The Case for EU Membership
Discussion
Happy82 said:
It offers the opportunity for the social underclass to relocate to places like Benidorm, thus reducing the numbers in the UK 
That is one of the benefits of EU membership of which I was not aware. There are precious few others. Sadly in between the idea and the reality of EU membership have fallen many insolvent sovereign states. I doubt that there is a case any longer.http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/10052646/...
Quitting-the-EU-wont-solve-our-problems-says-Boris-Johnson
Quitting-the-EU-wont-solve-our-problems-says-Boris-Johnson
I'm not sure what the point of this thread is - it will not alter your opinion AJS as you have already made up your mind.
Want a benefit? It gives Farage a decent income and expense account so he can spend his time campaigning for his party rather than actually turning up to do his elected job.
Want a benefit? It gives Farage a decent income and expense account so he can spend his time campaigning for his party rather than actually turning up to do his elected job.
Good reasons for EU membership:
Free trade. Bear in mind this is proper, no more complicated than if you were selling to someone five miles down the road free trade. That has made a huge difference to how business is conducted in Europe and is probably the best benefit.
Free movement. Again, moving to any EU nation, be it for work or pleasure, is as easy as moving down the road. Imagine if it was like trying to move to the USA. Obviously this has problems going the other way for us.
EU directives. We moan, but a lot of them have been quite useful. That's the joy of a dictatorship - things actually get done. As an example: You like your holiday beaches to be not covered in raw sewerage, don't you? That was Europe. If we'd been left to our own devices we'd probably still be paddling in poo.
And of course, let's not forget the biggie. No major European war for 68 years, which looks to be a record.
Free trade. Bear in mind this is proper, no more complicated than if you were selling to someone five miles down the road free trade. That has made a huge difference to how business is conducted in Europe and is probably the best benefit.
Free movement. Again, moving to any EU nation, be it for work or pleasure, is as easy as moving down the road. Imagine if it was like trying to move to the USA. Obviously this has problems going the other way for us.
EU directives. We moan, but a lot of them have been quite useful. That's the joy of a dictatorship - things actually get done. As an example: You like your holiday beaches to be not covered in raw sewerage, don't you? That was Europe. If we'd been left to our own devices we'd probably still be paddling in poo.
And of course, let's not forget the biggie. No major European war for 68 years, which looks to be a record.
vonuber said:
I'm not sure what the point of this thread is - it will not alter your opinion AJS as you have already made up your mind.
This is sort of the case for me as well. While I'm happy to contribute to threads case-by-case outlining what EU policy or ECHR have actually said (instead of what media is misreporting) I have no interest in engaging directly in a general discussion because our view run very counter to the mood on PH at the moment.
There are some interesting, informed and balanced posts being made time-to-time but these are flooded by posts containing the usual frenzied platitudes about political overlords, European political elite etc. It'll probably be a few years before we can have a more meaningful, informed discussion about the affairs of the EU and Euro.
The point of the thread is as simple as it sounds. I am interested in what are, and what are perceived as, positive benefits of our membership. The "pro" EU side seems to largely be dominated by scare stories and the idea that we can't prosper outside.
Free trade is good, and so is free movement, though a double edged sword as was pointed out.
I see no reason why we couldn't have open trade and minimal visa/work permit requirements outside the EU, as that would clearly be in both sides best interests.
Free trade is good, and so is free movement, though a double edged sword as was pointed out.
I see no reason why we couldn't have open trade and minimal visa/work permit requirements outside the EU, as that would clearly be in both sides best interests.
Mojooo said:
Standardisation - this links in with free trade. Take food labelling for example. If you comply with EU labelling laws then you can export to any EU country.
That is different to complying with UK labelling laws, selling to France and then trying to comply with French labelling laws.
Surely anyone targeting exports to the EU would still follow EU standards? As people exporting to the US or anywhere else do. Even if our own regulations weren't as tough, or were entirely non-existent, I can't see any reason for them to be in conflict with each other. That is different to complying with UK labelling laws, selling to France and then trying to comply with French labelling laws.
It's anyway a less than convincing reason for abandoning democracy.
AJS- said:
Surely anyone targeting exports to the EU would still follow EU standards? As people exporting to the US or anywhere else do. Even if our own regulations weren't as tough, or were entirely non-existent, I can't see any reason for them to be in conflict with each other.
It's anyway a less than convincing reason for abandoning democracy.
The point is as we have EU labelling laws anyone complying with the rules in the UK will automatically meet the rules for laws elsewhere in the EU as UK laws are effectively EU compliant.. It's anyway a less than convincing reason for abandoning democracy.
If we didn't have the EU then you would have to manufacture labels for every different country and would incur costs in understand 20-30 laws and extra production costs. At the moment the main thing you would have to do is get a translation if English is not acceptable.
If you took this away then it would certainly make things harder for businesses - but not impossible.
Think of how many industries benefit from standardisation - a lot I bet when you take into account things like electrical items.
To cut it the other way - when you import stuff (say food) you need to ensure it complies with UK rules. If it comes from the EU and its an issue covered by the EU (such as food) then it means a lot less work for the importer.
If we left the EU tomorrow then of course our laws would still match up to the EU but in say 5 years when they have moved on ,a lot of UK businesses might find EU companies are less willing to take their products.
Whether it is worth 'abandoning democracy' for, I dunno. One thing I do know is that money talks, and when it comes to business the Govt will do anything it can to promote business and I think the EU makes doing business easier than not being in the EU.
The only pro EU position I have any respect for is the straight forward and honest idea that we would all benefit from forming a unified, federal state called Europe. It's not an idea I agree with, but it is the aim of the European Union, and I wish it's supporters would have the courage to make the case for it rather than pretending it's just a trade thing.
Gassing Station | News, Politics & Economics | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff