The Best Tyre Pumps... in the World?

[caelite]

Since this thread has been revived again.

Still got my Michelin double barrel, best part of 2 and a half years of frequent use and it is fully functional.

[rovermorris999]

You've done better than me then. I've had two of them, neither lasted long.

[Rhyolith]

lufbramatt said:

Not sure what its like inside. Haven't had time to get it in bits, but have got the car sorted now so hopefully can find some time to have a look.

It all moves smoothly but no air coming out of the connector, it came from a house clearance, looks like the seller tried to oil it as there is evidence of fresh oil on the cylinder, then when that didn't help stuck it on ebay. He had two, one was Air Ministry but didn't look in as good condition so I went for the "normal" one.

I've found an instruction leaflet online which talks through how to take it to bits, looks slightly complicated but I design model kits for a living so am used to fiddly stuff

Its probably the leather washers.

This might be helpful to you:
Kismet Master Duplex Air Ministry (dismantled) by Rhyolith, on Flickr

caelite said:

Since this thread has been revived again.

Still got my Michelin double barrel, best part of 2 and a half years of frequent use and it is fully functional.

Only 71 years to go to match the pump at the start of the thread! For that kind of life span maintainability is as important as build quality, Kismet's are excellent in both regards...I don't actually know much about the maintainability of the modern Michelin pumps, but I get the impression its not great? I find most modern products are hard to take apart and even harder to find spares for.

Edited by Rhyolith on Sunday 2nd July 13:28

[Rhyolith]

Its been a while, so thought I'd post a few of my latest pump restorations.

First a pre-WW2 (I think) Kismet Duplex Master I found in at the car boot in remarkably good condition, still had most of its original paint! The pictures show before and after the Restoration (which was mostly just cleaning and a few washer replacements).

Before:
Kismet Duplex Master by Rhyolith, on Flickr
Kismet Duplex Master by Rhyolith, on Flickr\

After:
Kismet Duplex Master by Rhyolith, on Flickr
Kismet Duplex Master by Rhyolith, on Flickr

I documented my dismantling of this one step by step with photographs, they are in order in this album: https://www.flickr.com/photos/rhyolith/albums/7215...
Hopefully that will be useful to anyone thinking of doing up one of these.

I also finally 'finished' my Hattersley and Davidson Multistage, which is arguable the prettiest foot pump ever made!

Hattersely & Davidson Multistage by Rhyolith, on Flickr
Hattersely & Davidson Multistage by Rhyolith, on Flickr
Hattersely & Davidson Multistage by Rhyolith, on Flickr
Hattersely & Davidson Multistage by Rhyolith, on Flickr

It still leaks though... blinking top hat washers are a nightmare! Think it will need a lot of tinkering to become truly fully operation, but it does pump air now at least!

[lufbramatt]

Thanks for the photos of the Kismet Master dismantling- very useful indeed! Still not got around to starting mine!

[GordonEDWARDS]

Hi All, yes top hat washers are a pain!

1) In the Kismet Duplex/Duplex Master, I always replace the gland box seal ( originally a top hat washer ) with an alternative solution - several small 'polo mint' washers cut from thin leather and oiled/packed in tightly in around the piston rod - before screwing the gland box top back on to compress them. I've been using this method for many years now on upwards of 50-60 Duplex/Duplex Masters I've restored. It gives much better results than the original to hat washer and improves performance. You can adjust the tightness of the seal by adjusting the screwed top.

2) On the H&D (Handy) Multistage, the same approach can be used on the gland boxes of the second and third stage piston rods ( originally top hat washers were used here as well) Leakage through these gland boxes is the usual cause of a Multistage under-performing. It should be at least as good as the Duplex/Duplex Master

All details in my book! See my website (www.vintagepumps.co.uk ) or ebay to purchase. Christmas is coming.....!

[GordonEDWARDS]

Hi just another couple of topics of possible interest to all - talking of two stage pumps and things to collect!

1) Has anyone dismantled or restored a Dunlop Giant or Kismet Garage MkII? These are both (identical) two stage designs but different to the Duplex . Not sure who copied who ( Kismet or Dunlop) , but its a relatively more simple design with fewer washers and seals and fewer things to go wrong.

2) The Walters and Dobson (WAD) company also produced a very nice two stage pump. Again a different internal design. Well worth looking out for - similar in performance to the Duplex Master. They produced both a civilian and military issue version - the military one has a steel guard covering the brass barrel

Seasons greetings

Gordon

PS - If you are looking for Kismet Duplex Masters - I would avoid their very late models which were produced in Bedford ( c 1950-55) just before the company folded. These are often the 'deluxe' versions with pressure test valve and grease nipples and Bedford in on the nameplate. But they were going through quality problems at that point and I've had several of these late Duplex Masters where the piston rod has split along its length - presumably fatigue in use. Can be soldered up but a tricky process

[loose cannon]

In the 1965 halfords catalogue thread there is a kismet baby advertised if nobody had noticed

[GordonEDWARDS]

Hi, i thought people might like some pics of a VERY early Kismet Duplex I have in the collection. This is notable because its before they started putting makers name plates on the front - there is a nice embossed plaque on the barrel. Note, its when they called their Eyre Road factory 'The Brass Works' The pump has a very solid base with provisional patent number and Kismet Duplex on the back. Another interesting item which was dropped in later models are the fixing screws at the front - preventing the axle rotating in the cast frame. its been fully overhauled internally but I dont want to touch the externals - this patina has taken over 100 years to build up!

[GordonEDWARDS]

[GordonEDWARDS]

[GordonEDWARDS]

[Rhyolith]

loose cannon said:

In the 1965 halfords catalogue thread there is a kismet baby advertised if nobody had noticed

Link? Its a big forum!
Edit: Found it: https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...

Stacking disc washers is the method I used, I just haven't mastered it yet. I usually get them too loose or too tight, the first in the case of the multistage. I just need to ticker a bit and get them fitting right.

I have a dunlop giant which I restored a while back and currently serves as my main "working" pump in the van

Some are Big, some are Giant! by Rhyolith, on Flickr

I'd agree the design is a effective simplification of the 2-stage concept used in the masters, much easier to maintain! Its a shame theres not a smaller version of this type... least not that I am aware of?

I have a WAD that I think is 2 stage No.26 model. It works perfectly, so I have never dismantled it! Though you made me curious now, might have a look inside it! Now I think back, I think this might well have been my first brass cylinder pump!

Walter & Dodson Foot Pump by Rhyolith, on Flickr

I saw one of those type of kismet masters on eBay a while ago! I bid on it because I liked the nameplate on the cylinder and that it was different... however it went for money I couldn't afford at the time. Now I know why! Thanks for sharing.

Edited by Rhyolith on Friday 15th December 19:06

Edited by Rhyolith on Friday 15th December 19:07

Edited by Rhyolith on Saturday 16th December 12:16

[Vaud]

caelite said:

Since this thread has been revived again.

Still got my Michelin double barrel, best part of 2 and a half years of frequent use and it is fully functional.

I have had one for about 3 years and it’s fine.

[Rhyolith]

Vaud said:

I have had one for about 3 years and it’s fine.

From the comments about these Michelin ones so far, this seems like an pretty rare exception. Though I have not actaully counted, it seems like about 2 in 10 last more than a year... which is truly unacceptable quality in my book. There is just no good reason why something like a foot pump shouldn’t comfortably last 50+ years.

[cslwannabe]

Had 2 Michelin foot pumps which both failed in exactly the same manner. Use my bike track pump these days for the cars.

[Leapingcat]

Hi, I'm new to the forum and recently bought two vintage pumps.
Wood Milne & a Kismet Duplex Master.
The Wood Milne is currently in pieces ready to paint and a new leather washer is presently drying off (using Gordon Edwards method).
It won't be a perfect restoration as I have rushed the job a little bit, I just want a working pump.
When I start on the Kismet, I'll carry out a much more thorough restoration.
Looks like I'm hooked
Photo's to follow.

[Vaud]

Rhyolith said:

From the comments about these Michelin ones so far, this seems like an pretty rare exception. Though I have not actaully counted, it seems like about 2 in 10 last more than a year... which is truly unacceptable quality in my book. There is just no good reason why something like a foot pump shouldn’t comfortably last 50+ years.

i guess it depends how often they are used. At 3-4 times a year (mine) then it's doing fine.

If it's daily on a small fleet then maybe they fail more.

[Rhyolith]

Leapingcat said:

Hi, I'm new to the forum and recently bought two vintage pumps.
Wood Milne & a Kismet Duplex Master.
The Wood Milne is currently in pieces ready to paint and a new leather washer is presently drying off (using Gordon Edwards method).
It won't be a perfect restoration as I have rushed the job a little bit, I just want a working pump.
When I start on the Kismet, I'll carry out a much more thorough restoration.
Looks like I'm hooked
Photo's to follow.

Good choices!

The Wood Milne can be quite a challenge, the mechanical bits are a bit fiddly. I'd suggest taking your time resembling its very easy to put the parts back in the wrong place.

The Masters are quite easy I think, just a lot of leather washers to get right. They are well designed to come apart and go back together (particularly the WW2 ones).

Vaud said:

i guess it depends how often they are used. At 3-4 times a year (mine) then it's doing fine.

If it's daily on a small fleet then maybe they fail more.

That sounds like pretty standard use (3-4 times a year) and I'd expect a foot pump to last at least 10 years under that kind of use and much longer with maintenance (100+ years).

[Leapingcat]

Rhyolith said:

Good choices!

The Wood Milne can be quite a challenge, the mechanical bits are a bit fiddly. I'd suggest taking your time resembling its very easy to put the parts back in the wrong place.

Before I dismantled it, I took close up photo's from every angle...