Redcar Steel plant
Discussion
holderd said:
Bodo said:
If it's not Chinese dumping - how are the continental European steels mills are doing financially?
They're doing badly. Chinese dumping is having an effect in that it's dragging market prices down globally. European mills are having to match these market prices. The majority are making a significant loss on every tonne produced. Current prices simply aren't sustainable, and more producers will go out of business if it continues. It will take a major reduction in capacity, or upturn in the world economy to get us to the point where prices are at the level they were 1-2 years ago. I can't see either of these things happening quickly.
So Chinese dumping is more indirectly to blame for the situation in the UK, IMO. Basically the stronger pound puts UK steel producers in a hopeless situation when competing with mainland Europe, let alone China/Russia.
I'm not suggesting we should give up on the UK steel industry/Tata, but as things stand we are extremely uncompetitive in the current economic situation. In an ideal world the government would prop this up until the market prices made it viable again. I'm not up on EU law, but some of the comments on here suggest that this would be 'illegal.'
John Redwood said:
The main imports of steel come from the EU
In January, the last month for official figures, the UK imported £202m of steel from the rest of the EU and only £80m from the Rest of the world. The way EU energy, regulatory and procurement policies are enforced in the UK versus the continent allow much more steel to be produced in the rest of the EU than here. This should be one of the prime issues.
As the government looks for a buyer with Tata it should also evaluate Tata’s closure costs so a buyer can have a realistic negotiation over a dowry for the plants.
http://johnredwoodsdiary.com/2016/04/01/the-main-i...In January, the last month for official figures, the UK imported £202m of steel from the rest of the EU and only £80m from the Rest of the world. The way EU energy, regulatory and procurement policies are enforced in the UK versus the continent allow much more steel to be produced in the rest of the EU than here. This should be one of the prime issues.
As the government looks for a buyer with Tata it should also evaluate Tata’s closure costs so a buyer can have a realistic negotiation over a dowry for the plants.
http://news.sky.com/story/1671109/china-hits-steel...
The Chinese show their real colours. Cheeky f
kers, just when Osborne was doing all he could in Europe to avoid a trade war, China fires the first bullet.
This is nothing more than an attempt to kill off British steel production. Nice people.
The Chinese show their real colours. Cheeky f
kers, just when Osborne was doing all he could in Europe to avoid a trade war, China fires the first bullet.This is nothing more than an attempt to kill off British steel production. Nice people.
Cobnapint said:
http://news.sky.com/story/1671109/china-hits-steel...
The Chinese show their real colours. Cheeky fkers, just when Osborne was doing all he could in Europe to avoid a trade war, China fires the first bullet.
This is nothing more than an attempt to kill off British steel production. Nice people.
So many of the far-eastern countries do this on goods from Europe and USA. It's high time we did the same to them!The Chinese show their real colours. Cheeky f
kers, just when Osborne was doing all he could in Europe to avoid a trade war, China fires the first bullet.This is nothing more than an attempt to kill off British steel production. Nice people.
Chinese slapped high tariffs on stsinless steel tube for use in power generation boilers, they reverse engineered how to make it to a decent enough standard for their pressure vessels, where they couldn't figure it out they used industrial espionage. Then they slapped very specific tariffs on EU imports.
FiF said:
Chinese slapped high tariffs on stsinless steel tube for use in power generation boilers, they reverse engineered how to make it to a decent enough standard for their pressure vessels, where they couldn't figure it out they used industrial espionage. Then they slapped very specific tariffs on EU imports.
and apparently our future prosperity depends on trade with them 
M-6fhs1 said:
The government baffles me.
Why not "keep the money in the family" and insist only British steel must be used in the construction of EVERYTHING built in this country.
Why line the pockets of other people
Because that is Nationalism, kryptonite to Globalism.Why not "keep the money in the family" and insist only British steel must be used in the construction of EVERYTHING built in this country.
Why line the pockets of other people
The future is Nationalism whether we wish to accept it now or later is of real concern though, it has to happen and the sooner the better as the first into the Nationalist pot has the rest of the World to build their wealth upon, like being the first Cheetah in a herd of crippled antelope, easy pickings, later as more Cheetahs appear the pickings become slim. The USA has been heading that way for a few years now and the repatriation of businesses to the USA has upset the Global Banking concerns, the result is low energy/fuel costs to kill the attraction of the US resurgence. That is, by the way, the real reason for the loathing of Trump, he will simply accelerate the repatriation of US Business back home and is likely to change the dollar structure, that scares the very wits out of the Cronies and their filthy form of usury to which we are all subject.
The Banks are no-ones friend, they should all be sequestered by any Nation taking on Nationalism seriously. I'd do it today, a weekend coup, midnight one Saturday/Sunday all owned by the Nation as a whole, compensation paid over 100 years with zero interest for all parties in the game. Good-bye to bad rubbish.
herewego said:
vonuber said:
So looked like the government vetoed the imposition of tariffs on Chinese steel by the EU.
Hmm.
Does anyone know if this is achieved by MEP vote or if the government is able to intervene directly?Hmm.
Certainly the way CMD was all over the Chinese delegation needs to be understood.
M-6fhs1 said:
The government baffles me.
Why not "keep the money in the family" and insist only British steel must be used in the construction of EVERYTHING built in this country.
Why line the pockets of other people
It's no longer practically possible. We might, at a push, have the ability to make the range of chemistries required, or at least most of them apart from a few very specialist proprietary grades. The real problem is the capability further down the line in secondary products. So much capacity has gone, large capital intensive metal bashing plants have closed and been scrapped, now shopping centres, shed parks and so on. Specifically, it would be possible, but would need such heavy capital investment that would make it economically impractical, rather than technically impossible.Why not "keep the money in the family" and insist only British steel must be used in the construction of EVERYTHING built in this country.
Why line the pockets of other people
Edited to add link to interesting piece
http://semipartisansam.com/2016/04/01/the-national...
Edited by FiF on Saturday 2nd April 09:31
DMN said:
vonuber said:
So looked like the government vetoed the imposition of tariffs on Chinese steel by the EU.
Hmm.
Utterly spineless.Hmm.
The World holds fabulous wealth and resource and it is being taking by the very few to the detriment of the very many.
Seems like people are missing a crucial part of the article.
[I]In October, Chinese companies were hit with EU anti-dumping duties on the same product, below a minimum price, of between 21% and 36% under the EU's "lesser duty rule".
The European Commission advocates higher punitive tariffs in cases such as this, but Britain has led the defence of the principle of lower duties levied in such cases.[/i]
So,
- Brussels blinked first with dumping tariffs
- UK veto'd further increases above whats quoted, probably because it was fairly obvious how China would react to this.
[I]In October, Chinese companies were hit with EU anti-dumping duties on the same product, below a minimum price, of between 21% and 36% under the EU's "lesser duty rule".
The European Commission advocates higher punitive tariffs in cases such as this, but Britain has led the defence of the principle of lower duties levied in such cases.[/i]
So,
- Brussels blinked first with dumping tariffs
- UK veto'd further increases above whats quoted, probably because it was fairly obvious how China would react to this.
Edited by KarlMac on Saturday 2nd April 09:33
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