Women and senior management

[V8mate]

Seeing in the media that Vince Cable's (failing) drive to get more women onto the boards of FTSE companies may result in the introduction of quotas: :Source:, I was just left with a deflated feeling of 'why?'.

I'm going to stick my head above the parapet here, but hopefully we can have a discussion befitting N, P & E rather than the Lounge.

In over 25 years in the workplace, I have worked in both the private and public sector; I have worked in environments from small family businesses through to FTSE100 companies and huge corporations.

And across all those experiences, I have never come across a woman competent in a role above that of 'doing stuff'. There. I've said it.

I've met very competent ladies in manufacturing, administration and support roles, but not one in any kind of management or executive function. My own experience has not delivered one who could properly manage a team, think strategically or control any complex task or organisation.

Repeating myself, for the avoidance of doubt, this is not bar-room punditry, THIS IS BASED UPON MY EXPERIENCE in the workplace.

All this means one of two things:
1. I've been incredibly unlucky, as there are some great women managers and leaders out there; or
2. Cable (and others') attempts to push women upwards in organisations is contrary to the skillset being available (hence why it's failing).


Or, am I just too blinkered against women managers that I wouldn't recognise a good one if she was standing in front of me? I don't think I am; there's nothing in my family history or upbringing to suggest such a learned value. But... I just don't know.

All I do know, is that my opening gambit^ seems 50+ years out of date, and I'm keen to understand whether such a view has been rightly consigned to history or whether it's a big equal opportunities cover-up?

[V8mate]

IainT said:

CommanderJameson said:

Rovinghawk said:

If they're good enough then they'll get there on merit.

Not necessarily. That's the problem with prejudice.

Indeed.

While statistically possible it's very unlikely that the OP hasn't met any women capable of leading and doing a damn good job at it so there must be another reason the capability wasn't recognised either by the OP or by the organisations. Prejudice may be that reason.

Quite. And the thought of that does concern me because, if prejudice has blinkered my outlook, I don't know why that value would have come about.

[V8mate]

Fittster said:

V8mate said:

In over 25 years in the workplace, I have worked in both the private and public sector; I have worked in environments from small family businesses through to FTSE100 companies and huge corporations.

And across all those experiences, I have never come across a woman competent in a role above that of 'doing stuff'. There. I've said it.

Have you met men doing senior stuff who were incompetent?

Absolutely. Loads of them.

But my experience is not just about senior management/board level people; I've not come across a credible female at any level who has more responsibility than what's in front of her.

[V8mate]

Blue Cat said:

V8mate said:

Fittster said:

V8mate said:

In over 25 years in the workplace, I have worked in both the private and public sector; I have worked in environments from small family businesses through to FTSE100 companies and huge corporations.

And across all those experiences, I have never come across a woman competent in a role above that of 'doing stuff'. There. I've said it.

Have you met men doing senior stuff who were incompetent?

Absolutely. Loads of them.

But my experience is not just about senior management/board level people; I've not come across a credible female at any level who has more responsibility than what's in front of her.

What not even Margaret Thatcher as a topical example?

I am really biting my fingers here not to write something insulting to this post, which I found very offensive - you really think that women are incapable of doing a senior management role?

Well I don't agree and think you are completely wrong and sorry you have a misguided view of women

What a shame you couldn't read and understand my OP.

[V8mate]

Blue Cat said:

V8mate said:

Blue Cat said:

V8mate said:

Fittster said:

V8mate said:

In over 25 years in the workplace, I have worked in both the private and public sector; I have worked in environments from small family businesses through to FTSE100 companies and huge corporations.

And across all those experiences, I have never come across a woman competent in a role above that of 'doing stuff'. There. I've said it.

Have you met men doing senior stuff who were incompetent?

Absolutely. Loads of them.

But my experience is not just about senior management/board level people; I've not come across a credible female at any level who has more responsibility than what's in front of her.

What not even Margaret Thatcher as a topical example?

I am really biting my fingers here not to write something insulting to this post, which I found very offensive - you really think that women are incapable of doing a senior management role?

Well I don't agree and think you are completely wrong and sorry you have a misguided view of women

What a shame you couldn't read and understand my OP.

What did I not understand - "I have never come across a woman competent in a role above that of 'doing stuff'. There. I've said it." is quite clear to me.

So you DO think that women are incapable of doing a senior management role.

You're telling me what I THINK to be the case. I am not and repeated three times in my OP that I wasn't.

I don't THINK that all women managers are incapable; I know them to be incapable within the bounds of my experience. That is all and hence my question.

[V8mate]