Vettel to replace Alonso at Ferrari
Discussion
LDN said:
rubystone said:
Is the Honda engine known to be rubbish then? Chap in the pub the other day told me that Alonso's decision to sign for McLaren was eased by Honda showing him the tech on the engine. The bloke said that up to that point, Alonso was proving hard to close. But hey, just pub talk isn't it?
Ron calls the engine a piece of jewellery... I hope that's not all it ends up as.TBH he is going to talk it up isn't he, when asked he's hardly going to go "ummm, ahhhh, mmmm, yeahhhh, errrr, yeahh it's ok!"
I've heard that Honda are massively behind with it and the power is down on what it was hoped.
rubystone said:
Is the Honda engine known to be rubbish then? Chap in the pub the other day told me that Alonso's decision to sign for McLaren was eased by Honda showing him the tech on the engine. The bloke said that up to that point, Alonso was proving hard to close. But hey, just pub talk isn't it?
We don't know. There are reports of it being behind schedule, too heavy and using too much fuel. Honda say everything is okay.I guess we find out for sure mid March.
The Honda engine is behind schedule and below the target power and they made the mistake the same as Renault started too late and should have a McLaren test car pounding around the track now.
McLaren want the Honda engine in a car for the test after the last GP but Honda do not think that will happen until the February 2015 test and will probably have the same issues Red Ball had last year.
One thing that worries me is the head of Honda engines has been on the team principles press conference a few times this year and to be honest comes across as a idiot,joker and seams not to know what he is talking about.
Hope Alonso has a performance clause in his contract.
McLaren want the Honda engine in a car for the test after the last GP but Honda do not think that will happen until the February 2015 test and will probably have the same issues Red Ball had last year.
One thing that worries me is the head of Honda engines has been on the team principles press conference a few times this year and to be honest comes across as a idiot,joker and seams not to know what he is talking about.
Hope Alonso has a performance clause in his contract.
jsf said:
No one in the public domain knows how the Honda will perform, if anyone in the know let it out they would be fired instantly. It's all complete speculation.
exactly...Honda have the benefits of seeing just how good/bad a job the others made, I fully expect them to surpass what's out there now, the real question is how much further forward Merc and Ferrari can go for next year?
Crafty_ said:
sky were talking about the engine unfreeze earlier, Merc claim they know where to get another 60hp. Thats huge. If they keep their advantage over renault I'll be amused
If my understanding is correct, Mercedes advantage is not down the the ICE, but they way they have integrated the hybrid system, allowing them access all ~750bhp for the whole lap, not just the 30 seconds allowed by by discharging the batteries.If they can find another 60bhp from the combustion engine through unfreeze that would be so funny.
Megaflow said:
If my understanding is correct, Mercedes advantage is not down the the ICE, but they way they have integrated the hybrid system, allowing them access all ~750bhp for the whole lap, not just the 30 seconds allowed by by discharging the batteries.
If they can find another 60bhp from the combustion engine through unfreeze that would be so funny.
Am I alone in wishing we could go back to the great sounding V8s that didn't cost the teams a fortune to run because they were well developed and optimised already. Seems like these new engines have pushed the smaller teams to the very edge and now if they unfreeze the development goodness knows how much the costs will spiral. I mean if Merc have already identified another 60bhp that means Renault and Ferrari have to find what, at least 120bhp? just to catch up. If they can find another 60bhp from the combustion engine through unfreeze that would be so funny.
Megaflow said:
If my understanding is correct, Mercedes advantage is not down the the ICE, but they way they have integrated the hybrid system, allowing them access all ~750bhp for the whole lap, not just the 30 seconds allowed by by discharging the batteries.
If they can find another 60bhp from the combustion engine through unfreeze that would be so funny.
It was mentioned on sky, they did not state exactly where it was and I would guess they wouldn't tell you if asked!If they can find another 60bhp from the combustion engine through unfreeze that would be so funny.
I read the same thing about the engine/hybrid stuff, some very clever thinking going on.
I also think that the car is good chassis/aero wise too. We know from previous years that you can make up for a poor engine with good aero - either the Renault/Ferrari are very, very bad or Merc have a good package all round
Crafty_ said:
I also think that the car is good chassis/aero wise too. We know from previous years that you can make up for a poor engine with good aero - either the Renault/Ferrari are very, very bad or Merc have a good package all round
Well thats obvious, look at merc compared to force india and mclaren!If the red bull had a merc powerplant I'm pretty sure we'd have another 2013, but with Riccardo destroying everyone.
Megaflow said:
Crafty_ said:
sky were talking about the engine unfreeze earlier, Merc claim they know where to get another 60hp. Thats huge. If they keep their advantage over renault I'll be amused
If my understanding is correct, Mercedes advantage is not down the the ICE, but they way they have integrated the hybrid system, allowing them access all ~750bhp for the whole lap, not just the 30 seconds allowed by by discharging the batteries.If they can find another 60bhp from the combustion engine through unfreeze that would be so funny.
They also have a much larger turbo than either the Renault and especially the Ferrari, and this allows them to use a lower turbo speed they can then draw off much more power over a greater %age of a lap using the MGU-H. This can either be used to keep the battery topped up or fed directly to the MGU-K.
VolvoT5 said:
Am I alone in wishing we could go back to the great sounding V8s that didn't cost the teams a fortune to run because they were well developed and optimised already. Seems like these new engines have pushed the smaller teams to the very edge and now if they unfreeze the development goodness knows how much the costs will spiral. I mean if Merc have already identified another 60bhp that means Renault and Ferrari have to find what, at least 120bhp? just to catch up.
Although I share the concerns about costs I am not that fussed about a return to the V8s. I would have thought the technology in these engines is far more likely to have relevance to road cars.There's only so much energy in 100Kgs of fuel and they're only allowed to recover a fixed amount of energy per lap, the differences in power available should be very similar by the end of 2015 into the 2016 season for all the teams. I've not looked into it but would be interesting to know the relative efficiency of the Forumla 1 engines (ICE) compared to other race formula/series and road cars.
Red Bull have shown this season that engine power isn't the only factor in Mercedes dominance. Even being slightly down on power compared to the Mercedes powered teams they've managed 3 wins. Aero and having a well integrated package still counts.
Red Bull have shown this season that engine power isn't the only factor in Mercedes dominance. Even being slightly down on power compared to the Mercedes powered teams they've managed 3 wins. Aero and having a well integrated package still counts.
westtra said:
If that is true then I hope it comes back to bit McLarens arse.Gassing Station | Formula 1 | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff