New teachers strike wtf
Discussion
SpeedMattersNot said:
TankRizzo said:
SpeedMattersNot said:
..erm, and you didn't do anything about that?
That's entirely wrong, I expect you informed the union itself of the threat?...
She was made aware in no uncertain terms that everything was off the record so it would be her word against the rep's.That's entirely wrong, I expect you informed the union itself of the threat?...
She was leaving for maternity in a few months anyway so didn't pursue it. I was fuming when she told me, as you might expect.
The children's complaints would be their word against your wife's, so I wouldn't hesitate to make this aware to your wife's union.
In times past they served a useful and valuable purpose and helped to get many bad practices eradicated in a large number of workplace environments.
They simply are now a very good example of "power corrupts, absolute power corrupts absolutely" the sooner they are consigned to the history books the better for all. I am sure there are still examples here and there of beneficial interjections and actions unions have performed - and I expect them to be trotted out. However when you have members of said unions quite clearly saying they are essentially coerced into actions they would not otherwise freely choose to undertake to ensure their benefits of membership are retained - their time has passed.
I'm NASUWT, so wasn't on strike today, but sympathise with those who were. In a financial sense, we're all prepared to take hardships; there's no doubt about that. But so far it's been no rises/eating away of pay by inflation, pay more, get less, work longer and with continual hanging threats of more hours. I'm more than happy to do some of those, but all, and all at once, is simply too much.
And then there's the conditions and the contempt with which you're treated - arguably more important. Large numbers of pupils continually disrupt lessons/do no work and generally drag the school down. But because it's all "low level", then nothing can be done. Some whole communities don't value education, yet the teachers working in them still have to achieve the same results with people who simply can't be arsed and act like dicks day in, day out, else they fear for their jobs. The one thing we're measured against, in the end, is progress, and the number of primary schools which flat-out cheat is just incredible. Two of our feeder primaries are blatantly fiddling English results at age 11, which makes my job near impossible. I've got pupils at age 14/15 who were apparently given a level 4b at age 11 at primary school who would struggle to get that grade now whilst I'm preparing them for their GCSEs! Good pay for good teachers in a transparent assessment system which is equitable and free from corruption by vested interests would be just fine - unfortunately, it's a million miles away.
And all of Gove's craptrap about empowering teachers and schools is just that - nonsense.
Earlier this week I was repeatedly called a "f
king ", threatened, had my car approached with keys and punched on the arm by a girl in year 8 (really!). She also told another member of staff she was going to stab her and made various other threats. She is constantly excluded and/or removed from lessons - she's virtually never in them. She simply doesn't know how to behave and won't accept any help to do so. Often, she wanders about the site and there isn't a great deal that can be done about it. She's had an awful upbringing (fairly non-existent, by all accounts, and is currently being shuttled between care homes), but nonetheless that doesn't excuse her incredibly extreme behaviour.
The head is going to try and permanently exclude her - yet even with a record like this, and particularly because she's a LAC, there's a very real chance it will be overturned. Either by appeal or by interfering busybodies at our local LEA who are insistent upon maintaining the fact that they were a "non-excluding authority" last year.
What is said at the top does not match up to what is done on the ground.
And then there's the conditions and the contempt with which you're treated - arguably more important. Large numbers of pupils continually disrupt lessons/do no work and generally drag the school down. But because it's all "low level", then nothing can be done. Some whole communities don't value education, yet the teachers working in them still have to achieve the same results with people who simply can't be arsed and act like dicks day in, day out, else they fear for their jobs. The one thing we're measured against, in the end, is progress, and the number of primary schools which flat-out cheat is just incredible. Two of our feeder primaries are blatantly fiddling English results at age 11, which makes my job near impossible. I've got pupils at age 14/15 who were apparently given a level 4b at age 11 at primary school who would struggle to get that grade now whilst I'm preparing them for their GCSEs! Good pay for good teachers in a transparent assessment system which is equitable and free from corruption by vested interests would be just fine - unfortunately, it's a million miles away.
And all of Gove's craptrap about empowering teachers and schools is just that - nonsense.
Earlier this week I was repeatedly called a "f
king ", threatened, had my car approached with keys and punched on the arm by a girl in year 8 (really!). She also told another member of staff she was going to stab her and made various other threats. She is constantly excluded and/or removed from lessons - she's virtually never in them. She simply doesn't know how to behave and won't accept any help to do so. Often, she wanders about the site and there isn't a great deal that can be done about it. She's had an awful upbringing (fairly non-existent, by all accounts, and is currently being shuttled between care homes), but nonetheless that doesn't excuse her incredibly extreme behaviour. The head is going to try and permanently exclude her - yet even with a record like this, and particularly because she's a LAC, there's a very real chance it will be overturned. Either by appeal or by interfering busybodies at our local LEA who are insistent upon maintaining the fact that they were a "non-excluding authority" last year.
What is said at the top does not match up to what is done on the ground.
SpeedMattersNot said:
our wife's word against theirs...so what? It needs to be reported. Because if any future indecent occurred, where the union didn't leap to your wife's help, it'd be there in writing.
The children's complaints would be their word against your wife's, so I wouldn't hesitate to make this aware to your wife's union.
I suspect you're a little naïve in how the world works. I've worked for enough organisations where "reports" count for nothing, and promises & conversations have a nasty way of disappearing when you're in the sThe children's complaints would be their word against your wife's, so I wouldn't hesitate to make this aware to your wife's union.
t. The unions are spineless and I don't doubt would throw any member to the wolves for their own political goals - see the widespread corruption in Falkirk, for example.spud989 said:
I'm NASUWT, so wasn't on strike today, but sympathise with those who were. In a financial sense, we're all prepared to take hardships; there's no doubt about that. But so far it's been no rises/eating away of pay by inflation, pay more, get less, work longer and with continual hanging threats of more hours. I'm more than happy to do some of those, but all, and all at once, is simply too much.
And then there's the conditions and the contempt with which you're treated - arguably more important. Large numbers of pupils continually disrupt lessons/do no work and generally drag the school down. But because it's all "low level", then nothing can be done. Some whole communities don't value education, yet the teachers working in them still have to achieve the same results with people who simply can't be arsed and act like dicks day in, day out, else they fear for their jobs. The one thing we're measured against, in the end, is progress, and the number of primary schools which flat-out cheat is just incredible. Two of our feeder primaries are blatantly fiddling English results at age 11, which makes my job near impossible. I've got pupils at age 14/15 who were apparently given a level 4b at age 11 at primary school who would struggle to get that grade now whilst I'm preparing them for their GCSEs! Good pay for good teachers in a transparent assessment system which is equitable and free from corruption by vested interests would be just fine - unfortunately, it's a million miles away.
And all of Gove's craptrap about empowering teachers and schools is just that - nonsense.
Earlier this week I was repeatedly called a "fking ", threatened, had my car approached with keys and punched on the arm by a girl in year 8 (really!). She also told another member of staff she was going to stab her and made various other threats. She is constantly excluded and/or removed from lessons - she's virtually never in them. She simply doesn't know how to behave and won't accept any help to do so. Often, she wanders about the site and there isn't a great deal that can be done about it. She's had an awful upbringing (fairly non-existent, by all accounts, and is currently being shuttled between care homes), but nonetheless that doesn't excuse her incredibly extreme behaviour.
The head is going to try and permanently exclude her - yet even with a record like this, and particularly because she's a LAC, there's a very real chance it will be overturned. Either by appeal or by interfering busybodies at our local LEA who are insistent upon maintaining the fact that they were a "non-excluding authority" last year.
What is said at the top does not match up to what is done on the ground.
This is why it's worth sending your kids to a private school, funds permitting.And then there's the conditions and the contempt with which you're treated - arguably more important. Large numbers of pupils continually disrupt lessons/do no work and generally drag the school down. But because it's all "low level", then nothing can be done. Some whole communities don't value education, yet the teachers working in them still have to achieve the same results with people who simply can't be arsed and act like dicks day in, day out, else they fear for their jobs. The one thing we're measured against, in the end, is progress, and the number of primary schools which flat-out cheat is just incredible. Two of our feeder primaries are blatantly fiddling English results at age 11, which makes my job near impossible. I've got pupils at age 14/15 who were apparently given a level 4b at age 11 at primary school who would struggle to get that grade now whilst I'm preparing them for their GCSEs! Good pay for good teachers in a transparent assessment system which is equitable and free from corruption by vested interests would be just fine - unfortunately, it's a million miles away.
And all of Gove's craptrap about empowering teachers and schools is just that - nonsense.
Earlier this week I was repeatedly called a "f
king ", threatened, had my car approached with keys and punched on the arm by a girl in year 8 (really!). She also told another member of staff she was going to stab her and made various other threats. She is constantly excluded and/or removed from lessons - she's virtually never in them. She simply doesn't know how to behave and won't accept any help to do so. Often, she wanders about the site and there isn't a great deal that can be done about it. She's had an awful upbringing (fairly non-existent, by all accounts, and is currently being shuttled between care homes), but nonetheless that doesn't excuse her incredibly extreme behaviour. The head is going to try and permanently exclude her - yet even with a record like this, and particularly because she's a LAC, there's a very real chance it will be overturned. Either by appeal or by interfering busybodies at our local LEA who are insistent upon maintaining the fact that they were a "non-excluding authority" last year.
What is said at the top does not match up to what is done on the ground.
spud989 said:
I'm NASUWT, so wasn't on strike today, but sympathise with those who were. In a financial sense, we're all prepared to take hardships; there's no doubt about that. But so far it's been no rises/eating away of pay by inflation, pay more, get less, work longer and with continual hanging threats of more hours. I'm more than happy to do some of those, but all, and all at once, is simply too much.
And then there's the conditions and the contempt with which you're treated - arguably more important. Large numbers of pupils continually disrupt lessons/do no work and generally drag the school down. But because it's all "low level", then nothing can be done. Some whole communities don't value education, yet the teachers working in them still have to achieve the same results with people who simply can't be arsed and act like dicks day in, day out, else they fear for their jobs. The one thing we're measured against, in the end, is progress, and the number of primary schools which flat-out cheat is just incredible. Two of our feeder primaries are blatantly fiddling English results at age 11, which makes my job near impossible. I've got pupils at age 14/15 who were apparently given a level 4b at age 11 at primary school who would struggle to get that grade now whilst I'm preparing them for their GCSEs! Good pay for good teachers in a transparent assessment system which is equitable and free from corruption by vested interests would be just fine - unfortunately, it's a million miles away.
And all of Gove's craptrap about empowering teachers and schools is just that - nonsense.
Earlier this week I was repeatedly called a "fking ", threatened, had my car approached with keys and punched on the arm by a girl in year 8 (really!). She also told another member of staff she was going to stab her and made various other threats. She is constantly excluded and/or removed from lessons - she's virtually never in them. She simply doesn't know how to behave and won't accept any help to do so. Often, she wanders about the site and there isn't a great deal that can be done about it. She's had an awful upbringing (fairly non-existent, by all accounts, and is currently being shuttled between care homes), but nonetheless that doesn't excuse her incredibly extreme behaviour.
The head is going to try and permanently exclude her - yet even with a record like this, and particularly because she's a LAC, there's a very real chance it will be overturned. Either by appeal or by interfering busybodies at our local LEA who are insistent upon maintaining the fact that they were a "non-excluding authority" last year.
What is said at the top does not match up to what is done on the ground.
It is exactly this kind of anecdote which is sadly all too common from what I can ascertain having heard variations on it from many quarters as to why those that can opt for private education. And then there's the conditions and the contempt with which you're treated - arguably more important. Large numbers of pupils continually disrupt lessons/do no work and generally drag the school down. But because it's all "low level", then nothing can be done. Some whole communities don't value education, yet the teachers working in them still have to achieve the same results with people who simply can't be arsed and act like dicks day in, day out, else they fear for their jobs. The one thing we're measured against, in the end, is progress, and the number of primary schools which flat-out cheat is just incredible. Two of our feeder primaries are blatantly fiddling English results at age 11, which makes my job near impossible. I've got pupils at age 14/15 who were apparently given a level 4b at age 11 at primary school who would struggle to get that grade now whilst I'm preparing them for their GCSEs! Good pay for good teachers in a transparent assessment system which is equitable and free from corruption by vested interests would be just fine - unfortunately, it's a million miles away.
And all of Gove's craptrap about empowering teachers and schools is just that - nonsense.
Earlier this week I was repeatedly called a "f
king ", threatened, had my car approached with keys and punched on the arm by a girl in year 8 (really!). She also told another member of staff she was going to stab her and made various other threats. She is constantly excluded and/or removed from lessons - she's virtually never in them. She simply doesn't know how to behave and won't accept any help to do so. Often, she wanders about the site and there isn't a great deal that can be done about it. She's had an awful upbringing (fairly non-existent, by all accounts, and is currently being shuttled between care homes), but nonetheless that doesn't excuse her incredibly extreme behaviour. The head is going to try and permanently exclude her - yet even with a record like this, and particularly because she's a LAC, there's a very real chance it will be overturned. Either by appeal or by interfering busybodies at our local LEA who are insistent upon maintaining the fact that they were a "non-excluding authority" last year.
What is said at the top does not match up to what is done on the ground.
You couple that with the sheer corrupt lunacy which is teachers further putting their students education at further risk by willfully participating in what can only be described as a protection racket to benefit them and their union 'protectors'.
How can anyone with even borderline funds available not honestly choose to extract their child from that kind of environment!?
heppers75 said:
How can anyone with even borderline funds available not honestly choose to extract their child from that kind of environment!?
At one of the two independent schools I mentioned earlier, the head spoke of a number of families where the father took on a second job in the evenings or the mother cooked and cleaned for a lodger in the spare room simply to afford the fees, obviously there are other ways of getting the money together and many couples consider it more than worth the effort.turbobloke said:
heppers75 said:
How can anyone with even borderline funds available not honestly choose to extract their child from that kind of environment!?
At one of the two independent schools I mentioned earlier, the head spoke of a number of families where the father took on a second job in the evenings or the mother cooked and cleaned for a lodger in the spare room simply to afford the fees, obviously there are other ways of getting the money together and many couples consider it more than worth the effort.TankRizzo said:
SpeedMattersNot said:
our wife's word against theirs...so what? It needs to be reported. Because if any future indecent occurred, where the union didn't leap to your wife's help, it'd be there in writing.
The children's complaints would be their word against your wife's, so I wouldn't hesitate to make this aware to your wife's union.
I suspect you're a little naïve in how the world works. I've worked for enough organisations where "reports" count for nothing, and promises & conversations have a nasty way of disappearing when you're in the sThe children's complaints would be their word against your wife's, so I wouldn't hesitate to make this aware to your wife's union.
t. The unions are spineless and I don't doubt would throw any member to the wolves for their own political goals - see the widespread corruption in Falkirk, for example.You do what is right by yourself and your family, certainly.
But my point is that action needs to be taken against Gove - he takes with one hand, claims he's feeding with the other, yet the latter is just smoke and mirrors designed to fool Joe Public and the press.
Nothing he has done has changed the standards of behaviour on the ground in your average comp/academy. And behaviour is the single biggest barrier to improvement for many challenging schools.
Last year the school I work in had a GCSE English C+ rate of below 50% (I only joined the school in January 2014 from a nearby academy). I'm confident I can raise standards by August 2014, hopefully by a reasonable degree. Yet I could do a hell of a lot more if I had 5 classes of students in every year that were behaving consistently well and were engaging in their learning rather than 1/2.
Yet Gove would have you believe that since he's come to power he's waved a magic wand that means I have 120 eager meerkats, ready to learn on command, because of a couple of dreamland press releases. He's deluding you all.
But my point is that action needs to be taken against Gove - he takes with one hand, claims he's feeding with the other, yet the latter is just smoke and mirrors designed to fool Joe Public and the press.
Nothing he has done has changed the standards of behaviour on the ground in your average comp/academy. And behaviour is the single biggest barrier to improvement for many challenging schools.
Last year the school I work in had a GCSE English C+ rate of below 50% (I only joined the school in January 2014 from a nearby academy). I'm confident I can raise standards by August 2014, hopefully by a reasonable degree. Yet I could do a hell of a lot more if I had 5 classes of students in every year that were behaving consistently well and were engaging in their learning rather than 1/2.
Yet Gove would have you believe that since he's come to power he's waved a magic wand that means I have 120 eager meerkats, ready to learn on command, because of a couple of dreamland press releases. He's deluding you all.
turbobloke said:
heppers75 said:
How can anyone with even borderline funds available not honestly choose to extract their child from that kind of environment!?
At one of the two independent schools I mentioned earlier, the head spoke of a number of families where the father took on a second job in the evenings or the mother cooked and cleaned for a lodger in the spare room simply to afford the fees, obviously there are other ways of getting the money together and many couples consider it more than worth the effort.spud989 said:
You do what is right by yourself and your family, certainly.
But my point is that action needs to be taken against Gove - he takes with one hand, claims he's feeding with the other, yet the latter is just smoke and mirrors designed to fool Joe Public and the press.
Nothing he has done has changed the standards of behaviour on the ground in your average comp/academy. And behaviour is the single biggest barrier to improvement for many challenging schools.
Last year the school I work in had a GCSE English C+ rate of below 50% (I only joined the school in January 2014 from a nearby academy). I'm confident I can raise standards by August 2014, hopefully by a reasonable degree. Yet I could do a hell of a lot more if I had 5 classes of students in every year that were behaving consistently well and were engaging in their learning rather than 1/2.
Yet Gove would have you believe that since he's come to power he's waved a magic wand that means I have 120 eager meerkats, ready to learn on command, because of a couple of dreamland press releases. He's deluding you all.
Surely behaviour and eagerness is not something that the school can be expected to create, it is something they can nurture but it has to be present to start with. But my point is that action needs to be taken against Gove - he takes with one hand, claims he's feeding with the other, yet the latter is just smoke and mirrors designed to fool Joe Public and the press.
Nothing he has done has changed the standards of behaviour on the ground in your average comp/academy. And behaviour is the single biggest barrier to improvement for many challenging schools.
Last year the school I work in had a GCSE English C+ rate of below 50% (I only joined the school in January 2014 from a nearby academy). I'm confident I can raise standards by August 2014, hopefully by a reasonable degree. Yet I could do a hell of a lot more if I had 5 classes of students in every year that were behaving consistently well and were engaging in their learning rather than 1/2.
Yet Gove would have you believe that since he's come to power he's waved a magic wand that means I have 120 eager meerkats, ready to learn on command, because of a couple of dreamland press releases. He's deluding you all.
It has been said before but certainly one of the reasons that those children in private education are better behaved and more eager is the homes they come from will for the most part be instilling that at home first.
Teachers cannot be expected to fix what is in many places a broken society, they can only realistically support not create that especially when I expect for the most part those badly behaved few are learning their bad habits closer to home! Neither teachers or an education secretary can fix that.
RYH64E said:
turbobloke said:
heppers75 said:
How can anyone with even borderline funds available not honestly choose to extract their child from that kind of environment!?
At one of the two independent schools I mentioned earlier, the head spoke of a number of families where the father took on a second job in the evenings or the mother cooked and cleaned for a lodger in the spare room simply to afford the fees, obviously there are other ways of getting the money together and many couples consider it more than worth the effort.SpeedMattersNot said:
RYH64E said:
This is why it's worth sending your kids to a private school, funds permitting.
I asked, does your wife teach in a private school?My mum was a teacher prior to retirement, brother, sister and sister-in-law all teach in the public sector.
RYH64E said:
turbobloke said:
heppers75 said:
How can anyone with even borderline funds available not honestly choose to extract their child from that kind of environment!?
At one of the two independent schools I mentioned earlier, the head spoke of a number of families where the father took on a second job in the evenings or the mother cooked and cleaned for a lodger in the spare room simply to afford the fees, obviously there are other ways of getting the money together and many couples consider it more than worth the effort.Send a good kid to a public school, they won't struggle. Send a crap (poorly parented) kid to either school, they'll struggle.
Mr Snap said:
...I have a problem with well off parents who attempt to procure an unfair and unwarranted advantage for their averagely intelligent children...
by paying for a better education? Jesus Christ are you for real? Is it ok to move and get your kids into a better state school or is it just the 'well off' you really have a problem with?Mr Snap said:
Considering that it's the future of the country we're talking about, doesn't it make more sense to give the best - state funded - places in universities to the most intelligent students, rather than to those with the most expensive education?
Yes. Couldn't agree more. IMO it's obvious that the BBB kid from Eton is almost certainly not as bright or motivated as the BBB kid from Mandela High, Tower Hamlets. Perhaps on the UCAS form you should put your grades against your schools average grade? I guess it depends if your real problem is with good vs. bad schools or rich vs. poor parents.Mr Snap said:
It's common knowledge that ex state school students tend to get better degrees at Oxbridge
Might well be true, don't know but it wasn't 'common knowledge' when I went there and you'd have thought that would be the kind of thing people noticed. Infact it would be very easy to confirm if true, all results are public, I'm sure the Student Union types would be all over it. The article you link cites two studies which have nothing to do with Oxbridge. You know Oxford Brookes isn't the Oxford in Oxbridge right?Edited by anonymous-user on Thursday 27th March 01:34
SpeedMattersNot said:
Agreed, our next door neighbour sent his 'precious one' to a private school in Woburn for £9k per year for a 5year old lol. He got angry when the school told him his son couldn't spell his own name...he felt that was the schools job LOL! Of course...what else was he paying them for?
Send a good kid to a public school, they won't struggle. Send a crap (poorly parented) kid to either school, they'll struggle.
I do have to say your whole contempt of those who opt for private education is rather transparent in the above with your quoted derogatory phrase and lol's. Also teaching a child to spell is pretty much one of those things that is the schools job IMO. If he was complaining to the school his son was badly behaved and won't eat with a knife and fork or some other such social skill as opposed to clearly an educational one I could see your point, but as this is an expected educational result I am not sure what point you are making. Send a good kid to a public school, they won't struggle. Send a crap (poorly parented) kid to either school, they'll struggle.
Also I am not sure how from the above anyone can infer the child was badly parented.
In fact that whole post is very much indicative of what the real issue is that certain folks with certain political and social perspectives have with private education and it really is utterly sod all to do with education at all!
heppers75 said:
SpeedMattersNot said:
Agreed, our next door neighbour sent his 'precious one' to a private school in Woburn for £9k per year for a 5year old lol. He got angry when the school told him his son couldn't spell his own name...he felt that was the schools job LOL! Of course...what else was he paying them for?
Send a good kid to a public school, they won't struggle. Send a crap (poorly parented) kid to either school, they'll struggle.
I do have to say your whole contempt of those who opt for private education is rather transparent in the above with your quoted derogatory phrase and lol's. Also teaching a child to spell is pretty much one of those things that is the schools job IMO. If he was complaining to the school his son was badly behaved and won't eat with a knife and fork or some other such social skill as opposed to clearly an educational one I could see your point, but as this is an expected educational result I am not sure what point you are making. Send a good kid to a public school, they won't struggle. Send a crap (poorly parented) kid to either school, they'll struggle.
Also I am not sure how from the above anyone can infer the child was badly parented.
In fact that whole post is very much indicative of what the real issue is that certain folks with certain political and social perspectives have with private education and it really is utterly sod all to do with education at all!
Sadly, it's something many kids can do before they're 5 years old (because their parents taught them to) I'm sorry you believe this is entirely the job of the schools.
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