The Official Manchester United Thread (Vol 12)

[and31]

simon800 said:

and31 said:

Still don’t remember that-perhaps you have some stats about it
On a different note,there was a list of perspective new managers for United listed on the old thread-you always say you “don’t know who is available “ when pressed about it because you want ten Haag out, so from the list who would you choose? I’m sure you can find it easily enough..

I do have a good stat on Amrabat. Number of managers in the world who thought he'd be able to cut it at Man Utd after spending a career in mid table farmers leaguers clubs = 1

Without remembering who is in the list you've referred, I'd take any of them as none can be as bad as the Dutch fraud

There you go-who do you fancy from that list? Let’s assume they are all available

[simon800]

We'd need to be nearer the 175/1 mark before we reach any who could do a worse job;

[and31]

said:

So who do you want?

[simon800]

and31 said:

So who do you want?

As stated several times now, my honest opinion is any of them would be doing a better job.

I don't think any of them would pay £10mn to borrow Amrabat for a season, nor would any sign off on replacing De Gea and Fred with Onana and Mount at a cost of £100mn despite massive gaping holes elsewhere in the squad, nor would any think Antony is anywhere near the level needed for the Premier League.

I also think given the exact same group of players any of them would accumulate more than 2 points from a possible 39 away against the big teams (Sam Allardyce would do better than this), all of them would have this squad on better "goals for" than Luton Town after 26 games, and I also think it's likely that all of them would have us on a better goal difference than minus 2 having lavished £400mn on the squad.

So any of them will do.

If it helps my least preferred from that list would be Carrick, Maresca, Southgate and De Zerbi. But they'd probably still do better.

Edit to add actually I must admit I've never heard of Farioli

Edited by simon800 on Sunday 3rd March 19:02

[2HFL]

simon800 said:

and31 said:

So who do you want?

As stated several times now, my honest opinion is any of them would be doing a better job.

I don't think any of them would pay £10mn to borrow Amrabat for a season, nor would any sign off on replacing De Gea and Fred with Onana and Mount at a cost of £100mn despite massive gaping holes elsewhere in the squad, nor would any think Antony is anywhere near the level needed for the Premier League.

I also think given the exact same group of players any of them would accumulate more than 2 points from a possible 39 away against the big teams (Sam Allardyce would do better than this), all of them would have this squad on better "goals for" than Luton Town after 26 games, and I also think it's likely that all of them would have us on a better goal difference than minus 2 having lavished £400mn on the squad.

So any of them will do.

If it helps my least preferred from that list would be Carrick, Maresca, Southgate and De Zerbi. But they'd probably still do better.

Edit to add actually I must admit I've never heard of Farioli

Edited by simon800 on Sunday 3rd March 19:02

Must be uncomfortable sitting on that fence.

[LF5335]

I’ve said Amorim would be interesting. I don’t think we should change yet though. I’d like to see the new leadership structure bed in properly and see how it’s going to work. No point changing the manager if we’re going to go through the same old st again. Let’s see INEOS or SJR or whoever is running the club make a bold statement. The club is a mess, everything needs knocking down and rebuilding figuratively speaking. Have the bottle to say it explicitly. Tell the EA Sports playing fans that we’re not into quick fixes anymore. Not least as they’re neither quick nor fixes. Tell the manager they won’t be sacked if they meet the far lower standards that are set. Make those standards about culture, youth development, but not about league position or winning cups until years down the line.

What I just can’t see is any progress on digging ourselves out of this mess. That is why I’m annoyed with us and our season.

[jgrewal]

Looks we tried to do our plucky underdog routine for the first half. This isn't a derby anymore its an automatic 6 points for City unless they do not turn up or we get lucky.

Edited by jgrewal on Sunday 3rd March 19:56

[Gordon Hill]

The definition of insanity is doing the same things over and over again and expecting different results. Well we've been doing the same things for 10 years namely letting people with no idea have hold of the cheque book. No one player or a couple of players are going to get us out of this mess.
The club is in need of a total reset. Things have started well, getting experienced, knowledgeable people on board to make those decisions and take away the running of the football side away from the accountants. Next comes someone who actually knows what they are doing when it comes to recruitment. Then starts the very slow climb back but it means getting a lot of decisions right, first being clearing out the dead wood at the club. Next season may be equally as painful as this one as the readjustment is made.
Some very poor decisions have been made to bring us to this point but some of those made by ETH have been truly baffling. Anthony, Onana, Mount, complete waste of money, I don't think that he's the one to take us forward but it's pointless changing now, might as well wait until the summer.

[RoadRunner220]

uk66fastback said:

It’s gonna take a lot more than two/three years - Sir Jim’s words - to close the gap though.

I'd like to think that whilst we may not be level with our neighbours in two to three years, we will be somewhat closer than we are now.

[jgrewal]

This needs to be minimum 5 years project and we're completely in the wilderness right now. 10 years without a league title so we may aswell completely reset.

1st Year - Formulate new organisation which is already underway (plus new manager too?) to overhaul the recruitment, playing style and develop a talent pipeline
2nd and 3rd Year - Overhaul squad within constraints of FFP by investing in youth talent to grow with the team maybe finish top 4 if possible
4th - Hopefully by now building blocks of a squad and a spine that could challenge for a title
5th - Title race

Even the above will be very difficult but what we need to be doing.

[bstb3]

You would think so - and if that is the plan it should signal the end of the 'experienced' signings and instead a focus on youth and potential. I really hope so. While I enjoy watching the big name players, to a point, we are signing them at the end / close to the end of their careers and so watch the decline without any real forward plan. You can see why - potentially cheaper and with an inbuilt marketing return / online following. That has to be the first strategy in the bin.

I'll be loving it if we are finding relative unknowns and turning them in to stars.

[Challo]

simon800 said:

and31 said:

So who do you want?

As stated several times now, my honest opinion is any of them would be doing a better job.

I don't think any of them would pay £10mn to borrow Amrabat for a season, nor would any sign off on replacing De Gea and Fred with Onana and Mount at a cost of £100mn despite massive gaping holes elsewhere in the squad, nor would any think Antony is anywhere near the level needed for the Premier League.

I also think given the exact same group of players any of them would accumulate more than 2 points from a possible 39 away against the big teams (Sam Allardyce would do better than this), all of them would have this squad on better "goals for" than Luton Town after 26 games, and I also think it's likely that all of them would have us on a better goal difference than minus 2 having lavished £400mn on the squad.

So any of them will do.

If it helps my least preferred from that list would be Carrick, Maresca, Southgate and De Zerbi. But they'd probably still do better.

Edit to add actually I must admit I've never heard of Farioli

Edited by simon800 on Sunday 3rd March 19:02

Carrick, Southgate or Maresca?

At least your a poster we know we can ignore

[LF5335]

Challo said:

simon800 said:

and31 said:

So who do you want?

As stated several times now, my honest opinion is any of them would be doing a better job.

I don't think any of them would pay £10mn to borrow Amrabat for a season, nor would any sign off on replacing De Gea and Fred with Onana and Mount at a cost of £100mn despite massive gaping holes elsewhere in the squad, nor would any think Antony is anywhere near the level needed for the Premier League.

I also think given the exact same group of players any of them would accumulate more than 2 points from a possible 39 away against the big teams (Sam Allardyce would do better than this), all of them would have this squad on better "goals for" than Luton Town after 26 games, and I also think it's likely that all of them would have us on a better goal difference than minus 2 having lavished £400mn on the squad.

So any of them will do.

If it helps my least preferred from that list would be Carrick, Maresca, Southgate and De Zerbi. But they'd probably still do better.

Edit to add actually I must admit I've never heard of Farioli

Edited by simon800 on Sunday 3rd March 19:02

Carrick, Southgate or Maresca?

At least your a poster we know we can ignore

He said “least preferred”. Unless you think they should be genuine contenders for the role

[Challo]

LF5335 said:

He said “least preferred”. Unless you think they should be genuine contenders for the role

My bad, I misread the post, apologies.

To be honest there is not many in that list that are inspiring. Potter seems the safe option, Tuchel is like Jose and can be toxic. Amorim has plaudits, but potentially the same issue as ETH. Would Inzagi be any good? Who knows.

[LF5335]

Challo said:

My bad, I misread the post, apologies.

To be honest there is not many in that list that are inspiring. Potter seems the safe option, Tuchel is like Jose and can be toxic. Amorim has plaudits, but potentially the same issue as ETH. Would Inzagi be any good? Who knows.

I don’t think there are many around in World football that stand out. The poor quality of the CL over the past couple of seasons is reflective of that. No manager seems to be creating a decent side beyond one team and their dubious financial practices.

We have to accept though that we’re not shopping at the top table for managerial talent though. Liverpool, Barca and Bayern are all looking for new managers. Will we be in the running to challenge them for whoever is the top choice, or do we just get the one they don’t want?

I’m guessing Liverpool will get Xabi Alonso. The rest is wide open. Potter would be a disaster his football is dull as ditchwater. Tuchel you rightly say is toxic. The rest are just managers where we know what we’ll get and isn’t massively inspiring. Take a punt on Amorim with some very very clear guidance on what’s expected as I’ve said above or just stick with ETH?

[LF5335]

Just an aside but apparently we broke another record / streak yesterday. First time we’ve lost a game that we were leading at halftime since 2014.

Those records keep on tumbling, although this one doesn’t really mean that much IMO.

[Frimley111R]

Despite all this new manager chat, based on previous convos on here, it seems that the manager is not the issue. The big issue is the lack of a supporting structure behind the scenes (god knows what happened to the last one). If we swapped managers we'd have the same issues?

[hmg]

Frimley111R said:

Despite all this new manager chat, based on previous convos on here, it seems that the manager is not the issue. The big issue is the lack of a supporting structure behind the scenes (god knows what happened to the last one). If we swapped managers we'd have the same issues?

The issue is unless we have our 1st choice 11 fully fit and available and able to stay fit, our squad players simply aren’t young/fit enough or talented enough.

When other top 4 teams rotate squad players there seems to be much less of a drop off in performance..

TBF to ETH given our 1st choice being available and less injuries..I’m sure we would be top 4 now but there are squad players and arguably a few 1st choice players that need clearing out.. There is no magic wand and very little wiggle room given the restraints of FFP too. It’s definitely a project..

I do know one thing I’d rather be a Red than watch that football week in week out at the Etihad. I know they are the best team arguably in the world ATM but god it’s so monotonous to watch.

I’d rather watch F1.

Edited by hmg on Monday 4th March 12:16

[bstb3]

Frimley111R said:

Despite all this new manager chat, based on previous convos on here, it seems that the manager is not the issue. The big issue is the lack of a supporting structure behind the scenes (god knows what happened to the last one). If we swapped managers we'd have the same issues?

Well those issues are already being resolved by Ineos - the CEO already replaced by Barrada who did so well at Man City, Dan Ashworth is being lined up in a Director of Football role and then there are always rumours about new transfer / recruitment heads coming in under that. Theres a good reason why they are doing that. Logically it makes sense to get at least Barrada and Ashworth in (or equivalent) before appointing the manager as you would expect them to have a large say in that. There's also an argument to say ETH could be given a run under a competent structure too, although if we miss CL I'm not sure that will happen.

What we can say is that hopefully ETH will be the last in a line of managers to have been working at United under such a poor structure and he, or whomsoever replaces him, will have a much better support and chance of success going forwards.

[StuTheGrouch]

Frimley111R said:

Despite all this new manager chat, based on previous convos on here, it seems that the manager is not the issue. The big issue is the lack of a supporting structure behind the scenes (god knows what happened to the last one). If we swapped managers we'd have the same issues?

My thoughts too. I think we need to get the football leadership team in place, have a positive summer of recruitment/clearing out the dross and go from there. We clearly have a few youngsters coming through too, so I don't think it will be a case of selling/releasing 4-5 players and then buying 4-5 players.

The main issue with Ten Hag is the lack of a clear playing style. He doesn't seem that tactically adept, but he has also had a lot of issues to handle (Ronaldo, Greenwood, Sancho, the pile of injuries and the oddity of Rashford).