Best Wifi enabled thermostat
Discussion
TheLurker said:
gmaz said:
I'm considering the Hive thermostat, but all of them instruct you not to install the thermostat unit in a room that has a TRV radiator. Our existing thermostat is in the hallway about 3m from a radiator. Would I have to shut it off, restrict it via the lockshield etc?
What do you do if you have no choice but to use a room with a TRV-controlled rad?
Just open the TRV fully so it's always on. What you're trying to avoid is the TRV turning off before the thermostat reaches the set temperature and so keeps the heating on as it thinks the house isn't getting any warmer.What do you do if you have no choice but to use a room with a TRV-controlled rad?
markiii said:
shady lee said:
My tado seems to just "carry on" when the WiFi went down for 3 hours, just couldn't control any of the schedules.
But I'm sure it stuck to the pre saved schedules?
so should Tado ever go out of business and their servers go, its all junk reallyBut I'm sure it stuck to the pre saved schedules?
All the local access should still work.
markiii said:
so should Tado ever go out of business and their servers go, its all junk really
Yes and no.there's a main thermostat that can be physically used to adjust temps that seems local to the boiler relay and WiFi bridge.
The trv"s I'm not sure about.
But the many other features and scheduling, yeah, it's junk if the servers fall.
But that could be said for nest, hive, evohome. If the servers went on those companies the "out of house" functionality would be gone (to more or less degrees admittedly).
LocoBlade said:
The Hive receiver which is hard wired to the boiler has override buttons for heating and hot water?
If I understood you request correctly though, I don't think you'll find any heating system that will default to switching on when it loses connectivity to its wireless stat etc.
The Nest thermostat will continue its stored schedule when it loses its connection to the internet, but it's hardwired to the heating system (or mine at least was).If I understood you request correctly though, I don't think you'll find any heating system that will default to switching on when it loses connectivity to its wireless stat etc.
I've just replaced my gen 2 Nest learning thermostat which was 9 years old, with a cheaper Nest thermostat.
The NLT kept losing connectivity which didn't affect the programming but was very annoying when you wanted to turn it off or down from your phone (mainly so I could exercise without getting cooked).
shady lee said:
markiii said:
so should Tado ever go out of business and their servers go, its all junk really
Yes and no.there's a main thermostat that can be physically used to adjust temps that seems local to the boiler relay and WiFi bridge.
The trv"s I'm not sure about.
But the many other features and scheduling, yeah, it's junk if the servers fall.
But that could be said for nest, hive, evohome. If the servers went on those companies the "out of house" functionality would be gone (to more or less degrees admittedly).
markiii said:
shady lee said:
markiii said:
so should Tado ever go out of business and their servers go, its all junk really
Yes and no.there's a main thermostat that can be physically used to adjust temps that seems local to the boiler relay and WiFi bridge.
The trv"s I'm not sure about.
But the many other features and scheduling, yeah, it's junk if the servers fall.
But that could be said for nest, hive, evohome. If the servers went on those companies the "out of house" functionality would be gone (to more or less degrees admittedly).
Evohome is rock solid, but aged. And if you like app based features and a nicer looking system tado fits that bill for most.
Both have their markets and ups/downs.
nebpor said:
Rock solid wins every competition when it's about heating your home IMO
Yep, maybe. given that Honeywell may end support for evohome alot sooner I'd want a system that doesn't rely on servers also.having had wiser,evohome and tado I can confidently say that I'm liking tado the most so far.
But all have their own strengths (except for wiser, that was tosh for me)
I would be suprised if Honeywell pulled evohome support TBH. Smart home market is still in it's infancy and I doubt it costs much for them to run.
The best thing about it is that all you lose is the remote access. The in-home terminal is at least fully featured.
I have no experience of the others, other than what I've read, so it's not a direct comparison. Just that Honeywell are an industrial control company and it kind of shows with evohome - it's sturdy, reliable, but unexciting. I appreciate some want something more exciting!
The best thing about it is that all you lose is the remote access. The in-home terminal is at least fully featured.
I have no experience of the others, other than what I've read, so it's not a direct comparison. Just that Honeywell are an industrial control company and it kind of shows with evohome - it's sturdy, reliable, but unexciting. I appreciate some want something more exciting!
nebpor said:
I would be suprised if Honeywell pulled evohome support TBH. Smart home market is still in it's infancy and I doubt it costs much for them to run.
The best thing about it is that all you lose is the remote access. The in-home terminal is at least fully featured.
I have no experience of the others, other than what I've read, so it's not a direct comparison. Just that Honeywell are an industrial control company and it kind of shows with evohome - it's sturdy, reliable, but unexciting. I appreciate some want something more exciting!
Indeed and no suscription nonsense eitherThe best thing about it is that all you lose is the remote access. The in-home terminal is at least fully featured.
I have no experience of the others, other than what I've read, so it's not a direct comparison. Just that Honeywell are an industrial control company and it kind of shows with evohome - it's sturdy, reliable, but unexciting. I appreciate some want something more exciting!
A question for Tado owners about how the boiler behaves as I still dont think my setup is behaving as it should.
The reason I am asking is that I have it set to 16c overnight and 17.5c daytime. The heating comes on at 0630 and it then takes 6 hours on average to get to 17.5c.
To me (based on nothing whatsoever), this seems to be a very long time to go up by a relatively small amount. The system was power flushed and balanced a few months ago with all radiators getting hot.
After the system was cleaned I installed the Tado wired stat so that was the only change.
Here is that I think should happen (or at least what I think was happening with a 'normal' thermostat). Non weather comp boiler. Flow rate of 70c.
Room stat calls for heat.
Boiler comes on and heats water up to flow temperature.
Boiler then reduces flame up/down as required to maintain flow temperature until desired room temperature is reached.
I assume the above is expected behaviour?
Here is what Tado is doing.
Room stat calls for heat.
Boiler comes on and heats water up to flow temperature.
Boiler then reduces flame up/down as required to maintain flow temperature (for a while).
Tado (I assume) tells boiler to shut down but keeps pump running to circulate water round the system.
Tado tells boiler to come back on and off at periodic intervals. Sometimes going back to flow temp, sometimes for more of a 'top up' to mid 50s C then off again.
Desired room temperature is reached. All off.
I dont know if the boiler on off business is Tado trying to be eco friendly or because the boiler decides that the flow rate is now consistent so doesn't need to be on or maybe I am just being paranoid because its taking forever to heat up the house so I was wondering what should be happening compared to what I am seeing
When the hot water is on (I have a cylinder), this is not controlled by Tado but the normal programmer. What happens is that the hot water demand comes on, boiler comes on and stays on (modulating the flame) for the whole time then goes off when the hot water turns off. To me this is what I would expect the heating to do as well.
The reason I am asking is that I have it set to 16c overnight and 17.5c daytime. The heating comes on at 0630 and it then takes 6 hours on average to get to 17.5c.
To me (based on nothing whatsoever), this seems to be a very long time to go up by a relatively small amount. The system was power flushed and balanced a few months ago with all radiators getting hot.
After the system was cleaned I installed the Tado wired stat so that was the only change.
Here is that I think should happen (or at least what I think was happening with a 'normal' thermostat). Non weather comp boiler. Flow rate of 70c.
Room stat calls for heat.
Boiler comes on and heats water up to flow temperature.
Boiler then reduces flame up/down as required to maintain flow temperature until desired room temperature is reached.
I assume the above is expected behaviour?
Here is what Tado is doing.
Room stat calls for heat.
Boiler comes on and heats water up to flow temperature.
Boiler then reduces flame up/down as required to maintain flow temperature (for a while).
Tado (I assume) tells boiler to shut down but keeps pump running to circulate water round the system.
Tado tells boiler to come back on and off at periodic intervals. Sometimes going back to flow temp, sometimes for more of a 'top up' to mid 50s C then off again.
Desired room temperature is reached. All off.
I dont know if the boiler on off business is Tado trying to be eco friendly or because the boiler decides that the flow rate is now consistent so doesn't need to be on or maybe I am just being paranoid because its taking forever to heat up the house so I was wondering what should be happening compared to what I am seeing
When the hot water is on (I have a cylinder), this is not controlled by Tado but the normal programmer. What happens is that the hot water demand comes on, boiler comes on and stays on (modulating the flame) for the whole time then goes off when the hot water turns off. To me this is what I would expect the heating to do as well.
it shouldnt take anywhere near that long to get it to temp
quite possibly it simply your rad isnt big enough for the heat loss of the room or the flow temp isnt high enough to compensate
as the tado is controlling your flow temp then id say possibly the rad isnt big enough
this was pulling the temp up 4 deg c
this is what mine looks like using opentherm but evohome not tado and mine isnt running as it should as it cycles so much
but as you can see higher flow temp to get it to temp then backing off temp to maintain thi s isnt as accurate as it should be as the temp im showing is my office not the room with the thermostat in but im calibrating that at the moment so dont have it to hand
quite possibly it simply your rad isnt big enough for the heat loss of the room or the flow temp isnt high enough to compensate
as the tado is controlling your flow temp then id say possibly the rad isnt big enough
this was pulling the temp up 4 deg c
this is what mine looks like using opentherm but evohome not tado and mine isnt running as it should as it cycles so much
but as you can see higher flow temp to get it to temp then backing off temp to maintain thi s isnt as accurate as it should be as the temp im showing is my office not the room with the thermostat in but im calibrating that at the moment so dont have it to hand
Edited by Trustmeimadoctor on Monday 23 January 11:21
The flow temp is fixed on the boiler, the Tado is really behaving as a fancy on off switch. I have tried upping the flow temp from 70 to 75 and it makes no difference to the time it takes to heat up other than use more gas. Do you think it needs to go higher?
The room stat is in the hall and I just swapped the dial one over for the Tado. When I had the dial room stat I dont remember it taking this long to heat up but then I didnt have access to all the graphs, etc that Tado produces.
When it eventually gets to 17.5c the house is warm but I am at a loss why its taking so long as the radiator in the hall does get too hot to touch so is producing heat.
The room stat is in the hall and I just swapped the dial one over for the Tado. When I had the dial room stat I dont remember it taking this long to heat up but then I didnt have access to all the graphs, etc that Tado produces.
When it eventually gets to 17.5c the house is warm but I am at a loss why its taking so long as the radiator in the hall does get too hot to touch so is producing heat.
What happens if you set the room stat to a more normal temp, like 20C?
I'm assuming you're not using a bus connected version of the Tado?
We have ours"controlling" both CH & HW on a 2 port valve system - so, of course, all Tado is doing is opening the valves.
Boiler ramps up fast to it's set flow of 67C and generally just sits there. Rads get hot pretty quick. As the smart TRVs shut down various rads the flow temp will creep up to maybe 72C and then the burner shuts off for a few mins, wiht the temp dropping to maybe 50C (I don't think that's a settting, I think it just drops to that in the time it's on overrun) and then repeats.
The only slightly odd thing is that sometimes when the boiler (Glow Worm Energy 7) refires it stays at a low burner rate and doesn't ramp up fast so takes a long time to get back to 67C. Clearly that's something the boiler itself is deciding but I don't know if it's a glitch or if something in its software is telling it to say at a low burner rate - maybe it's connected to flow rate through the boiler, but I'm completely guessing there.
I'm assuming you're not using a bus connected version of the Tado?
We have ours"controlling" both CH & HW on a 2 port valve system - so, of course, all Tado is doing is opening the valves.
Boiler ramps up fast to it's set flow of 67C and generally just sits there. Rads get hot pretty quick. As the smart TRVs shut down various rads the flow temp will creep up to maybe 72C and then the burner shuts off for a few mins, wiht the temp dropping to maybe 50C (I don't think that's a settting, I think it just drops to that in the time it's on overrun) and then repeats.
The only slightly odd thing is that sometimes when the boiler (Glow Worm Energy 7) refires it stays at a low burner rate and doesn't ramp up fast so takes a long time to get back to 67C. Clearly that's something the boiler itself is deciding but I don't know if it's a glitch or if something in its software is telling it to say at a low burner rate - maybe it's connected to flow rate through the boiler, but I'm completely guessing there.
KTF said:
The flow temp is fixed on the boiler, the Tado is really behaving as a fancy on off switch. I have tried upping the flow temp from 70 to 75 and it makes no difference to the time it takes to heat up other than use more gas. Do you think it needs to go higher?
The room stat is in the hall and I just swapped the dial one over for the Tado. When I had the dial room stat I dont remember it taking this long to heat up but then I didnt have access to all the graphs, etc that Tado produces.
When it eventually gets to 17.5c the house is warm but I am at a loss why its taking so long as the radiator in the hall does get too hot to touch so is producing heat.
it doesnt need to go higher!The room stat is in the hall and I just swapped the dial one over for the Tado. When I had the dial room stat I dont remember it taking this long to heat up but then I didnt have access to all the graphs, etc that Tado produces.
When it eventually gets to 17.5c the house is warm but I am at a loss why its taking so long as the radiator in the hall does get too hot to touch so is producing heat.
it does seem that tado is playing silly buggers
usually, rads are too small in halls this was so they didnt switch off before the rest of the house got to temp.
one of the issues are we dont know how hot the ch water actually is the rad will feel hot as long as the rad is warmer than your skin temp
one of the issues you have is if you swap out the rad in the hall you will potentially get it stopping the heating in the rest of the house before its got up to temp if those rads are also undersized
id try turning off alll the compensations on the tado and see how you get on so like the smart start and stop functionality and see if it changes how it heats
do you have all the trv's set to sensible temps around the house or have you turned a bunch of them off as its possible it actually the boiler getting too hot and then shutting down to stop it overheating or potentially other reasons
what graphs do you have you can share
Sheepshanks said:
What happens if you set the room stat to a more normal temp, like 20C?
I'm assuming you'te not using a bus connected version of the Tado?
We have ours"controlling" both CH & HW on a 2 port valve system - so, of course, all Tado is doing is opening the valves.
Boiler ramps up to it's set flow of 67C and generally just sits there. As the smart TRV shut down rads the temp will creep up to maybe 72C and the burner shuts off for a few mins, wiht the temp dropping to maybe 50C (I don't think that's a settting, I think it just drops to that in the time it's on overrun) and then repeats.
The only slightly odd thing is that sometimes when the boiler (Glow Worm Energy 7) refires it stays at a low burner rate and doesn't ramp up fast so takes a long time to get back to 67C. Clearly that's something the boiler itself is deciding but I don't know if it's a glitch or if something in its software is telling it to say at a low burner rate - maybe it's connected to flow rate through the boiler, but I'm completely guessing there.
it should start at a low temp and build up rather than firing at max temp to stop it overheating I'm assuming you'te not using a bus connected version of the Tado?
We have ours"controlling" both CH & HW on a 2 port valve system - so, of course, all Tado is doing is opening the valves.
Boiler ramps up to it's set flow of 67C and generally just sits there. As the smart TRV shut down rads the temp will creep up to maybe 72C and the burner shuts off for a few mins, wiht the temp dropping to maybe 50C (I don't think that's a settting, I think it just drops to that in the time it's on overrun) and then repeats.
The only slightly odd thing is that sometimes when the boiler (Glow Worm Energy 7) refires it stays at a low burner rate and doesn't ramp up fast so takes a long time to get back to 67C. Clearly that's something the boiler itself is deciding but I don't know if it's a glitch or if something in its software is telling it to say at a low burner rate - maybe it's connected to flow rate through the boiler, but I'm completely guessing there.
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