Martin Mcguinnes dead
Discussion
Cold said:
Lord Tebbit isn't quite so warm in his reaction:
maybe it was his early morning wake up call in the grand hotel.Tebbit said:
The world is a safer and sweeter place today. He was a coward who never atoned for his crimes. There can be no forgiveness without a confession of sins.
i do love Tebbit
A lot of the English posters on this thread will simply never understand because they have never had to live through or experience NI in the older days. Their only experience is through media propaganda which discourages free thinking and that teaches them that anything republican or nationalist is bad. They don't realise that the loyalist and unionist side was just as bad if not worse. Army and police colluding with paramilitaries and encouraging murder etc. No side is innocent here but when you consider what Mr McGuiness did and the way he turned out, he should be applauded.
The sad fact is that in NI, children are brainwashed and indoctrinated from a very young age, both republican and loyalist. This hatred is beaten into them and it takes a lot of courage for them to open your eyes and see things for the way they are. Even moreso to speak out against it like Mr McGuiness did. Take a look at east and west Belfast for example or loyalist and republican Belfast if you want to put it that way. Many of these children are being brought up with pure hatred in their hearts. They are taught to hate the 'other side' and in many cases encouraged to join the fight. I know all about it first hand as I was also taught in a similar way and it took a long time for me to open my mind and start thinking for myself. Because of the hatred instilled into the hearts of the children, many of them actually believe the bulls
t throughout their lives and will pass it onto the next generation which is why the cycle will never end. When any of them start thinking for themselves and realise it's all bullst, they are too scared to talk about it for fear of being ostracised by their communities and disowned by their families. This is one of the reasons I left NI, my mind is free and I could no longer bear to be around so many sheep with closed minds. And it's not just NI. When I crossed the Irish Sea, I saw the exact same thing. People who were too scared to think for themselves, just believing what they have been fed by the media and having no want or will to go and research the facts to see what is actually going on in the world.
And this is in my eyes why people like Mr McGuiness and Mr Paisley are heroes. They were brought up and indoctrinated through all the bullst, both stirred up so much hatred but had the courage to start thinking for himself and turn their lives around for the greater good.
The sad fact is that in NI, children are brainwashed and indoctrinated from a very young age, both republican and loyalist. This hatred is beaten into them and it takes a lot of courage for them to open your eyes and see things for the way they are. Even moreso to speak out against it like Mr McGuiness did. Take a look at east and west Belfast for example or loyalist and republican Belfast if you want to put it that way. Many of these children are being brought up with pure hatred in their hearts. They are taught to hate the 'other side' and in many cases encouraged to join the fight. I know all about it first hand as I was also taught in a similar way and it took a long time for me to open my mind and start thinking for myself. Because of the hatred instilled into the hearts of the children, many of them actually believe the bulls
t throughout their lives and will pass it onto the next generation which is why the cycle will never end. When any of them start thinking for themselves and realise it's all bullst, they are too scared to talk about it for fear of being ostracised by their communities and disowned by their families. This is one of the reasons I left NI, my mind is free and I could no longer bear to be around so many sheep with closed minds. And it's not just NI. When I crossed the Irish Sea, I saw the exact same thing. People who were too scared to think for themselves, just believing what they have been fed by the media and having no want or will to go and research the facts to see what is actually going on in the world. And this is in my eyes why people like Mr McGuiness and Mr Paisley are heroes. They were brought up and indoctrinated through all the bulls
t, both stirred up so much hatred but had the courage to start thinking for himself and turn their lives around for the greater good. We've had all the rubbish about how great someone who murders people can be.
Let's leave the corpse to fester and concentrate on someone more positive, who came up against murderers like McGuinnes so many times that he could not remember the number. A hero:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b01dtlzl
This is the chap who, when his friend and colleague Howorth was killed trying to defuse an IED in a Wimpy bar in London in 1981, went ahead a defused an identical device the same day. Such bravery is, to me at least, incomprehensible.
Let's forget about those who justify murders for political ends and concentrate on those who deserve our out and out admiration.
Let's leave the corpse to fester and concentrate on someone more positive, who came up against murderers like McGuinnes so many times that he could not remember the number. A hero:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b01dtlzl
This is the chap who, when his friend and colleague Howorth was killed trying to defuse an IED in a Wimpy bar in London in 1981, went ahead a defused an identical device the same day. Such bravery is, to me at least, incomprehensible.
Let's forget about those who justify murders for political ends and concentrate on those who deserve our out and out admiration.
Blackpuddin said:
Emanresu said:
He was a major component in the NI peace process. He even shook hands with the queen.
Which says a lot more about the Queen than it does about him. I'm sure I saw a glint of something deep in her smile when she answered 'Still alive.'
I met him in 1983 in the middle of nowhere in Tyrone when my foot patrol stopped his car. Long stand-off whilst he refused to open the boot of the car and I eventually decided it wasn't worth upping the stakes and let him go. He and Adams have never done anything about Jean McConville's murderers and it really annoys me that whilst the army are apparently fair game for retribution years after the events the IRA have been allowed to get away with it. The Jean McConville investigation should also be re-opened if they are going to re-open inquiries into deaths from army action.
Derek Smith said:
We've had all the rubbish about how great someone who murders people can be.
Let's leave the corpse to fester and concentrate on someone more positive, who came up against murderers like McGuinnes so many times that he could not remember the number. A hero:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b01dtlzl
This is the chap who, when his friend and colleague Howorth was killed trying to defuse an IED in a Wimpy bar in London in 1981, went ahead a defused an identical device the same day. Such bravery is, to me at least, incomprehensible.
Let's forget about those who justify murders for political ends and concentrate on those who deserve our out and out admiration.
Well said Derek. Let's leave the corpse to fester and concentrate on someone more positive, who came up against murderers like McGuinnes so many times that he could not remember the number. A hero:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b01dtlzl
This is the chap who, when his friend and colleague Howorth was killed trying to defuse an IED in a Wimpy bar in London in 1981, went ahead a defused an identical device the same day. Such bravery is, to me at least, incomprehensible.
Let's forget about those who justify murders for political ends and concentrate on those who deserve our out and out admiration.
Emanresu said:
A lot of the English posters on this thread will simply never understand because they have never had to live through or experience NI in the older days.
Thats true. We "only" had to live through bombings on "the mainland"Emanresu said:
Their only experience is through media propaganda which discourages free thinking and that teaches them that anything republican or nationalist is bad. They don't realise that the loyalist and unionist side was just as bad if not worse. Army and police colluding with paramilitaries and encouraging murder etc. No side is innocent here but when you consider what Mr McGuiness did and the way he turned out, he should be applauded.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dOAHVcxA1NoGo on then. Explain Warrington...
Emanresu said:
And this is in my eyes why people like Mr McGuiness and Mr Paisley are heroes. They were brought up and indoctrinated through all the bullst, both stirred up so much hatred but had the courage to start thinking for himself and turn their lives around for the greater good.
Bombing people for your political beliefs is now "bullst, both stirred up so much hatred but had the courage to start thinking for himself and turn their lives around for the greater good. t" and should be seen through??Emanresu said:
Mr McGuinness had big balls and showed that a leopard can change its spots. He was a major component in the NI peace process. He became good friends with Ian Paisley, one of the most bitter, twisted pot stirrers that ever lived. He even shook hands with the queen. He showed a generation of young nationalists who were smart enough to think for themselves that there is another way.
RIP
I'd have some sympathy with this viewpoint if he and Adams had ever admitted to being IRA commanders and to having killed and ordered killings.RIP
He was a coward for not having admitted to those things.
Emanresu said:
A lot of the English posters on this thread will simply never understand because they have never had to live through or experience NI in the older days. Their only experience is through media propaganda which discourages free thinking and that teaches them that anything republican or nationalist is bad.
The IRA didn't just reserve their bombs (or even threats) to NI. I was evacuated from school many times, my little Essex town had a car bomb laid by them, taking a soldiers legs. Media propaganda? No smoke without fire. Cowardly terrorists and cowardly supporters. Why the balaclavas, otherwise?
Yes there were bombs on the mainland but nothing compared to the carnage in NI. When I was growing up, there was something on the news about a bomb or a murder everyday. I never even batted an eyelid because it was just 'normal'. No child should ever have to grow up believing that is normal.
Deptford Draylons said:
Lets be blunt, when the rest of them of their generation on both sides are dead and gone it will be for the better.
Sadly no. This tribal warefare mentality is still being bred into the children today and will continue to be passed from generation to generation. When you have very little else than terrorists to look up to, there is a good chance you will become a terrorist. Visit Belfast, go see the murals on the walls, see the little kids in their tribal rangers and Celtic shirts. It will never change. tommunster10 said:
BlackLabel said:
I thought I respected Jon Snow... not now.
Well MM will get his cumuppence when he meets Maggie down in hell... she's probably running it now..
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