Could UK U-turn on Referendum Result (Vol 2)

[don4l]

FiF said:

It's behind a pay wall but EU negotiators are going to propose that after Brexit any EU citizens living in Britain should remain (snigger) under the jurisdiction of EU law. Maybe this is an add on as to why they want to offer EU citizenship to British subjects after Brexit. Clearly the UK must reject this, that is a red line for me and, I suspect, many others.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/12/12/exclusi...

This has got to be posturing, surely?

The EU are currently adamant that the same rules must apply to all.

[FiF]

don4l said:

FiF said:

It's behind a pay wall but EU negotiators are going to propose that after Brexit any EU citizens living in Britain should remain (snigger) under the jurisdiction of EU law. Maybe this is an add on as to why they want to offer EU citizenship to British subjects after Brexit. Clearly the UK must reject this, that is a red line for me and, I suspect, many others.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/12/12/exclusi...

This has got to be posturing, surely?

The EU are currently adamant that the same rules must apply to all.

Well yes clearly it's posturing at this stage, but presumably at the end each party has to have things where they can tell their citizens that they told the other side to FRO and be sharp about it. It seems a bit, or perhaps more correctly, a lot of a stupid suggestion as it's clearly never going to be acceptable.

[Cobnapint]

don4l said:

FiF said:

It's behind a pay wall but EU negotiators are going to propose that after Brexit any EU citizens living in Britain should remain (snigger) under the jurisdiction of EU law. Maybe this is an add on as to why they want to offer EU citizenship to British subjects after Brexit. Clearly the UK must reject this, that is a red line for me and, I suspect, many others.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/12/12/exclusi...

This has got to be posturing, surely?

Just one of the many negotiating hand grenades lunatic EU officials will no doubt roll into the room.

[don4l]

FiF said:

don4l said:

FiF said:

It's behind a pay wall but EU negotiators are going to propose that after Brexit any EU citizens living in Britain should remain (snigger) under the jurisdiction of EU law. Maybe this is an add on as to why they want to offer EU citizenship to British subjects after Brexit. Clearly the UK must reject this, that is a red line for me and, I suspect, many others.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/12/12/exclusi...

This has got to be posturing, surely?

The EU are currently adamant that the same rules must apply to all.

Well yes clearly it's posturing at this stage, but presumably at the end each party has to have things where they can tell their citizens that they told the other side to FRO and be sharp about it. It seems a bit, or perhaps more correctly, a lot of a stupid suggestion as it's clearly never going to be acceptable.

I think that my plan needs to be implemented immediately.

These arrogant halfwits need to understand that their hand is very weak.

Our politicians need to start talking about 10% import duties on German cars and 32% on French wines.

[EddieSteadyGo]

FiF said:

don4l said:

FiF said:

It's behind a pay wall but EU negotiators are going to propose that after Brexit any EU citizens living in Britain should remain (snigger) under the jurisdiction of EU law. Maybe this is an add on as to why they want to offer EU citizenship to British subjects after Brexit. Clearly the UK must reject this, that is a red line for me and, I suspect, many others.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/12/12/exclusi...

This has got to be posturing, surely?

The EU are currently adamant that the same rules must apply to all.

Well yes clearly it's posturing at this stage, but presumably at the end each party has to have things where they can tell their citizens that they told the other side to FRO and be sharp about it. It seems a bit, or perhaps more correctly, a lot of a stupid suggestion as it's clearly never going to be acceptable.

The pertinent point from the article is this;

Telegraph said:

"European negotiators are concerned that British citizens living in the Europe after Brexit will have rights that are guaranteed under EU law to third-country nationals, but that these might not be reciprocated by the UK."

So their "proposal" about EU jurisdiction is to be ignored - the important point is that they are revealing something else important they want i.e. reciprocal rights, which can just be added to the list to be negotiated.

[Elysium]

don4l said:

FiF said:

don4l said:

FiF said:

It's behind a pay wall but EU negotiators are going to propose that after Brexit any EU citizens living in Britain should remain (snigger) under the jurisdiction of EU law. Maybe this is an add on as to why they want to offer EU citizenship to British subjects after Brexit. Clearly the UK must reject this, that is a red line for me and, I suspect, many others.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/12/12/exclusi...

This has got to be posturing, surely?

The EU are currently adamant that the same rules must apply to all.

Well yes clearly it's posturing at this stage, but presumably at the end each party has to have things where they can tell their citizens that they told the other side to FRO and be sharp about it. It seems a bit, or perhaps more correctly, a lot of a stupid suggestion as it's clearly never going to be acceptable.

I think that my plan needs to be implemented immediately.

These arrogant halfwits need to understand that their hand is very weak.

Our politicians need to start talking about 10% import duties on German cars and 32% on French wines.

Great idea. Except they will recover any import duties by further increasing prices, which is not exactly good news for British consumers, especially given the low value of the £.

I guess we can find an alternative to Bordeaux, but alternatives to Mercedes, BMW, Volkswagen and Audi are less easy. Maybe we should put VAT up at the same time to really destroy consumer confidence?

[Elysium]

FiF said:

don4l said:

FiF said:

It's behind a pay wall but EU negotiators are going to propose that after Brexit any EU citizens living in Britain should remain (snigger) under the jurisdiction of EU law. Maybe this is an add on as to why they want to offer EU citizenship to British subjects after Brexit. Clearly the UK must reject this, that is a red line for me and, I suspect, many others.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/12/12/exclusi...

This has got to be posturing, surely?

The EU are currently adamant that the same rules must apply to all.

Well yes clearly it's posturing at this stage, but presumably at the end each party has to have things where they can tell their citizens that they told the other side to FRO and be sharp about it. It seems a bit, or perhaps more correctly, a lot of a stupid suggestion as it's clearly never going to be acceptable.

I don't see that this can be possible given the nature of UK law. Interestingly enough though, this would potentially void the argument in the supreme court as the UK govt would be able to notify under article 50 in the knowledge that the legal rights of UK citizens who wished to remain in Europe would not be affected.

[anonymous-user]

FiF said:

It's behind a pay wall but EU negotiators are going to propose that after Brexit any EU citizens living in Britain should remain (snigger) under the jurisdiction of EU law. Maybe this is an add on as to why they want to offer EU citizenship to British subjects after Brexit. Clearly the UK must reject this, that is a red line for me and, I suspect, many others.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/12/12/exclusi...

[Murph7355]

Elysium said:

...
I guess we can find an alternative to Bordeaux, but alternatives to Mercedes, BMW, Volkswagen and Audi are less easy. Maybe we should put VAT up at the same time to really destroy consumer confidence?

If prompted/pushed, most will find alternatives to those brands.

If not, extra money into the Exchequer to be used elsewhere.

[don4l]

Elysium said:

don4l said:

FiF said:

don4l said:

FiF said:

It's behind a pay wall but EU negotiators are going to propose that after Brexit any EU citizens living in Britain should remain (snigger) under the jurisdiction of EU law. Maybe this is an add on as to why they want to offer EU citizenship to British subjects after Brexit. Clearly the UK must reject this, that is a red line for me and, I suspect, many others.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/12/12/exclusi...

This has got to be posturing, surely?

The EU are currently adamant that the same rules must apply to all.

Well yes clearly it's posturing at this stage, but presumably at the end each party has to have things where they can tell their citizens that they told the other side to FRO and be sharp about it. It seems a bit, or perhaps more correctly, a lot of a stupid suggestion as it's clearly never going to be acceptable.

I think that my plan needs to be implemented immediately.

These arrogant halfwits need to understand that their hand is very weak.

Our politicians need to start talking about 10% import duties on German cars and 32% on French wines.

Great idea. Except they will recover any import duties by further increasing prices, which is not exactly good news for British consumers, especially given the low value of the £.

I guess we can find an alternative to Bordeaux, but alternatives to Mercedes, BMW, Volkswagen and Audi are less easy. Maybe we should put VAT up at the same time to really destroy consumer confidence?

Jaguar have a great range of cars that compete very well with BMWs. In fact, JLR are so pleased with the Brexit vote that they have recently announced the creation of an extra 10,000 jobs.

BMW already have manufacturing capacity in this country. If they want to protect their market here, then they could simply increase production at Cowley.

[anonymous-user]

don4l said:

There is no "may" about it.

We are leaving the Single Market.

826 days to go.

Or perhaps a bit longer.

I must admit that my bemusement at how the Govt is playing this, or even what the Govt is playing at, is growing.

[don4l]

Greg66 said:

don4l said:

There is no "may" about it.

We are leaving the Single Market.

826 days to go.

Or perhaps a bit longer.

I must admit that my bemusement at how the Govt is playing this, or even what the Govt is playing at, is growing.

Hammond is an absolute disaster.

If Hammond has his way, then the next PM will be Farage.

At the end of the day, we are a people's democracy.

[powerstroke]

Elysium said:

Great idea. Except they will recover any import duties by further increasing prices, which is not exactly good news for British consumers, especially given the low value of the £.

I guess we can find an alternative to Bordeaux, but alternatives to Mercedes, BMW, Volkswagen and Audi are less easy. Maybe we should put VAT up at the same time to really destroy consumer confidence?

Yes good point, without German cars how would the smug self entitled lower middle classes show their social status , it would make a real mess of the school run too !!!

[anonymous-user]

don4l said:

Greg66 said:

don4l said:

There is no "may" about it.

We are leaving the Single Market.

826 days to go.

Or perhaps a bit longer.

I must admit that my bemusement at how the Govt is playing this, or even what the Govt is playing at, is growing.

Hammond is an absolute disaster.

If Hammond has his way, then the next PM will be Farage.

At the end of the day, we are a people's democracy.

Not enough 'Low Grade People' (his phrase) to give his sort any power

[Elysium]

don4l said:

Elysium said:

don4l said:

FiF said:

don4l said:

FiF said:

It's behind a pay wall but EU negotiators are going to propose that after Brexit any EU citizens living in Britain should remain (snigger) under the jurisdiction of EU law. Maybe this is an add on as to why they want to offer EU citizenship to British subjects after Brexit. Clearly the UK must reject this, that is a red line for me and, I suspect, many others.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/12/12/exclusi...

This has got to be posturing, surely?

The EU are currently adamant that the same rules must apply to all.

Well yes clearly it's posturing at this stage, but presumably at the end each party has to have things where they can tell their citizens that they told the other side to FRO and be sharp about it. It seems a bit, or perhaps more correctly, a lot of a stupid suggestion as it's clearly never going to be acceptable.

I think that my plan needs to be implemented immediately.

These arrogant halfwits need to understand that their hand is very weak.

Our politicians need to start talking about 10% import duties on German cars and 32% on French wines.

Great idea. Except they will recover any import duties by further increasing prices, which is not exactly good news for British consumers, especially given the low value of the £.

I guess we can find an alternative to Bordeaux, but alternatives to Mercedes, BMW, Volkswagen and Audi are less easy. Maybe we should put VAT up at the same time to really destroy consumer confidence?

Jaguar have a great range of cars that compete very well with BMWs. In fact, JLR are so pleased with the Brexit vote that they have recently announced the creation of an extra 10,000 jobs.

BMW already have manufacturing capacity in this country. If they want to protect their market here, then they could simply increase production at Cowley.

We have been round this before. Jaguar are indian owned. Their cars are assembled here out of a kit of parts that is manufactured all over Europe.

BMW make mini's at Cowley and engines at Hams Hall. They are not going to invest enormous sums of money and cannibalise their existing production capacity to make a range of different models at those plants. Particularly if this is purely to combat protectionist taxation.

Your vexatious opposition to EU bureaucrats has led you to lose sight of the real target here. This policy would not hurt the EU, it would hurt businesses that employ lots of skilled British people and it would hurt consumers.

Incidentally, despite your obvious spin, Jaguar's investment in increased production was not a reflection of their pleasure at Brexit. It was planned some time ago and they have little choice other than to proceed as so much of their infrastructure (including lots of specialist support companies) is in the UK already.

[anonymous-user]

don4l said:

Jaguar have a great range of cars that compete very well with BMWs. In fact, JLR are so pleased with the Brexit vote that they have recently announced the creation of an extra 10,000 jobs.

BMW already have manufacturing capacity in this country. If they want to protect their market here, then they could simply increase production at Cowley.

Yeah jlr are just thrilled about Brexit
http://news.sky.com/story/jaguar-land-rover-admits...

[Blue62]

cookie118 said:

Yeah jlr are just thrilled about Brexit
http://news.sky.com/story/jaguar-land-rover-admits...

Sorry Cookie you are quite wrong, everything is going to be just fine, stop moaning and behaving like a sore loser you're upsetting the kids. There is a plan and hopefully our government ministers have been following a few of the Balloons on here to finalise the details, it's amazing how many highly intelligent, talented businessmen post on here, such a waste really.

[AC43]

It's funny how the guys that understand the numbers don't agree with the swivel eyed loons.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/12/12/philip-...

[768]

Nothing to do with kicking the can down the road until after a general election I'm sure.

[Pan Pan Pan]

With some of the talk about plans for Brexit, the real culprit was Camoron, because the arrogant smug f*ckwit was so sure the people of the UK would not vote to leave (especially after all the lies used by the remain campaign in project fear) he made no provision for that outcome, and knowing this, jumped ship, to leave someone else to deal with the situation he had left behind.
Now we are seeing repeated attempts to block Brexit by those who do not believe in democracy, or who only believe in democracy AFTER they have twisted and bent the issue to suit `their' position.
What possible point is there in voting in any future issues, from general elections, to referenda, if those that don't like the result democracy provides can twist, or bend the results to suit themselves, and not the democratic majority vote in the UK?