrants. Migrants have other options which are not available to true refugees to enter the EU from outside. That is important IMHO.

Spell it out for me any way you like, but it is in black and white. Someone asked how you knew, you cited the photographer, I read the citation and called a point of order on a clear error. I am not saying that anyone is smarter than you or more right than you, simply pointing out that without citation, it was clearly just your view, and therefore holds as much water as anyone else's.

And another view of that photograph which I think I read on here could be that UKIP were not actually attacking the people, but attacking Merkel and the EU for putting them in that situation. It's a view, not mine, but it is as potentially valid as the ones we hold.

lostkiwi said:

Refugees aren't immigrants. There's a difference.
That photo is of refugees.

[lostkiwi]

SeeFive said:

lostkiwi said:

Let me spell it out.
1. I said the photo is misleading as it was used in the context of EU migration.
2. I provided a link to the photographer being interviewed where he said it's usage was misleading.
3. I used the word refugee where the photographer used migrant. Fair do's but given they were from (in the photographer's words and he was there) Syria and Afghanistan it's not unreasonable.
4. I gave details of how to view the rest of the images so they can be viewed in context.


The discussions about the EU handling of the refugee (or migrant if you prefer) crisis is irrelevant in the context of the image as that was never part of the Brexit marketing or a major topic of discussion in the same way as immigration from EU migrants.

I am pretty sure most people would agree given the above the photo was intended to mislead.

Bored with this as I am sure others are. Feel free to have the last word. I am feeling that this is being turned into hit picking when there is an important issue raised here for those that truly care about refugees and properly managed immigration. It sounds like you are part of that group, so we are on the same side.

The quote at the bottom is what you said. This is what I object to as it weakens the case for true refugees equating them to economic migrants. Migrants have other options which are not available to true refugees to enter the EU from outside. That is important IMHO.

Spell it out for me any way you like, but it is in black and white. Someone asked how you knew, you cited the photographer, I read the citation and called a point of order on a clear error. I am not saying that anyone is smarter than you or more right than you, simply pointing out that without citation, it was clearly just your view, and therefore holds as much water as anyone else's.

And another view of that photograph which I think I read on here could be that UKIP were not actually attacking the people, but attacking Merkel and the EU for putting them in that situation. It's a view, not mine, but it is as potentially valid as the ones we hold.

lostkiwi said:

Refugees aren't immigrants. There's a difference.
That photo is of refugees.

Yes and I referred to that in point 3.

Your reference to that alters nothing.

[SeeFive]

eharding said:

So, has his company been fined for bringing in illegal immigrants, or hasn't it?

Let's be clear. We're having this conversation because of information you've cheerfully provided.

Maybe your brother isn't a habitual idiot, but he patently has a brother who is.

I have not seen the paperwork. His company received a fine for £4,000 when two stowaways were found in the back of a lorry belonging to his company, driven by someone else. I have no more info to provide to you.

Why exactly are you calling me an idiot?

Yes, let's be very clear. I do not see your problem and need for this interrogation or rudeness. You appear to have an issue. What do you take objection to, my cheeriness?

[SeeFive]

gooner1 said:

How often do you impersonate a Customs official.
Have the bks to say what you really mean.

Oh read on man. He clearly has an issue with something, everyone is an idiot etc..

Not sure what the issue is yet though. I suspect I am too cheerful.

[SeeFive]

lostkiwi said:

Yes and I referred to that in point 3.

Your reference to that alters nothing.

I will leave it at that.

[SeeFive]

lostkiwi said:

Come on guys... enough name calling.

Thanks for that but i think you meant "guy" singular.

I have answered his questions to the best of my ability, carefully not called him any names as tempting as it is. I will leave that judgement to others.

[don4l]

eharding said:

So, has his company been fined for bringing in illegal immigrants, or hasn't it?

Let's be clear. We're having this conversation because of information you've cheerfully provided.

Maybe your brother isn't a habitual idiot, but he patently has a brother who is.

Let's get back on topic.

Is this an embarrassing tie?

[Mrr T]

Kermit power said:

ninjacost said:

So the influx of unlimited numbers of migrants isnt putting a strain on the countries of Europe ?

Only from a political perspective.

Let's assume there have been a million migrants. From what I can see, nobody is really sure, but most estimates seem to be around half that, so it should make it workable.

That's what, one person for every 500 here? One person for every 4 square km?

I don't think we should be taking in unlimited numbers of migrants by any means, but if all EU countries had just agreed to take an even share per capita/surface area, then the logistics would've been relatively straightforward. We're talking about moving five times the daily passenger numbers through Heathrow airport across the whole of the EU across a full year.

Politically, it's a big strain though.

I disagree its clear the current irregular immigration crisis is putting a strain on the EU countries most effected. The question is WTF has this to do with a referendum on the EU. The EU has very little to do with the crisis and little it can do to resolve it.

[Mrr T]

danllama said:

What did the EU do in response to her ridiculous invite? Reprimand her?

Why would the EU reprimand her? She can speak on behalf of Germany if she wishes. I am sure a number of other EU leaders may have regretted her words.

[cautiontothewind]

vonuber said:

alfie2244 said:

But I voted for him on the basis that he wouldn't attend unless he was causing them to squirm and this attendance assisted our exit.....so job well done IMO.

And you wonder why the UK's voice within the EU was diminished.

It was diminished as soon as we made it clear that we did not want full integration by adopting the Euro. Since then we have been seen as the only ones pissing inside the tent whist all other piss outside...

Furthermore, the kicking we're going to get from the pesky Europeans who's sole gravy-train ambition is to milk the Euro for all it's worth, is going to be epic. An example is going to be made from us to all other nations who are thinking of leaving; be sure of this...

I voted out and am offended by the insinuation that I must be racist.

I would never tire of punching Nige in the face and do cringe at his immigration viewpoint but a lot of the other rhetoric is simply spot on; not all of it, but some of it. I'm caught between a rock and a hard place. I want to smash his teeth out but then he couldn't give it to the Eurocrats with both barrels.

[lostkiwi]

Now I'm not entirely sure on teh numbers but it doesn't matter too much if they are a little out...

There are 748 MEPs (this is the one I'm not sure on).
We elected Nigel as an MEP to speak on our behalf.
There were 3571 issues he could have voted on of which he participated in 1375 ranking him 746th in the MEPs.

We elected him (as a country as I never would have personally) to represent us in the EU - a task he appears to have been woefully negligent in performing.
He then complains about the Brussels 'gravy train' that he himself was riding and proceeds to talk down to 747 other MEPs - all bar one of whom had represented their country better than him.

If we had an employee with stats like that they would be sacked. No question.
Its either gross incompetence, gross negligence or gross misconduct.

http://www.votewatch.eu/en/term8-nigel-farage-2.ht...

[marshalla]

lostkiwi said:

We elected him (as a country as I never would have personally) to represent us in the EU - a task he appears to have been woefully negligent in performing.

We didn't, as a country, elect him. A particular region of the country elected him.

[alfie2244]

lostkiwi said:

If we had an employee with stats like that they would be sacked. No question.
Its either gross incompetence, gross negligence or gross misconduct.

Job very well done IMO... the clue is in the name UKIP and it's raison d'etre (i.e. Brexit)and would NOT have happened without him....... however the rather large lady hasn't sung yet so he may still have a bit of work to do.

[tarnished]

lostkiwi said:

We elected him (as a country as I never would have personally) to represent us in the EU - a task he appears to have been woefully negligent in performing.

Not to represent us in the EU, to get us out of the EU. There's a clue in the party name. A task he's done remarkably well at by any measure.

[Guybrush]

alfie2244 said:

lostkiwi said:

If we had an employee with stats like that they would be sacked. No question.
Its either gross incompetence, gross negligence or gross misconduct.

Job very well done IMO... the clue is in the name UKIP and it's raison d'etre (i.e. Brexit)and would NOT have happened without him....... however the rather large lady hasn't sung yet so he may still have a bit of work to do.

He's done a great job. We may well not have had the democratic chance to escape from the EU if were not for his courage and determination to keep going despite the (mainly) left leaning rants against him.

Incidentally, he has minimised his frequency of turning up just to claim the daily allowance that so many on the EU gravy train do, despite appearing to do no work.

[alfie2244]

Guybrush said:

alfie2244 said:

lostkiwi said:

If we had an employee with stats like that they would be sacked. No question.
Its either gross incompetence, gross negligence or gross misconduct.

Job very well done IMO... the clue is in the name UKIP and it's raison d'etre (i.e. Brexit)and would NOT have happened without him....... however the rather large lady hasn't sung yet so he may still have a bit of work to do.

He's done a great job. We may well not have had the democratic chance to escape from the EU if were not for his courage and determination to keep going despite the (mainly) left leaning rants against him.

Incidentally, he has minimised his frequency of turning up just to claim the daily allowance that so many on the EU gravy train do, despite appearing to do no work.

It's the anger at him I don't understand....he openly stated what he wanted and achieved it...unlike most other duplicitous, serve serving, politicians that lean whichever the way the wind is blowing.

If Remainers are angry then they should vent this anger / abuse at those that either led the UK into this mess and or cocked a deaf ear (ridiculed, belittled, abused take your choice)to anybody that had the temerity to raise concerns on where it was obvious the Titanic was clearly heading to anybody not wearing tinted glasses. Thereby leading to the point where we are today i.e. Remainers are in a minority and need to stop whingeing and look at this as an opportunity, a new door opened not an old one closed.