45th President Of The United States, Donald Trump (Vol. 14)
Discussion
minimoog said:
98elise said:
All it does is stop the properties being confiscated while he appeals. If they started confiscating his properties he could still appeal,
Ok, granted.98elise said:
Either way when the appeals process is exhausted they now have a pot of money rather than no money.. if the appeal doesn't reduce the fine (which is all he is appealing) then they can go after the properties for the rest.
They'll have a pot of someone else's money, not Trump's. Yes in theory he'll owe it to some business or other but we all know how he handles those debts. Ultmately I'd rather they had Trump himself on the hook for the full 450M. This feels like a massive let-off, and plenty of commentariat lawyers agree. One described it as a 'travesty of justice'.
And it's hitting elsewhere - a 32 point swing to the Dems in Alabama house election, in a solid Red state is massive
minimoog said:
98elise said:
All it does is stop the properties being confiscated while he appeals. If they started confiscating his properties he could still appeal,
Ok, granted.98elise said:
Either way when the appeals process is exhausted they now have a pot of money rather than no money.. if the appeal doesn't reduce the fine (which is all he is appealing) then they can go after the properties for the rest.
They'll have a pot of someone else's money, not Trump's. Yes in theory he'll owe it to some business or other but we all know how he handles those debts. Ultmately I'd rather they had Trump himself on the hook for the full 450M. This feels like a massive let-off, and plenty of commentariat lawyers agree. One described it as a 'travesty of justice'.
Biden campaign already attacking most days about Broke Basement Don, not campaigning because he's skint, playing golf instead.
Byker28i said:
And it's hitting elsewhere - a 32 point swing to the Dems in Alabama house election, in a solid Red state is massive
It's about now, that you'd have thought the GOP grownups would start pushing Hikki Haley as a viable option to get her back in the race as a sensible choice, but I don't think there are any grownups left.It feels to me like the election result is going to be massively different to the false jeopardy "trump could win it" headlines from the news media.
This thread has turned into Dunning Kruger complex at it's finest.
Someone made the point yesterday that it would be wrong to opine on their line of work.
I would simply not comment on something I have no knowledge of but would certainly respect the views of someone who knows that field.
Trump is already in a big financial hole. As I have repeatedly said real life is not a TV show where everything happens in a few episodes.
Since we have now degenerated into personal remarks despite what I have patiently tried to explain I'll leave further comment to the experts here and not waste my time.
Someone made the point yesterday that it would be wrong to opine on their line of work.
I would simply not comment on something I have no knowledge of but would certainly respect the views of someone who knows that field.
Trump is already in a big financial hole. As I have repeatedly said real life is not a TV show where everything happens in a few episodes.
Since we have now degenerated into personal remarks despite what I have patiently tried to explain I'll leave further comment to the experts here and not waste my time.
tangerine_sedge said:
Byker28i said:
And it's hitting elsewhere - a 32 point swing to the Dems in Alabama house election, in a solid Red state is massive
It's about now, that you'd have thought the GOP grownups would start pushing Hikki Haley as a viable option to get her back in the race as a sensible choice, but I don't think there are any grownups left.It feels to me like the election result is going to be massively different to the false jeopardy "trump could win it" headlines from the news media.
A better question would be whether the Trump voters would vote for the GOP anyway. I would assume yes, in which case they’d surely be better off appealing to the more moderate base?
DanL said:
tangerine_sedge said:
Byker28i said:
And it's hitting elsewhere - a 32 point swing to the Dems in Alabama house election, in a solid Red state is massive
It's about now, that you'd have thought the GOP grownups would start pushing Hikki Haley as a viable option to get her back in the race as a sensible choice, but I don't think there are any grownups left.It feels to me like the election result is going to be massively different to the false jeopardy "trump could win it" headlines from the news media.
A better question would be whether the Trump voters would vote for the GOP anyway. I would assume yes, in which case they’d surely be better off appealing to the more moderate base?
You would think the parties would naturally merge into much the same as each other with right or left tinges accordingly, yet instead the right has abandoned the middle ground completely with Trump,
I can only assume its to stop fragmentation of the party into pieces that could never win against a 'full and solid' other side
cgt2 said:
This thread has turned into Dunning Kruger complex at it's finest.
Someone made the point yesterday that it would be wrong to opine on their line of work.
I would simply not comment on something I have no knowledge of but would certainly respect the views of someone who knows that field.
Trump is already in a big financial hole. As I have repeatedly said real life is not a TV show where everything happens in a few episodes.
Since we have now degenerated into personal remarks despite what I have patiently tried to explain I'll leave further comment to the experts here and not waste my time.
I would say you have on occasion adopted a patronising tone and your explanations have reflected exasperation and impatience. Someone made the point yesterday that it would be wrong to opine on their line of work.
I would simply not comment on something I have no knowledge of but would certainly respect the views of someone who knows that field.
Trump is already in a big financial hole. As I have repeatedly said real life is not a TV show where everything happens in a few episodes.
Since we have now degenerated into personal remarks despite what I have patiently tried to explain I'll leave further comment to the experts here and not waste my time.
None of us are challenging your legal expertise or trying to pretend that we know much about the law. Quite simply, I and some others are mystified by why, despite regular assurances that things won't happen, they do. That leads people to conclude that the process will continue, backed up by events in the last week which we were told couldn't happen but are now being spun as 'better something now than nothing and we'll get there in the end'.
We know that it shouldn't happen because people like you keep telling us that it can't. Then it does. I can quite believe he'll come unstuck eventually. I believe he should, but events of the last few years have made me doubt that, and every time I'm told we're at the end of the line, and the line moves, my doubts increase. I can't understand why you can't see that.
If there are circumstances, outside of death or payment that will result in further delays at the next deadline, then please say what they are. If you don't think there any, then say so, but don't get snippy when something happens and your previously emphatic predictions are proven to be incorrect.
minimoog said:
98elise said:
All it does is stop the properties being confiscated while he appeals. If they started confiscating his properties he could still appeal,
Ok, granted.98elise said:
Either way when the appeals process is exhausted they now have a pot of money rather than no money.. if the appeal doesn't reduce the fine (which is all he is appealing) then they can go after the properties for the rest.
They'll have a pot of someone else's money, not Trump's. Yes in theory he'll owe it to some business or other but we all know how he handles those debts. Ultmately I'd rather they had Trump himself on the hook for the full 450M. This feels like a massive let-off, and plenty of commentariat lawyers agree. One described it as a 'travesty of justice'.
Chubb put up the bond for the EJC case. They won't have done that without a means to recover the money after the appeals process is over. If they haven't whoever did it will likely be in serious trouble themselves.
Again trump isn't appealing the verdict, only the amount of damages/fine. That means the bond holder is on the hook for a large amount of cash however the appeal pans out.
minimoog said:
They'll have a pot of someone else's money, not Trump's.
Yes in theory he'll owe it to some business or other but we all know how he handles those debts. Ultmately I'd rather they had Trump himself on the hook for the full 450M. This feels like a massive let-off, and plenty of commentariat lawyers agree. One described it as a 'travesty of justice'.
Point of order- Yes in theory he'll owe it to some business or other but we all know how he handles those debts. Ultmately I'd rather they had Trump himself on the hook for the full 450M. This feels like a massive let-off, and plenty of commentariat lawyers agree. One described it as a 'travesty of justice'.
Trump has already put his cash up as appeal bond for EJC I. "Only" $5m, but still.
Chubb has got $87m (or whatever it is) of Trump's brokerage account for the EJC II appeal bond.
So he can't thumb his nose and say "tough tittay, you pay it now sucker!". He's not got that anymore.
And if/when he finds enough liquid-able assets to cover a $175m bond, he'll have lost that too.
The $480m judgement is in place. Best case for trump is that he gets a reduction of some sort. Don't forget, James was looking for "only" $250m.
Yes, the law moves very, very slowly. Yes, it's very, very frustrating.
But at risk of schadenfreude, consider this- the dead can't raise an appeal. The trump "legacy" is effectively finished. Even if Trump Snr delays everything until he dies (just this judgement alone), the state of NY will still exist, and it's suits still stand. The kids don't even have an inheritance any more. By the time it all gets sorted, interest and taxes will take the rest.
Trumps narcissism is preventing him from doing a deal and putting it all to bed, and living out the rest of his life in (chintzy gold plated) luxury.
He's decided to be Shylock, when he could be Hefner.
I do think he's got a much, much rougher road ahead with the many criminal cases.
M.
DanL said:
tangerine_sedge said:
Byker28i said:
And it's hitting elsewhere - a 32 point swing to the Dems in Alabama house election, in a solid Red state is massive
It's about now, that you'd have thought the GOP grownups would start pushing Hikki Haley as a viable option to get her back in the race as a sensible choice, but I don't think there are any grownups left.It feels to me like the election result is going to be massively different to the false jeopardy "trump could win it" headlines from the news media.
A better question would be whether the Trump voters would vote for the GOP anyway. I would assume yes, in which case they’d surely be better off appealing to the more moderate base?
Power at any cost, anything to stop Hillary winning after spending 8 years refusing to pass anything the dems put forward.
Despite losing every election since 2016, despite all of his backed candidates losing, despite grab em by the pussy, Stormy Daniels, Michael Cohen, Ukraine, two impeachments, fraud, infinite lies, Trump Org being banned in NY, massive debt, fines, etc he's gotten away with every single thing.
Even if legally the normal process is to fine someone, seize assets, ban them from running for office and so on, these things are not happening to Trump and sticking.
You cannot possibly say he isn't getting away with it in the present moment, just like he has done his entire life. Yes, he has fines to pay but he won't pay them. Yes he has assets to seize yet the impossibly weak opposition won't seize them. Yes he's got loans due and so on and so forth but he'll find someone to pay them and back him to the hilt.
He's teflon, he's a slippery eel, he's the world's best and worst con artist all in one. Every time you think he's done, he rebounds perfectly for just him - for anyone else it would be a loss but he's flipped the whole world upside down. You try and take his head off and it just grows back.
The media are complicit because they rely on him for views/reads, the GOP, Dems and independents are all complicit because when their feet is put to the fire, they let him off.
He's going to live until he's 100 despite his weight, diet, lack of exercise, probable substance abuse and so on and he'll never see any repercussions. The normal rules do not apply, he has broken America and exposed the system for what it is - one for poor people where they get all the damage and one for rich people where they're immune from everything and then one for Presidents where they can probably get the rich people to take the hit for them and die if needed.
He's untouchable.
And just to add to the pile, I can see a record low turnout from the other side because they're either complacent thinking Trump will get what's coming to him or they just don't fancy Biden. There's no logic behind that feeling and all the evidence points otherwise but all the evidence points to Trump being in jail having lost his business, all his money and all his votes yet here we are, slow walking into another s
tshow of a contested election that'll drag on forever.
You can say 'x is happening soon' or 'y has been ruled so we just need to wait' but until he's penniless and in prison, he's gotten away with it.
And i know you lot are tired of hearing it but you're living in denial that common decency and good will prevail here. It won't.
Even if legally the normal process is to fine someone, seize assets, ban them from running for office and so on, these things are not happening to Trump and sticking.
You cannot possibly say he isn't getting away with it in the present moment, just like he has done his entire life. Yes, he has fines to pay but he won't pay them. Yes he has assets to seize yet the impossibly weak opposition won't seize them. Yes he's got loans due and so on and so forth but he'll find someone to pay them and back him to the hilt.
He's teflon, he's a slippery eel, he's the world's best and worst con artist all in one. Every time you think he's done, he rebounds perfectly for just him - for anyone else it would be a loss but he's flipped the whole world upside down. You try and take his head off and it just grows back.
The media are complicit because they rely on him for views/reads, the GOP, Dems and independents are all complicit because when their feet is put to the fire, they let him off.
He's going to live until he's 100 despite his weight, diet, lack of exercise, probable substance abuse and so on and he'll never see any repercussions. The normal rules do not apply, he has broken America and exposed the system for what it is - one for poor people where they get all the damage and one for rich people where they're immune from everything and then one for Presidents where they can probably get the rich people to take the hit for them and die if needed.
He's untouchable.
And just to add to the pile, I can see a record low turnout from the other side because they're either complacent thinking Trump will get what's coming to him or they just don't fancy Biden. There's no logic behind that feeling and all the evidence points otherwise but all the evidence points to Trump being in jail having lost his business, all his money and all his votes yet here we are, slow walking into another s
tshow of a contested election that'll drag on forever.You can say 'x is happening soon' or 'y has been ruled so we just need to wait' but until he's penniless and in prison, he's gotten away with it.
And i know you lot are tired of hearing it but you're living in denial that common decency and good will prevail here. It won't.
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