Climate change - the POLITICAL debate.
Discussion
Gene Vincent said:
Lovelock on R4 now, 'A life Scientific'
I caught mention of Harrabin on R2 this morning, but stayed tuned only as far as hearing the name. Close shave. On went a driving track and off went Mr Roger 'Look At Me Rolling Over So Tickle My Tummy Please Jo' Harrabin.odyssey2200 said:
So how do we know that Dinosaurs had methanogenic bacteria?
Good question - though as I don't have an ology in dinosaur farts I also have no immediate reply. Anyone?UN Fails to Finalise Rio+20 Plan
After two weeks of closed door negotiations, a U.N. preparatory committee has failed to reach consensus on a global plan of action, titled "The Future We Want," to be adopted by a summit meeting of world leaders mid-June in Brazil. In an effort to break the deadlock, the PrepCom will give another shot at the zero draft when it holds an unscheduled five-day session beginning May 29. This will be a last ditch attempt to finalise the draft action plan.
Thalif Deen, IPS News, 07 May 2012
More of the same:
A statement released Friday by a coalition of international non-governmental organisations (NGOs) warned that Rio+20 "looks set to add almost nothing to global efforts to deliver sustainable development". Antonio Hill of Oxfam said, "After four months of talks on the so-called zero draft outcome document, the Rio+20 talks are stuck at zero." He said little or nothing has emerged that will deliver on what governments agreed was needed 20 years ago at the Earth Summit.
Thalif Deen, IPS News, 07 May 2012
Representatives from governments negotiating the outcome document for the United Nations Sustainable Development Conference (Rio+20) today agreed to add five more days of deliberations to bridge differences that have kept them from making further progress in negotiations. Countries have voiced concern over the theme of the green economy in the context of sustainable development and poverty, with some developing countries asserting that a green economy approach should not lead to green protectionism or limit growth and poverty eradication.
UN News Centre, 05 May 2012
After two weeks of closed door negotiations, a U.N. preparatory committee has failed to reach consensus on a global plan of action, titled "The Future We Want," to be adopted by a summit meeting of world leaders mid-June in Brazil. In an effort to break the deadlock, the PrepCom will give another shot at the zero draft when it holds an unscheduled five-day session beginning May 29. This will be a last ditch attempt to finalise the draft action plan.
Thalif Deen, IPS News, 07 May 2012
More of the same:
A statement released Friday by a coalition of international non-governmental organisations (NGOs) warned that Rio+20 "looks set to add almost nothing to global efforts to deliver sustainable development". Antonio Hill of Oxfam said, "After four months of talks on the so-called zero draft outcome document, the Rio+20 talks are stuck at zero." He said little or nothing has emerged that will deliver on what governments agreed was needed 20 years ago at the Earth Summit.
Thalif Deen, IPS News, 07 May 2012
Representatives from governments negotiating the outcome document for the United Nations Sustainable Development Conference (Rio+20) today agreed to add five more days of deliberations to bridge differences that have kept them from making further progress in negotiations. Countries have voiced concern over the theme of the green economy in the context of sustainable development and poverty, with some developing countries asserting that a green economy approach should not lead to green protectionism or limit growth and poverty eradication.
UN News Centre, 05 May 2012
Only tenuously related but I couldn't let this past without picking up on it; Telegraph article on a Welsh windfarm, usual planning controversy, raping landscapes, blah blah.
'It is predicted to generate 250 mega watts of power per year – the equivalent of powering 200,000 homes - and will inject £1bn into the local economy within 25 years of operation, according to the company.'
250 MW per year? Really? How fascinating.
1.25 kW per house? Really? How fascinating.
£40m injected into the local economy every year from a capital investment of £300m? Does it involve extortion and drug peddling?
EF biff speeling
'It is predicted to generate 250 mega watts of power per year – the equivalent of powering 200,000 homes - and will inject £1bn into the local economy within 25 years of operation, according to the company.'
250 MW per year? Really? How fascinating.
1.25 kW per house? Really? How fascinating.
£40m injected into the local economy every year from a capital investment of £300m? Does it involve extortion and drug peddling?
EF biff speeling
Edited by hidetheelephants on Wednesday 9th May 14:09
hidetheelephants said:
Only tenuously related but I couldn't let this past without picking up on it; Telegraph article on a Welsh windfarm, usual planning controversy, raping landscapes, blah blah.
'It is predicted to generate 250 mega watts of power per year – the equivalent of powering 200,000 homes - and will inject £1bn into the local economy within 25 years of operation, according to the company.'
250 MW per year? Really? How facinating.
1.25 kW per house? Really? How facinating.
£40m injected into the local economy every year from a capital investment of £300m? Does it involve extortion and drug peddling?
1.25KW per home. Hmm, interesting. To put that into perspective, one of the 4 halogen hobs use that amount of power by itself, so if you're trying to cook, you really need to think ahead, and forget putting the kettle on. I know this because we had 1.5KW of power in our home in Italy (we had to have it raised to 3KW - most UK homes, even single bed flats have about 25KW)'It is predicted to generate 250 mega watts of power per year – the equivalent of powering 200,000 homes - and will inject £1bn into the local economy within 25 years of operation, according to the company.'
250 MW per year? Really? How facinating.
1.25 kW per house? Really? How facinating.
£40m injected into the local economy every year from a capital investment of £300m? Does it involve extortion and drug peddling?
You don't realise any of this until you experience it - as for power showers, forget it!
You don't generate x megawatts per year, you simply generate x megawatts. The amount you generate per year is measured in kWh or MWh which is power multiplied by time. A Megawatt is a million watts or enough for 10,000 off 100 Watt bulbs all running at once. If you run them for an hour that's 1MWh
When reporters don't even understand the technicalities how can you believe the figures?
When reporters don't even understand the technicalities how can you believe the figures?
motco said:
You don't generate x megawatts per year, you simply generate x megawatts. The amount you generate per year is measured in kWh or MWh which is power multiplied by time. A Megawatt is a million watts or enough for 10,000 off 100 Watt bulbs all running at once. If you run them for an hour that's 1MWh
When reporters don't even understand the technicalities how can you believe the figures?
You are of course totally correct.When reporters don't even understand the technicalities how can you believe the figures?
But I suspect that these people think it will produce 250MW continuously throughout the whole year!
This is where the miss-information lies.
Wind currently only providing 2.8% of national demand at 1133MW, but predictions for tomorrow are much higher somewhere over 3200MW at lunchtime. Bit windy tomorrow then.
With 3744 turbines currently operational, providing only 2.8% of demand, we would need 134,785 to meet tonight's demand! With a CLAIMED power factor of 30%, we really need 449,283 windy mills to guarantee to meet tonight's demand!
With 242,900 Square kilometres in the UK, that is 2 in every square kilometre!!
But they can cram then in at 20 per square kilometre.
That is still 22,464 square kilometres covered in widymills!
Which with the UK's predilection in winter of sub-zero temps aligned to high pressure and zero wind, that makes great economic sense!
Yes know my figures are b
ks, but so are theirs and it don't stop them!European Parliament Cancels Rio+20 Participation as Developing Nations Push Back Green Agenda
The European Parliament has cancelled plans to send a delegation to the UN's Rio+20 summit on sustainable development taking place in June, saying the costs are too prohibitive. “The huge increase in the estimated cost of attending the summit is simply not justifiable, especially at a time when many Europeans are faced with economic hardship,” said Matthias Groote, the chairman of the environment committee.
Dave Keating, European Voice, 09 May 2012
During the Ri+20 negotiations the G77 group has been the main force behind the push-back. Many within the group are concerned that the “green economy” is merely a ploy by northern countries to jump start their own troubled economies through technology and service transfers that the south would require in order to participate in the “green economy”. For the G77, poverty eradication has proven more important than the green economy. Implicit within the G77′s arguments during negotiations is their belief that job growth and development, which are essential for poverty eradication, are more important than the environmental policies that the UN is championing.[/i]
Timothy Herrmann, Turtle Bay and Beyond, 07 May 2012
The European Parliament has cancelled plans to send a delegation to the UN's Rio+20 summit on sustainable development taking place in June, saying the costs are too prohibitive. “The huge increase in the estimated cost of attending the summit is simply not justifiable, especially at a time when many Europeans are faced with economic hardship,” said Matthias Groote, the chairman of the environment committee.
Dave Keating, European Voice, 09 May 2012
During the Ri+20 negotiations the G77 group has been the main force behind the push-back. Many within the group are concerned that the “green economy” is merely a ploy by northern countries to jump start their own troubled economies through technology and service transfers that the south would require in order to participate in the “green economy”. For the G77, poverty eradication has proven more important than the green economy. Implicit within the G77′s arguments during negotiations is their belief that job growth and development, which are essential for poverty eradication, are more important than the environmental policies that the UN is championing.[/i]
Timothy Herrmann, Turtle Bay and Beyond, 07 May 2012
Stupicide in DaftAsABrush Land
Households will be made to pay for wind farms and nuclear power stations under a new Energy Bill that will force up electricity bills by around £200 a year. The new laws revealed in the Queen's Speech will bring in a raft of costly subsidies to help energy companies pay for “green” electricity. British households will have to cover the cost of the subsidies through their energy bills over the next 20 years. Ed Miliband, the leader of the Labour Party, accused the Government of making “an energy bill with nothing to help people struggling to make ends meet”. Businesses are also concerned that rising electricity bills could make the recession worse by forcing them to move abroad.
Rowena Mason, The Daily Telegraph, 09 May 2012
Households will be made to pay for wind farms and nuclear power stations under a new Energy Bill that will force up electricity bills by around £200 a year. The new laws revealed in the Queen's Speech will bring in a raft of costly subsidies to help energy companies pay for “green” electricity. British households will have to cover the cost of the subsidies through their energy bills over the next 20 years. Ed Miliband, the leader of the Labour Party, accused the Government of making “an energy bill with nothing to help people struggling to make ends meet”. Businesses are also concerned that rising electricity bills could make the recession worse by forcing them to move abroad.
Rowena Mason, The Daily Telegraph, 09 May 2012
turbobloke said:
Stupicide in DaftAsABrush Land
Households will be made to pay for wind farms and nuclear power stations under a new Energy Bill that will force up electricity bills by around £200 a year. The new laws revealed in the Queen's Speech will bring in a raft of costly subsidies to help energy companies pay for “green” electricity. British households will have to cover the cost of the subsidies through their energy bills over the next 20 years. Ed Miliband, the leader of the Labour Party, accused the Government of making “an energy bill with nothing to help people struggling to make ends meet”. Businesses are also concerned that rising electricity bills could make the recession worse by forcing them to move abroad.
Rowena Mason, The Daily Telegraph, 09 May 2012
I have no problem subsidising nuclear as its a reliable, proven technology, I would never want to subsidise wind as its highly expensive and unreliable.Households will be made to pay for wind farms and nuclear power stations under a new Energy Bill that will force up electricity bills by around £200 a year. The new laws revealed in the Queen's Speech will bring in a raft of costly subsidies to help energy companies pay for “green” electricity. British households will have to cover the cost of the subsidies through their energy bills over the next 20 years. Ed Miliband, the leader of the Labour Party, accused the Government of making “an energy bill with nothing to help people struggling to make ends meet”. Businesses are also concerned that rising electricity bills could make the recession worse by forcing them to move abroad.
Rowena Mason, The Daily Telegraph, 09 May 2012
Regiment said:
I have no problem subsidising nuclear as its a reliable, proven technology, I would never want to subsidise wind as its highly expensive and unreliable.
But sadly looks like we are all going to have to unless the MSM wake up one day and "get it". This is like one of those stiletto blades slipped between the ribs without anybody noticing, but causes irreparable harm. Like you I don't mind investing in something that works but there is no case for wind. It's almost as if somebody close the PM is benefitting from it! Oh, wait a minute....http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/prince-char...
Charles the warmist:
Charles the warmist:
torygraph said:
The Prince spoke of “cold, wet and windy” weather across most of Scotland with temperatures of just 8C, and ended by quipping: “Thank God it isn’t a Bank Holiday.”
I wonder how long his belief system holds up against reality?turbobloke said:
Stupicide in DaftAsABrush Land
Households will be made to pay for wind farms and nuclear power stations under a new Energy Bill that will force up electricity bills by around £200 a year. The new laws revealed in the Queen's Speech will bring in a raft of costly subsidies to help energy companies pay for “green” electricity. British households will have to cover the cost of the subsidies through their energy bills over the next 20 years. Ed Miliband, the leader of the Labour Party, accused the Government of making “an energy bill with nothing to help people struggling to make ends meet”. Businesses are also concerned that rising electricity bills could make the recession worse by forcing them to move abroad.
Rowena Mason, The Daily Telegraph, 09 May 2012
How quickly politicians forget........Households will be made to pay for wind farms and nuclear power stations under a new Energy Bill that will force up electricity bills by around £200 a year. The new laws revealed in the Queen's Speech will bring in a raft of costly subsidies to help energy companies pay for “green” electricity. British households will have to cover the cost of the subsidies through their energy bills over the next 20 years. Ed Miliband, the leader of the Labour Party, accused the Government of making “an energy bill with nothing to help people struggling to make ends meet”. Businesses are also concerned that rising electricity bills could make the recession worse by forcing them to move abroad.
Rowena Mason, The Daily Telegraph, 09 May 2012
Ed the red was following the same path when he was in office
http://m.guardian.co.uk/environment/2009/jul/15/ed...
Windmills are never going to be cheap with there back up requirements.
Globs said:
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/prince-char...
Charles the warmist:
Disqus fight lads, form an orderly queue and bundle in Charles the warmist:
torygraph said:
The Prince spoke of “cold, wet and windy” weather across most of Scotland with temperatures of just 8C, and ended by quipping: “Thank God it isn’t a Bank Holiday.”
I wonder how long his belief system holds up against reality?
Word has arrived that R4 was apparently quite naughty this morning - I didn't hear it, how about PHers?
Allegedly on R4 "Thought For The Day" John Bell, Iona Community, compared climate sceptics with paedophiles and warmongers and claimed that all sceptics were men.
Jo Nova should be concerned on top of being, like the rest of us presumably, outraged at this vile bile if it was actually aired. Iplayer?
Allegedly on R4 "Thought For The Day" John Bell, Iona Community, compared climate sceptics with paedophiles and warmongers and claimed that all sceptics were men.
Jo Nova should be concerned on top of being, like the rest of us presumably, outraged at this vile bile if it was actually aired. Iplayer?
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