Who's 30+ and has no kids through choice?
Discussion
It's turned into a typical fanboi thread tbh...
"I really don't want a <insert typically-bashed-on-PH car>"
"But why?"
"I just don't. I have no desire to drive one or have anything to do with one."
"But how can you say that? You've never driven one."
"Yeah, I know. My mate's got one and I'm not interested in driving one either".
"But how can you say that if you've never driven it?"
"Quite easily, I've thought about it and I don't want to drive one".
"I've got one, and it's brilliant, best thing in the world ever, you should go drive one - otherwise how can you say you don't want one?".
"Again, very easily, I just don't want to".
"What are you, some kind of freak?!".
etc etc etc...
"I really don't want a <insert typically-bashed-on-PH car>"
"But why?"
"I just don't. I have no desire to drive one or have anything to do with one."
"But how can you say that? You've never driven one."
"Yeah, I know. My mate's got one and I'm not interested in driving one either".
"But how can you say that if you've never driven it?"
"Quite easily, I've thought about it and I don't want to drive one".
"I've got one, and it's brilliant, best thing in the world ever, you should go drive one - otherwise how can you say you don't want one?".
"Again, very easily, I just don't want to".
"What are you, some kind of freak?!".
etc etc etc...
Cotty said:
DoubleSix said:
Only those of us who have had both experiences (being single and care free & being a parent with all that brings) can really judge... 
Well yes but you can't experience being single and care free at your age now. You can't imagine what its like to have all that free time and money. You can never experience that as you will always be a parent. But I can tell you its pretty good 
csd19 said:
It's turned into a typical fanboi thread tbh...
"I really don't want a <insert typically-bashed-on-PH car>"
"But why?"
"I just don't. I have no desire to drive one or have anything to do with one."
"But how can you say that? You've never driven one."
"Yeah, I know. I'm not interested in driving one either".
"But how can you say that if you've never driven it?"
"Quite easily, I've thought about it and I don't want to drive one".
"I've got one, and it's brilliant, best thing in the world ever, you should go drive one - otherwise how can you say you don't want one?".
"Again, very easily, I just don't want to".
"What are you, some kind of freak?!".
etc etc etc...
Thats really funny "I really don't want a <insert typically-bashed-on-PH car>"
"But why?"
"I just don't. I have no desire to drive one or have anything to do with one."
"But how can you say that? You've never driven one."
"Yeah, I know. I'm not interested in driving one either".
"But how can you say that if you've never driven it?"
"Quite easily, I've thought about it and I don't want to drive one".
"I've got one, and it's brilliant, best thing in the world ever, you should go drive one - otherwise how can you say you don't want one?".
"Again, very easily, I just don't want to".
"What are you, some kind of freak?!".
etc etc etc...
Cotty said:
DoubleSix said:
Only those of us who have had both experiences (being single and care free & being a parent with all that brings) can really judge...
Well yes but you can't experience being single and care free at your age now. You can't imagine what its like to have all that free time and money. You can never experience that as you will always be a parent. But I can tell you its pretty good Unlike me, my sons have been to all the major Continents well before they were thirty and encourage me to take advantage of the various offers and invites from former International business contacts and friends from my trading days. One Peru based business friend, knowing my interest in Natural History, offered to have an armed escort with us when we explored the nearby fabulous forests in the area. So we would be safe ...
If I lived to be a thousand years old, I would still not have time to do all the things I want to do with or without kids. It's not the kids which stop me doing that ...
I can't work out what the big deal is with the two 'sides' to this debate are.
Some want them, some don't. Some have them and go out of their way to f
k them over completely. Some would die so theirs could live. And then some don't have them through choice and some through no choice. Neither having nor not having is 'better'. Once life choice vs another life choice. Why does it have to be 'my choice is better than your choice?'
But, oh the joy of shopping without a trolley, a house full of sharp edges and adult only clutter. Life.. No teachers, no catchment areas, school run, or stupid half term holiday prices. But then again, no child 'firsts' to be remembered for ever. What the hell, at least we live in an age where our parental choices are greater than every they were. It's somewhat of a shame that so many, a significant number seem so good at utterly fking up parenthood. Maybe it's harder than it looks
Some want them, some don't. Some have them and go out of their way to f
k them over completely. Some would die so theirs could live. And then some don't have them through choice and some through no choice. Neither having nor not having is 'better'. Once life choice vs another life choice. Why does it have to be 'my choice is better than your choice?'But, oh the joy of shopping without a trolley, a house full of sharp edges and adult only clutter. Life.. No teachers, no catchment areas, school run, or stupid half term holiday prices. But then again, no child 'firsts' to be remembered for ever. What the hell, at least we live in an age where our parental choices are greater than every they were. It's somewhat of a shame that so many, a significant number seem so good at utterly f
king up parenthood. Maybe it's harder than it looks Now 63, we got married when we were 21 and knew for certain then that neither of us wanted kids. There was expectations from parents when we moved to a bigger house at 24, but they eventually got used to the idea.
I can honestly say that we have never regretted it, our closest friends also do not have kids. We have Dutch friends who do not have any, but probably wanted them. We also have friends whose kids and grandchildren seem complete basket cases despite generally having had silver spoons from birth.
Financially, we are much better off. My wife had a great career, which now pays a superb pension. I certainly would not have been willing to stop earning. I think that expectation is cause of most family problems - you just cannot buy heaps of TLC that kids need.
My observation would be that kids can bring a shedload of heartache, or be utterly fantastic. There does not seem to be a median position.
I can honestly say that we have never regretted it, our closest friends also do not have kids. We have Dutch friends who do not have any, but probably wanted them. We also have friends whose kids and grandchildren seem complete basket cases despite generally having had silver spoons from birth.
Financially, we are much better off. My wife had a great career, which now pays a superb pension. I certainly would not have been willing to stop earning. I think that expectation is cause of most family problems - you just cannot buy heaps of TLC that kids need.
My observation would be that kids can bring a shedload of heartache, or be utterly fantastic. There does not seem to be a median position.
Cotty said:
... self-supporting have you seen how much weddings and houses cost these days 
Cost:~An illusion created by those it suits to do so. No more costly now than was the case when for teenage partner and parentless me facing the challenges to get by. Hopelessly out of reach then ... until we worked for it. No £300 quid a week new foreign cars or expensive holidays like some folks. Adjusted things and ten years later ~ note not "I want it now" ~ we able to put a sizable deposit on a house. Still had to adjust things but, I am now accused by some of being lucky. They have not got a clue.
R11ysf said:
So I can say with 100% definitive clarity that if you'd lived the single life I had you would prefer you didn't have kids. "Fact".
My single life was as a stockbroker during the tech boom.Short of being Olga Kurylenko's Gynae I doubt I'd swap ya!
Anyway good luck to you all 'tis but for the japes.
DoubleSix said:
My single life was as a stockbroker during the tech boom.
Short of being Olga Kurylenko's Gynae I doubt I'd swap ya!
Short of being Olga Kurylenko's Gynae I doubt I'd swap ya!
DoubleSix said:
I miss my Porsche a bit and yes the luxury breaks in Sardinia were nice. But packing up the Audi A4 to go to a cottage in Cornwall with an excitable offspring beats it all hands down.
You can't have been a good stockbroker if having kids has made you cut back on holidays and downgrade the car Timmy40 said:
I can't stand other peoples children and didn't think I wanted kids before I had them. I ADORE my children. It's completely different when it's your own and IMO you can't know the difference until you've actually experienced it.
I can and I do.I do not want children. Not ever. I'm unsure why so many cannot accept this view as legitimate.
MGJohn said:
Cost:~
An illusion created by those it suits to do so. No more costly now than was the case when for teenage partner and parentless me facing the challenges to get by. Hopelessly out of reach then ... until we worked for it. No £300 quid a week new foreign cars or expensive holidays like some folks. Adjusted things and ten years later ~ note not "I want it now" ~ we able to put a sizable deposit on a house. Still had to adjust things but, I am now accused by some of being lucky. They have not got a clue.
I agree to an extent I struggled to pay the mortgage on the house I bought for £61,500 due to wages being a lot less 19 years ago. 6 years to go paying £400 a month. However I could not get a mortgage on my house as its now worth more than three times my salary. An illusion created by those it suits to do so. No more costly now than was the case when for teenage partner and parentless me facing the challenges to get by. Hopelessly out of reach then ... until we worked for it. No £300 quid a week new foreign cars or expensive holidays like some folks. Adjusted things and ten years later ~ note not "I want it now" ~ we able to put a sizable deposit on a house. Still had to adjust things but, I am now accused by some of being lucky. They have not got a clue.
DoubleSix said:
Cotty said:
DoubleSix said:
I understand that entirely. What makes you think I don't?
Because you keep banging on about not knowing unless you experience it. We don't want to experience it so we won't know.I think thats stalemate.
... or not...
...because you still missed the point that you don't know you don't want the experience because you don't know what it is!
J
Only those of us who have had both experiences (being single and care free & being a parent with all that brings) can really judge...
Cotty said:
MGJohn said:
Cost:~
An illusion created by those it suits to do so. No more costly now than was the case when for teenage partner and parentless me facing the challenges to get by. Hopelessly out of reach then ... until we worked for it. No £300 quid a week new foreign cars or expensive holidays like some folks. Adjusted things and ten years later ~ note not "I want it now" ~ we able to put a sizable deposit on a house. Still had to adjust things but, I am now accused by some of being lucky. They have not got a clue.
I agree to an extent I struggled to pay the mortgage on the house I bought for £61,500 due to wages being a lot less 19 years ago. 6 years to go paying £400 a month. However I could not get a mortgage on my house as its now worth more than three times my salary. An illusion created by those it suits to do so. No more costly now than was the case when for teenage partner and parentless me facing the challenges to get by. Hopelessly out of reach then ... until we worked for it. No £300 quid a week new foreign cars or expensive holidays like some folks. Adjusted things and ten years later ~ note not "I want it now" ~ we able to put a sizable deposit on a house. Still had to adjust things but, I am now accused by some of being lucky. They have not got a clue.
Two years after starting up, along came son no. 1. Yes, there was a conflict of interests but, just had to make the best of it. Here's a lesson I learned then which I'll pass on now in case anyone is faced with the same scenario.
It is not a very good idea to start a demanding and time consuming business then start a family soon after.. It can work but, not the best of timing ...
R11ysf said:
How do you know that my single life is not 50 times better than yours ever was? How do you know if you had lived my single life you would never have wanted any kids? Oh that's right, you can't. "Fact".
So I can say with 100% definitive clarity that if you'd lived the single life I had you would prefer you didn't have kids. "Fact."
Elementary piece of reasoning.....
So I can say with 100% definitive clarity that if you'd lived the single life I had you would prefer you didn't have kids. "Fact."
Elementary piece of reasoning.....
A bloke splitting hairs on the internet said:
No, YOU can't say this with 100% definitive clarity, because only YOU know what is best for YOU.
I might have lived your life and thought it was absolute ste, YOU don't know. YOU think YOU do but YOU can't be sure.
Hooray for YOU and YOUR 300 dinners out, well done. YOU can't know whether it's great or ste to have kids because each kid is unique, YOUR kid could be wonderful, they could be the spawn of Beelzebub. I suspect from your tone that they would be pretty bombastic. However YOU will never be in a position to say with absolute certainty because frankly you've taken a punt on what YOU think is best for YOU on the basis of all information available.
For clarity, I was YOU for 20 years then, in the words of the great Mr Jarvis Cocker, something changed.
I decided I might be denying myself something by not having a kid. YOU or I can't possibly say if I was, but at least I will be able to know, for sure, if YOU were right or not in 20 odd years time. You having a speculative guess at MY life now ain't washing. If YOU are right and I am wrong then great, congratulations, YOU've won the internet. Take yourself out for a 301st dinner to celebrate.
I might have lived your life and thought it was absolute s
te, YOU don't know. YOU think YOU do but YOU can't be sure. Hooray for YOU and YOUR 300 dinners out, well done. YOU can't know whether it's great or s
te to have kids because each kid is unique, YOUR kid could be wonderful, they could be the spawn of Beelzebub. I suspect from your tone that they would be pretty bombastic. However YOU will never be in a position to say with absolute certainty because frankly you've taken a punt on what YOU think is best for YOU on the basis of all information available. For clarity, I was YOU for 20 years then, in the words of the great Mr Jarvis Cocker, something changed.
I decided I might be denying myself something by not having a kid. YOU or I can't possibly say if I was, but at least I will be able to know, for sure, if YOU were right or not in 20 odd years time. You having a speculative guess at MY life now ain't washing. If YOU are right and I am wrong then great, congratulations, YOU've won the internet. Take yourself out for a 301st dinner to celebrate.
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