Meanwhile, in Japan...
Discussion
http://metro.co.uk/2016/11/15/sinkhole-what-sinkho...
Look at it - just the planning of repair of the services - gas, power, telecoms, sewer, water seems an enormity by our standards
While tfl close an important road making traffic mayhem, seemingly as policy, for 6 months to tart up a railway bridge.
Look at it - just the planning of repair of the services - gas, power, telecoms, sewer, water seems an enormity by our standards
While tfl close an important road making traffic mayhem, seemingly as policy, for 6 months to tart up a railway bridge.
It's an embarrassment how bad we are at this stuff.
In Bristol we have a road that has been made one-way for six months while they build a retaining wall and a bit of tarmac for Metrobus. After the six months are up, the flow will become traffic light controlled, one direction at a time, for a further six months. They started the work about a year before the road closure.
There are a dozen other sites around Bristol that I pass daily, all for Metrobus and all proceeding at the same snails pace whilst catastrophically affecting traffic.
Of course, once Metrobus launches, they can compare congestion figures with the previous couple of years and it's going to look superbly effective.
Fairplay to Japan, a brilliant approach.
NB. I don't think for one second that this British malaise is confined to our construction industry. We are snails and lacking drive competitiveness in many things.
In Bristol we have a road that has been made one-way for six months while they build a retaining wall and a bit of tarmac for Metrobus. After the six months are up, the flow will become traffic light controlled, one direction at a time, for a further six months. They started the work about a year before the road closure.
There are a dozen other sites around Bristol that I pass daily, all for Metrobus and all proceeding at the same snails pace whilst catastrophically affecting traffic.
Of course, once Metrobus launches, they can compare congestion figures with the previous couple of years and it's going to look superbly effective.
Fairplay to Japan, a brilliant approach.
NB. I don't think for one second that this British malaise is confined to our construction industry. We are snails and lacking drive competitiveness in many things.
Roadworks in the UK are a complete joke. I'm sure there would be some law of unintended consequences but there must be a way to financially incentivize (or punish) the amount of time roadworks take. Even for small jobs there is usually one bloke that turns up, works half the day, then disappears for the rest of the week ..
130R said:
Roadworks in the UK are a complete joke. I'm sure there would be some law of unintended consequences but there must be a way to financially incentivize (or punish) the amount of time roadworks take. Even for small jobs there is usually one bloke that turns up, works half the day, then disappears for the rest of the week ..
One thing which is not currently done is to charge companies (usually utilities) for 'rental' of closed or disrupted roads. Which is why works are often to peripatetic and, seemingly on occasion, planned for maximum disruption.boxxob said:
here be rant...
news in: councils are filled the 'ethos' that comes from being basically unanswerable for the state of things: hopeless, filled with non-jobs and ideological schemes, catastrophically low-productivity, nepotism, incompetence, over-worked, dedicated lynchpin staff alongside malingering wasters, and possible outright corruption and self-interest (e.g. friends, relations and their own workers getting preferential housing and access to affordable homes). They love big, ego- and cv-improving projects after running everything in to the ground for years and years through poor or no maintenance, and an absence of service-levels. The result is that, in my opinion, local authorities are a major factor in the dirty, dilapidated, litter-rivers of chavdom Britain around us. No finer example of their stupidity is the £160m Birmingham library (the cost of which doesn't include taking down the old one)-- and still no money for books--pushed through at the same time as their child services department is labelled a "national disgrace" by inspectors.
We need independent bodies for infrastructure concerns such as road conditions and all town/building planning and to stop the gravy-train.
Councils are "basically unanswerable", because the system in which they're voted for doesn't really hold them accountable. Turnout for council only elections is poor. Nobody gets excited about it, and most people probably don't have a clue who's in control of their council. Leadership of councils are answerable only to their fellow party members in terms of a leadership agenda. news in: councils are filled the 'ethos' that comes from being basically unanswerable for the state of things: hopeless, filled with non-jobs and ideological schemes, catastrophically low-productivity, nepotism, incompetence, over-worked, dedicated lynchpin staff alongside malingering wasters, and possible outright corruption and self-interest (e.g. friends, relations and their own workers getting preferential housing and access to affordable homes). They love big, ego- and cv-improving projects after running everything in to the ground for years and years through poor or no maintenance, and an absence of service-levels. The result is that, in my opinion, local authorities are a major factor in the dirty, dilapidated, litter-rivers of chavdom Britain around us. No finer example of their stupidity is the £160m Birmingham library (the cost of which doesn't include taking down the old one)-- and still no money for books--pushed through at the same time as their child services department is labelled a "national disgrace" by inspectors.
We need independent bodies for infrastructure concerns such as road conditions and all town/building planning and to stop the gravy-train.
There's in-roads being made; the effort to get regional mayors is one way to sort it out. The Mayor of London gets elected by the public on their own manifesto; with an elected assembly to represent local concerns, keep the mayor in check and hold them to account.
Even still, people need to just get more involved with democracy.
Deptford Draylons said:
From the pics online, it doesn't look like that repaired most of the services, as its being filled with them still broken. Filling the hole with foam concrete isn't exactly hard and then sticking a skim of tarmac on top.
So you say. The UK would find it impossible to even organise the logistics to get the amount concrete there to repair the hole in 48 hours, let alone actually repairing it.I'm pretty sure they got the services up and running too. Also suspect that it's a lot more difficult than 'filling the hole and skimming it with tarmac'.
Tonsko said:
Deptford Draylons said:
From the pics online, it doesn't look like that repaired most of the services, as its being filled with them still broken. Filling the hole with foam concrete isn't exactly hard and then sticking a skim of tarmac on top.
So you say. The UK would find it impossible to even organise the logistics to get the amount concrete there to repair the hole in 48 hours, let alone actually repairing it.I'm pretty sure they got the services up and running too. Also suspect that it's a lot more difficult than 'filling the hole and skimming it with tarmac'.
If they have just filled the hole, it really isn't that hard with foam concrete, and had it been in the UK and it was a similar requirement, it wouldn't be that hard to have several companies supply concrete to be foamed on site working 24/7.
If they have done full repairs to the services in the hole and everything fixed as before, then that would be some achievement. I suspect though it was mostly hole filling and alternatives arranged and still needed to the services.
Deptford Draylons said:
Some of the pics I saw show at least some of the services still broken while being filled. I suspect they were more interested in just filling the hole before it collapsed any of the building around it and to make it stable, worrying about the services later.
If they have just filled the hole, it really isn't that hard with foam concrete, and had it been in the UK and it was a similar requirement, it wouldn't be that hard to have several companies supply concrete to be foamed on site working 24/7.
If they have done full repairs to the services in the hole and everything fixed as before, then that would be some achievement. I suspect though it was mostly hole filling and alternatives arranged and still needed to the services.
You have more confidence in us that I. I refuse to believe that it would have been sorted within 48 hours in this country.If they have just filled the hole, it really isn't that hard with foam concrete, and had it been in the UK and it was a similar requirement, it wouldn't be that hard to have several companies supply concrete to be foamed on site working 24/7.
If they have done full repairs to the services in the hole and everything fixed as before, then that would be some achievement. I suspect though it was mostly hole filling and alternatives arranged and still needed to the services.
Tonsko said:
Deptford Draylons said:
Some of the pics I saw show at least some of the services still broken while being filled. I suspect they were more interested in just filling the hole before it collapsed any of the building around it and to make it stable, worrying about the services later.
If they have just filled the hole, it really isn't that hard with foam concrete, and had it been in the UK and it was a similar requirement, it wouldn't be that hard to have several companies supply concrete to be foamed on site working 24/7.
If they have done full repairs to the services in the hole and everything fixed as before, then that would be some achievement. I suspect though it was mostly hole filling and alternatives arranged and still needed to the services.
You have more confidence in us that I. I refuse to believe that it would have been sorted within 48 hours in this country.If they have just filled the hole, it really isn't that hard with foam concrete, and had it been in the UK and it was a similar requirement, it wouldn't be that hard to have several companies supply concrete to be foamed on site working 24/7.
If they have done full repairs to the services in the hole and everything fixed as before, then that would be some achievement. I suspect though it was mostly hole filling and alternatives arranged and still needed to the services.
There's a lot more to it than the report is saying surely.
I can't see how they could reconnect all the services, backfill and lay a decent surface course, plus the requirements for the lights and everything, traffic loops etc in that timeframe.
I agree with above poster, stabilised the surroundings and worry about everything else later. Surely...?
I can't see how they could reconnect all the services, backfill and lay a decent surface course, plus the requirements for the lights and everything, traffic loops etc in that timeframe.
I agree with above poster, stabilised the surroundings and worry about everything else later. Surely...?
It took the UK 9/10 months to repair waterproofing at the M5/M6 interchange in Walsall. I travelled that bit every day and rarely saw more than ONE(!) person with the jetair hose opening up the course. In the height of summer there was still only the one guy, he started 8am, finished 4pm. No-one worked weekends. Junction 9 southbound was closed for all this time adding to the misery if you lived around there. Traffic was backed up to the M54 EVERY day and it made the trip from my girlfiends house go from half-hour to 2 hours. The Jct was due to re-open around Oct '15 and we were warned it may be later if 'adverse' weather affected it!
The good weather wasn't taken advantage of.
Now, we've been told that the M5 around Jct 1-2 will be affected for the same work. An estimated 5 years has recently been rubbished by the authorities but won't give a timescale on the work.
I think it'd be quicker to knock it down and start again.
The good weather wasn't taken advantage of.
Now, we've been told that the M5 around Jct 1-2 will be affected for the same work. An estimated 5 years has recently been rubbished by the authorities but won't give a timescale on the work.
I think it'd be quicker to knock it down and start again.
Tonsko said:
Deptford Draylons said:
Hole was filled in 48 hours, took a week to reopen the street.
Regardless, the point stands. Here, there would barely have been an H&S inspection after a week, let along 1200cube of concrete bought, organised and delivered.Trust me from someone who has worked in the industry, when someone from the likes of Highways Agency calls and tells you they need something asap, companies love it as they make a ton of money from it charging them way over their normal rate in emergency cases. Organising a concrete pump and foam agent to be on site 24/7 while various companies supply the mix is not exactly hard work.
Had this been a sink hole in a road with nothing around it and out of the way, then yes, it would take ages.
'Needed to'. Yes, I guess what you say is true. But why isn't everything treated with the same sense of urgency? I suppose what I'm getting at is that all the places that I've worked over the years, some in construction, everyone just seems on go slow. I even got in trouble on building sites for working hard as 'I was showing the other guys up' when I was young and keen, just wanted to get the job done, rather than ensuring maximum tea-breakage. (This particular event was on Heathrow T5).
You must admit, mostly construction projects are a f
king joke. Go slow, charge more.
You must admit, mostly construction projects are a f
king joke. Go slow, charge more.Gassing Station | News, Politics & Economics | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff