Interest rates going up soon...

[s2art]

tannhauser said:

s2art said:

Ari said:

Rovinghawk said:

There are many other ways to make a return on investment. The fact remains that if one wishes to make a decent return on savings it is possible but requires a little work & a little risk.
You can't expect to get decent returns for no work & no risk.

Cool, do go on? (Other than going back in time and buying property).

I think both Shell and BP shares offer better than 5% yield and there are others. Start an ISA.

But shares have risk. ISAs are a waste of time nowadays.

That depends on what capital gains you may have. There is no capital gains tax on shares in an ISA.

[Murph7355]

tannhauser said:

I'm rather risk averse and don't have the time to make an informed decision to calculate any risky moves. I therefore accept the returns are going to be limited - but right now in a general sense, they are disgusting and bordering on obscene.

FYI I fanny about with a number of bank accounts, moving money around, paying it in etc. Make maybe 1-2% on average on interest and monthly rewards etc.

Regular savers are a bit of a con - the headline 2% probably works out at 1% (still better than nowt) by the time you take into account payments in made over the year, interest only added at the end etc.

Whatever happened to a pretty standard bank account that paid a reasonably decent rate of interest? Actually to be fair, Nationwide do if you've been with them a while - 0.6% on unlimited balance I think. Zero fannying around...

The returns are a symptom of the market. If you're risk averse and can't be arsed/don't have time, you won't get much return. This is the same for anything you do. People often look at what others get (in your case "banks") and think "that's not fair, why can't I have some". You can. But not whilst being risk averse and sitting on your arse (No matter what your views on what banks do to make money).

You need to firm yourself up for what is to come from the banking sector IMO. Not only will you make a pittance in interest, it won't be long before you are asked to pay to deposit your money with them and avail yourself of credit cards, debit cards, online services etc etc etc. The more regulation and safeguards that are applied to your money, the more it costs banks to administer. Guess who picks up those costs?

[tannhauser]

Murph7355 said:

You need to firm yourself up for what is to come from the banking sector IMO. Not only will you make a pittance in interest, it won't be long before you are asked to pay to deposit your money with them and avail yourself of credit cards, debit cards, online services etc etc etc. The more regulation and safeguards that are applied to your money, the more it costs banks to administer. Guess who picks up those costs?

As much as that concerns me, I can't see it happening. Otherwise people will pile into gold, Bitcoin, barter etc. But yes, it's the prudent and careful who end up getting shafted.

[Willy Nilly]

Murph7355 said:

tannhauser said:

This completely. Typical of the usual, detached-from-this-world ste that is spouted on here daily. And as for his story about paying a teenager £100 to (not) look after a hamster!

This comment "profoundly irritated" me:

ClaphamGT3 said:

What profoundly irritates me about arguments like this is the implication that savers should be rewarded without taking risk.

What is wrong with expecting some semblance of a return from a bank that is making money from your money?

Out of interest, what moves have you made to see how you could better invest your money?

There is nothing wrong with wanting a return from banks. That is not what was being said. Just don't expect large %ages unless you take some risk.

When investing it's a good idea to spread the risk around. I've got quite a bit of money tied up long term in various funds, but also have cash piling up with no useful home for it. Historically, one would accept a lower return on your cash sum but get security and access to it. Now how ever you get no return and the banks are acting like they are doing you a favour in looking after it for you, when in reality, they are investing it.

The start of the whole problem was banks had run out of people to lend money to, in that everyone that wanted a loan and could afford to pay it back had one. So they started flogging loans to people that had no hope of ever making the payments. Then the banks stopped lending any money, so governments stepped in so they could carry on lending too much money to people, which caused the problem in the first place.

All low interests rates have done is prop up the housing market. To some extent they have also propped up businesses that really should go to the wall, but I ended up lending money to a friend of mine to buy a lorry because banks aren't keen on lending the money that the tax payer has given them to lend to businesses.

Taking a step back and looking at my portfolio (such as it is) as a whole, I'm wondering if the low interest rates have been largely made up for in the inflation of various funds. It may make sense to chuck a load more of my cash away in these funds, but they still look over valued to me and what can shoot up in value because people have been looking for a home for cash, can shoot back down again, so I feel it's best to spread the risk around.

[Rovinghawk]

tannhauser said:

I'm rather risk averse and don't have the time to make an informed decision to calculate any risky moves. I therefore accept the returns are going to be limited - but right now in a general sense, they are disgusting and bordering on obscene.

My ex wanted me to find a suitable pension scheme for her: zero risk, low investment and after a short time it would pay out large amounts. When I pointed out that such a thing doesn't exist she was highly upset & queried why not, on the basis that there would be a huge demand for it.

You remind me of her.

[Murph7355]

Willy Nilly said:

...
All low interests rates have done is prop up the housing market. To some extent they have also propped up businesses that really should go to the wall, but I ended up lending money to a friend of mine to buy a lorry because banks aren't keen on lending the money that the tax payer has given them to lend to businesses.
...

Whist at the same time insisting that they didn't lend to bad risks and build up their reserves...

Most of the banks played daft games. But they weren't the only guilty parties. Governments and ultimately all of us played our part too.

What interest rate did you charge your mate?

[Jockman]

Rovinghawk said:

My ex wanted me to find a suitable pension scheme for her: zero risk, low investment and after a short time it would pay out large amounts. When I pointed out that such a thing doesn't exist she was highly upset & queried why not, on the basis that there would be a huge demand for it.

Such a scheme does exist for her. It's called your pension. Is your food tasting quite salty these days?

[youngsyr]

Threads like these make me laugh - seems that despite being powerful company directors, most PHers' idea of sophisticated investing is an HSBC savings account.

For all those mystified by these impossible 5% returns on investment, here you go (6%+ for the past 4 years) - no BTL involved, just a simple business loan.

https://www.fundingcircle.com/uk/investors/

[crankedup]

Never risk more than you can afford to lose, that is what was drummed into me when I was young. Don’t put all of your eggs into one basket. Spread your risk, know when to draw your profits. Stop / loss points on your investments and reading the ‘Investors Chronicle’. None of this excuses banks insulting rates for investors so best to put cash elsewhere. But even the Nationwide B.S ceo is getting on the fat cat pay scales now.

[Rovinghawk]

Jockman said:

Such a scheme does exist for her. It's called your pension. Is your food tasting quite salty these days?

She's married to someone else & no longer an issue, thanks.

[Murph7355]

crankedup said:

Never risk more than you can afford to lose, that is what was drummed into me when I was young. Don’t put all of your eggs into one basket. Spread your risk, know when to draw your profits. Stop / loss points on your investments and reading the ‘Investors Chronicle’. None of this excuses banks insulting rates for investors so best to put cash elsewhere. But even the Nationwide B.S ceo is getting on the fat cat pay scales now.

First the CoOp let you down...

[crankedup]

Murph7355 said:

crankedup said:

Never risk more than you can afford to lose, that is what was drummed into me when I was young. Don’t put all of your eggs into one basket. Spread your risk, know when to draw your profits. Stop / loss points on your investments and reading the ‘Investors Chronicle’. None of this excuses banks insulting rates for investors so best to put cash elsewhere. But even the Nationwide B.S ceo is getting on the fat cat pay scales now.

First the CoOp let you down...

Was you surprised by the revelations regarding the co-op bank mismanagement?

[sidicks]

tannhauser said:

But shares have risk. ISAs are a waste of time nowadays.

ISAS are simply a tax efficient wrapper. Do you mean that cash ISAs are a waste of time nowadays?

[sidicks]

tannhauser said:

I'm rather risk averse and don't have the time to make an informed decision to calculate any risky moves. I therefore accept the returns are going to be limited - but right now in a general sense, they are disgusting and bordering on obscene.

FYI I fanny about with a number of bank accounts, moving money around, paying it in etc. Make maybe 1-2% on average on interest and monthly rewards etc.

Regular savers are a bit of a con - the headline 2% probably works out at 1% (still better than nowt) by the time you take into account payments in made over the year, interest only added at the end etc.

Er, no. If you only have money invested for on average half of the year, you only get half the interest! It's still the promised 2% return !!

tannhauser said:

Whatever happened to a pretty standard bank account that paid a reasonably decent rate of interest? Actually to be fair, Nationwide do if you've been with them a while - 0.6% on unlimited balance I think. Zero fannying around.

Interest rates are very low - where do you expect the bank to put your money?

How much do you pay for your bank account and all of the services that go with it?

[sidicks]

crankedup said:

Never risk more than you can afford to lose, that is what was drummed into me when I was young. Don’t put all of your eggs into one basket. Spread your risk, know when to draw your profits. Stop / loss points on your investments and reading the ‘Investors Chronicle’. None of this excuses banks insulting rates for investors so best to put cash elsewhere. But even the Nationwide B.S ceo is getting on the fat cat pay scales now.

Where are risk free investment yields at the moment?

What costs do you incur for your bank account?

[sidicks]

sidicks said:

crankedup said:

Never risk more than you can afford to lose, that is what was drummed into me when I was young. Don’t put all of your eggs into one basket. Spread your risk, know when to draw your profits. Stop / loss points on your investments and reading the ‘Investors Chronicle’. None of this excuses banks insulting rates for investors so best to put cash elsewhere. But even the Nationwide B.S ceo is getting on the fat cat pay scales now.

Where are risk free investment yields at the moment?

What costs do you incur for your bank account?

Crankedup?

[Murph7355]

crankedup said:

Was you surprised by the revelations regarding the co-op bank mismanagement?

Nope.

[Murph7355]

sidicks said:

Crankedup?

He's having his afternoon nap.

[Digga]

Murph7355 said:

crankedup said:

Was you surprised by the revelations regarding the co-op bank mismanagement?

Nope.

Be fair mate - the whole Crystal Methodist stunt was pretty left of field. I don't think anyone expected that, even if they did suspect rank incompetence.

[Ari]

youngsyr said:

Threads like these make me laugh - seems that despite being powerful company directors, most PHers' idea of sophisticated investing is an HSBC savings account.

For all those mystified by these impossible 5% returns on investment, here you go (6%+ for the past 4 years) - no BTL involved, just a simple business loan.

https://www.fundingcircle.com/uk/investors/

You've actually achieved a steady 6%+ for four straight years or you've seen their web site claiming these returns?

I seem to recall when looking into this before that on closer analysis you only got the published rate of interest when your money was actually 'in play', which typically was about half the time it was invested. Take off management fees and bad debts and the real rate of return was somewhat less impressive.

That was a few years ago though, maybe things have changed?