George Galloway being a cocksocket again
Discussion
TwigtheWonderkid said:
Where? He doesn't mention Jews at all. The tweet is blatantly anti Israeli. You may like that, or not, but it isn't anti Semitic. He may well be anti Semitic, but he wasn't in that tweet.
Because of spurs association with being a Jewish club .The tweet makes no sense if he applied it to any other team does it ?
If city had played Liverpool and he said that it makes no sense ,it only makes sense because he is conflating Judaism with Israel ,and Spurs with Jews.
TwigtheWonderkid said:
Well Africa isn't a country, so it's a bit of a strange comparison. But, expanding your theme, suppose there was a huge Zimbabwean population in Liverpool, who mainly supported Liverpool, and who went along to games and had the Zimbabwe flag in the crowd at every match, then no, it wouldn't be racist to say "glad spurs won, no Zimbabwe flags on the cup". Given that many people don't like the Zimbabwean govt and don't want to see their flag paraded.
But African is a race, so it's a comparison. But if Galloway and his ilk believe Jews have no right to their own country and Israel shouldn't exist, it begs the obvious question of what they think should happen to those living there at the moment? franki68 said:
TwigtheWonderkid said:
Where? He doesn't mention Jews at all. The tweet is blatantly anti Israeli. You may like that, or not, but it isn't anti Semitic. He may well be anti Semitic, but he wasn't in that tweet.
Because of spurs association with being a Jewish club .The tweet makes no sense if he applied it to any other team does it ?
If city had played Liverpool and he said that it makes no sense ,it only makes sense because he is conflating Judaism with Israel ,and Spurs with Jews.
A Winner Is You said:
But if Galloway and his ilk believe Jews have no right to their own country and Israel shouldn't exist, it begs the obvious question of what they think should happen to those living there at the moment?
Well I don't believe any religious group should have it's own country. I don't think there should be "The Jewish State of Israel", nor should there be "The Islamic Republic of Iran". Countries should exist to serve all their citizens, not just the overwhelming majority. So Jews would continue to live in the area currently known as Israel, (as they have done long before 1948) as they live in the UK, or Swede, or New Zealand. But there should be a wall of separation between church (or synagogue or mosque) and state. Now I realise that many of the countries surrounding Israel won't even be happy with that, because they actually are anti Semitic, and actually want to wipe out the Jews, hence the problem is a lot more complex.
Its really easy (sadly) to be critical of the actions of the current Israeli government and its military but have no issue with Israel or Israelis per-se. This is probably the best modern weapon to challenge some of their terrible actions. Galloway speaks from experience and principle but he's dumb not to engage an Israeli in debate as that looks like prejudice. Plenty of Jews/Israelis would share his thoughts after all - they don't ALL condone the actions that fuel misery, death and conflict.
To further defend GG in this instance (not something I'm overly happy with, because he's a odious little t
t), when Chelsea beat Arsenal last week in the Europa League final, he didn't tweet his disappointment, even though Chelsea are a Jewish owned club. But Chelsea fans have no history of flying Israeli flags.
Now maybe he was busy that evening, or maybe the fact that Chelsea and Spurs are both owned by Jews doesn't bother him. It's the flying of the Israeli flag that bothers him.
t), when Chelsea beat Arsenal last week in the Europa League final, he didn't tweet his disappointment, even though Chelsea are a Jewish owned club. But Chelsea fans have no history of flying Israeli flags. Now maybe he was busy that evening, or maybe the fact that Chelsea and Spurs are both owned by Jews doesn't bother him. It's the flying of the Israeli flag that bothers him.
[quote=TwigtheWonderkid]
The source of his ire, in that tweet, isn't that Spurs are a Jewish club, but that it is demonstrated by the fans parading the Israeli flag as a sign of that. And he doesn't like Israel. And he doesn't want to see the Israeli flag being flown. If they paraded flags showing a menorah, that is a Jewish symbol but not an Israeli one, then if he moaned about that, it would be anti Semitic
How does he know who was flying the flag ? Was it spurs fans ? Was it Israelis ? If it was Israelis they were more than likely Liverpool fans .
I don’t recall seeing spurs fans flying Israeli flags at anytime since I have watched football but maybe some of the spurs fans can clarify that .
The source of his ire, in that tweet, isn't that Spurs are a Jewish club, but that it is demonstrated by the fans parading the Israeli flag as a sign of that. And he doesn't like Israel. And he doesn't want to see the Israeli flag being flown. If they paraded flags showing a menorah, that is a Jewish symbol but not an Israeli one, then if he moaned about that, it would be anti Semitic
How does he know who was flying the flag ? Was it spurs fans ? Was it Israelis ? If it was Israelis they were more than likely Liverpool fans .
I don’t recall seeing spurs fans flying Israeli flags at anytime since I have watched football but maybe some of the spurs fans can clarify that .
franki68 said:
How does he know who was flying the flag ? Was it spurs fans ? Was it Israelis ? If it was Israelis they were more than likely Liverpool fans .
I don’t recall seeing spurs fans flying Israeli flags at anytime since I have watched football but maybe some of the spurs fans can clarify that .
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-2230243/David-Baddiel-Tottenham-fans-chanting-Yid-Army-sustains-anti-Semitism.htmlI don’t recall seeing spurs fans flying Israeli flags at anytime since I have watched football but maybe some of the spurs fans can clarify that .
franki68 said:
I don’t recall seeing spurs fans flying Israeli flags at anytime since I have watched football but maybe some of the spurs fans can clarify that .
Well I've already posted a pic of Spurs fans flying the flag. As they do at every game. There are always, and I mean always, at least 2, sometimes more, Israel flags being displayed by Spurs fans, home and away. And good for them. They have every right to wave whatever flag they want, and people who don't like the flags they wave have every right to be glad they lost. Countdown said:
franki68 said:
How does he know who was flying the flag ? Was it spurs fans ? Was it Israelis ? If it was Israelis they were more than likely Liverpool fans .
I don’t recall seeing spurs fans flying Israeli flags at anytime since I have watched football but maybe some of the spurs fans can clarify that .
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-2230243/David-Baddiel-Tottenham-fans-chanting-Yid-Army-sustains-anti-Semitism.htmlI don’t recall seeing spurs fans flying Israeli flags at anytime since I have watched football but maybe some of the spurs fans can clarify that .
coincidentally spurs colours and a magen dovid make up the Israeli flag
TwigtheWonderkid said:
Well I've already posted a pic of Spurs fans flying the flag. As they do at every game. There are always, and I mean always, at least 2, sometimes more, Israel flags being displayed by Spurs fans, home and away. And good for them. They have every right to wave whatever flag they want, and people who don't like the flags they wave have every right to be glad they lost.
In 30 years at Old Trafford I cannot recall ever seeing one flown by spurs but saying that I stopped going ten years ago ,see my reply to countdown.franki68 said:
If that’s the case then I can accept maybe it wasn’t anti Semitic ,but I would suggest the use of such a flag is more to do with spurs Jewish association than a support of Israel .
I don't think that's in doubt. The Israeli flags are flown because of the Jewish association, and to back up their nickname, Y*d Army. But just because the flags are flown for that purpose, that doesn't mean people object because of the Jewish aspect. They are free to object just because it's the Israeli flag, and they don't like Israel. TwigtheWonderkid said:
franki68 said:
If that’s the case then I can accept maybe it wasn’t anti Semitic ,but I would suggest the use of such a flag is more to do with spurs Jewish association than a support of Israel .
I don't think that's in doubt. The Israeli flags are flown because of the Jewish association, and to back up their nickname, Y*d Army. But just because the flags are flown for that purpose, that doesn't mean people object because of the Jewish aspect. They are free to object just because it's the Israeli flag, and they don't like Israel. franki68 said:
Absolutely but given the connection between spurs and Judaism it was still a truly stupid thing to say .
This is the point I think.It just seemed like a spectacularly crass way of shoehorning an anti-israeli message into him twitter timeline.
Also I would imagine it's possible to be pro-Israel but against the actions of the current Israeli government. A bit like I feel with this country.
desolate said:
franki68 said:
Absolutely but given the connection between spurs and Judaism it was still a truly stupid thing to say .
This is the point I think.It just seemed like a spectacularly crass way of shoehorning an anti-israeli message into him twitter timeline.
Also I would imagine it's possible to be pro-Israel but against the actions of the current Israeli government. A bit like I feel with this country.
Anyway I’m sure George will talk his way out of it ,he is a very good debater ,especially when he debates the masses .
He is an exceptional mass debater .
franki68 said:
TwigtheWonderkid said:
franki68 said:
If that’s the case then I can accept maybe it wasn’t anti Semitic ,but I would suggest the use of such a flag is more to do with spurs Jewish association than a support of Israel .
I don't think that's in doubt. The Israeli flags are flown because of the Jewish association, and to back up their nickname, Y*d Army. But just because the flags are flown for that purpose, that doesn't mean people object because of the Jewish aspect. They are free to object just because it's the Israeli flag, and they don't like Israel. Gassing Station | News, Politics & Economics | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff