UKIP - The Future - Volume 3

[FredClogs]

steveT350C said:

Looks like UKIP new for 6 months about illegal immigrants working in Bashirs Resaurant.

http://order-order.com/2015/01/26/bashir-lied-abou...

Looks like the new politics and politicians which Farage claims to represent is just the same as the old politics and politicians.

[Scuffers]

vonuber said:

Scuffers said:

yes, those already legally here can stay.

So all of them then.

[steveT350C]

"It’s been fascinating to see Ukip supposedly on the back foot for a change. Negative headlines and a defection make for a serious challenge to Nigel Farage’s relatively serene ride on to the national stage. Or, do they?"

http://www.independent.co.uk/voices/comment/ukip-o...

[Yazar]

vonuber said:

Scuffers said:

yes, those already legally here can stay.

So all of them then.

Yes.

But minus any state handouts or nhs without insurance for x years, including a ban on any low pay topups. Those who have skills and can benefit us will stay, those big issue sellers and car washers relying on the state to top up their low pay/part time hours will struggle without free benefits & housing costs so will leave.

[steveT350C]

"Just a couple of days ago I wrote about the disaster of European energy policy, which is creating “an Industrial Massacre in Europe” (former Commissioner Antonio Tajani). It is driving jobs and investment and industry — and emissions — out of Europe altogether. Often they go to jurisdictions with lower environmental standards, so we may also be increasing global emissions as we undermine EU competitiveness.

In steel, and aluminium, and petroleum refining, and glass, and chemicals, and cement, plants are closing and hundreds of thousands — maybe millions — of jobs are being lost across Europe. And this is the result not of bad luck, or an act of fate, but as a direct consequence of deliberate policy decisions which have forced up the price of energy.

I described how a new proposal for a “Market Stability Reserve” attached to the ETS was deliberately designed to raise the cost of energy still further — the steel industry expects a 40% increase by 2020. Major industries clinging on by their finger-nails see this as the coup de grace."

More...
https://rogerhelmermep.wordpress.com/2015/01/26/ec...

[BlackLabel]

So Bashir has gone from Labour to Respect to UKIP to the Cons - where next I wonder, the Greens?

Also, given the regional list system by which MEPs are elected, what happens when an MEP dies or steps down? Irrelevant in this case I know because Bashir has refused to step down.

[Zod]

BlackLabel said:

Also, given the regional list system by which MEPs are elected, what happens when an MEP dies or steps down? Irrelevant in this case I know because Bashir has refused to step down.

Ask Roger Helmer; not only did he not step down and call a by-election when he defected, he also claimed he would retire at the next election.

[FiF]

steveT350C said:

"Just a couple of days ago I wrote about the disaster of European energy policy, which is creating “an Industrial Massacre in Europe” (former Commissioner Antonio Tajani). It is driving jobs and investment and industry — and emissions — out of Europe altogether. Often they go to jurisdictions with lower environmental standards, so we may also be increasing global emissions as we undermine EU competitiveness.

In steel, and aluminium, and petroleum refining, and glass, and chemicals, and cement, plants are closing and hundreds of thousands — maybe millions — of jobs are being lost across Europe. And this is the result not of bad luck, or an act of fate, but as a direct consequence of deliberate policy decisions which have forced up the price of energy.

I described how a new proposal for a “Market Stability Reserve” attached to the ETS was deliberately designed to raise the cost of energy still further — the steel industry expects a 40% increase by 2020. Major industries clinging on by their finger-nails see this as the coup de grace."

More...
https://rogerhelmermep.wordpress.com/2015/01/26/ec...

And the Conservatives together with the Greens supporting an amendment to bring it all in 4 years earlier by 2017.

Cons should leave in disgrace. Stuff like this is as bad as "there is no more money."

[JustAnotherLogin]

steveT350C said:

"Just a couple of days ago I wrote about the disaster of European energy policy, which is creating “an Industrial Massacre in Europe” (former Commissioner Antonio Tajani). It is driving jobs and investment and industry — and emissions — out of Europe altogether. Often they go to jurisdictions with lower environmental standards, so we may also be increasing global emissions as we undermine EU competitiveness.

In steel, and aluminium, and petroleum refining, and glass, and chemicals, and cement, plants are closing and hundreds of thousands — maybe millions — of jobs are being lost across Europe. And this is the result not of bad luck, or an act of fate, but as a direct consequence of deliberate policy decisions which have forced up the price of energy.

I described how a new proposal for a “Market Stability Reserve” attached to the ETS was deliberately designed to raise the cost of energy still further — the steel industry expects a 40% increase by 2020. Major industries clinging on by their finger-nails see this as the coup de grace."

More...
https://rogerhelmermep.wordpress.com/2015/01/26/ec...

Or, since those industries have been shrinking for decades here - long before the energy policy he complains of- perhaps it is more likely down to high labour costs in developed economies rather than developing ones.

I still don't get the obsession some politicians have with low profit, low (for developed economy) salaried, heavy industry

[FredClogs]

JustAnotherLogin said:

I still don't get the obsession some politicians have with low profit, low (for developed economy) salaried, heavy industry

It appeals to the core UKIP voters, men in the 50s and 60s who hark back to the glory days of British industry before it was all ruined by the socialists and their desire for better wages/working conditions and health and safety etc... etc...

[Scuffers]

FredClogs said:

It appeals to the core UKIP voters, men in the 50s and 60s who hark back to the glory days of British industry before it was all ruined by the socialists and their desire for better wages/working conditions and health and safety etc... etc...

blinkers firmly attached!

[turbobloke]

Scuffers said:

FredClogs said:

It appeals to the core UKIP voters, men in the 50s and 60s who hark back to the glory days of British industry before it was all ruined by the socialists and their desire for better wages/working conditions and health and safety etc... etc...

blinkers firmly attached!

And good for a laugh on a Monday at the end of January.

[JustAnotherLogin]

Scuffers said:

FredClogs said:

It appeals to the core UKIP voters, men in the 50s and 60s who hark back to the glory days of British industry before it was all ruined by the socialists and their desire for better wages/working conditions and health and safety etc... etc...

blinkers firmly attached!

So go on then, tell me.

Why does it matter that stuff like steel making with its low salaries, horrible working conditions and low profits are replaced by highly paid jobs in pharmaceuticals, aerospace, space etc? Is there something wrong with the fact that these jobs are done in nice air condition offices in safety rather than hot dangerous factories?

If Fred is wrong, what is the reason?

[Mr_B]

So just to recap, this guy has no idea what even his politics are and hawks himself around any party that may have him because he seems a bit power hungry. Labour and Respect don't want but Ukip could use as many brown people as they can get to add some not racist credibility and so take him, ignore his past dodgy dealings and try to gloss over those, shove him in front of the cameras and give him a spokesman job more based on his skin colour than anything else.

Seems either he gets wind that Ukip are desperately having to cover for him and ain't happy , but feel the need to tell it ride, based mostly on his skin colour again, and would rather he stayed. He's got Daniel Hannan whispering in his ear with a tempting offer to trade Ukip for a safe and stable Conservative seat without any hassle and perhaps more prominence and frankly, a much better job than he can get with the Ukip minnows and so makes the jump.

Conservative HQ think they got a bargain, only to find out they've fallen for the political equivalent of X-Box ebay scam ( you buy an empty x-box package thinking you are buying an x-box games machine ) and it's kinda backfired in their face and left them with a joke of an MEP. I'm not totally sure Ukip are the losers here, rather the party of Government is and the only two to come out of it unscathed are Labour ( just ) and Respect.

Lets takes bets on where he hawks himself next . 3/1 down in Tower Hamlets with Lutfar Rahmann. 10/1 the new Syriza communities spokesman. 5/1 George Galloway can find some use for him and he is the Respect man on immigration. 1000/1 exposed as the prick he seems to be and out of a job and back to employing illegal immigrants in some scam.

[Camoradi]

JustAnotherLogin said:

So go on then, tell me.

Why does it matter that stuff like steel making with its low salaries, horrible working conditions and low profits are replaced by highly paid jobs in pharmaceuticals, aerospace, space etc? Is there something wrong with the fact that these jobs are done in nice air condition offices in safety rather than hot dangerous factories?

If Fred is wrong, what is the reason?

Because not everyone is cut out for the jobs you describe? Some people might want to be a steel worker..

[steveT350C]

Camoradi said:

JustAnotherLogin said:

So go on then, tell me.

Why does it matter that stuff like steel making with its low salaries, horrible working conditions and low profits are replaced by highly paid jobs in pharmaceuticals, aerospace, space etc? Is there something wrong with the fact that these jobs are done in nice air condition offices in safety rather than hot dangerous factories?

If Fred is wrong, what is the reason?

Because not everyone is cut out for the jobs you describe? Some people might want to be a steel worker..

UK steel exports on the up as well

[Scuffers]

JustAnotherLogin said:

So go on then, tell me.

Why does it matter that stuff like steel making with its low salaries, horrible working conditions and low profits are replaced by highly paid jobs in pharmaceuticals, aerospace, space etc? Is there something wrong with the fact that these jobs are done in nice air condition offices in safety rather than hot dangerous factories?

If Fred is wrong, what is the reason?

just because some people support UKIP does not mean they are 50-60 and hanker for time past.

However, now you have brought it up, are you trying to suggest that the woes of the 70's and 80's were down to wicked capitalism and our only saviours were Scargill/Robinson/etc?

[JustAnotherLogin]

It is looking a bit that way Mrr B, except I think there are more losers:

UKIP for a few reasons:
a) because they have taken a hit in bad PR already and you don't get that back so easily
b) because they do appear to have been suppressing what they knew until now - and thats the sort of thing they claim they don't do
c) because they have lost their "where's Amjid" proof that they are not racist

Labour - possibly. I hope someone will probe further into these suggestions of a labour plot to rig the UKIP selection. My reason being that as I said before, any act designed to undermine the legitimacy of the democratic process is extremely serious

And then there are the conservatives. I don't think they have taken much of a hit so far - outside threads such as this I don't think many people will have noticed. But it could hurt later - if only because it will be used as a weapon by the other parties. Yet the Tories do have the chance to clean it up - if they expel him soon citing new evidence that had been suppressed by UKIP etc then they could come out OK. Or leave a weapon for the others in their midst

[steveT350C]

185

World steel production been enjoying continuous growth since 1970. World production 3 times higher than in 1970

http://www.worldsteel.org/dms/internetDocumentList...

[Yazar]

JustAnotherLogin said:

c) because they have lost their "where's Amjid" proof that they are not racist

That point imo is not correct - If the guy had come our and said 'I'm leavng as they are racist and I have experienced x,y and z behind the scenes' than that could have been a major blow, but he hasn't.


UKIP have multiple other 'where's the proof Amjad's including the latest: http://www.itv.com/news/west/update/2014-12-29/fir...