RE: Unveiled: Caterham's Dramatic New SP/300.R
Discussion
Yep it was mentioned well the newer B08 has
http://www.lolacars.com/racecar.asp?RaceCarId=8
I've said it was near enough identical.
Perhaps Caterham have had some input on the setup - but Lola are the experts - effectively it's a rebadged Lola B08 with a cheaper body on the same chassis with a few cosmetic tweaks.
Here's Lola's brochure for the car.
http://www.sports2000-srcc.com/pdfs/B07_90brochure...
I'm just surprised that nobody's mentioned this car yet, as it is very similar in design and execution to the new Caterham car, and has the same engine in n/a form. Judging by the radically different price (pun intended!), I'm guessing that the aero package and chassis is far more advanced on the new Caterham car. S2000s (and Radicals?) are tubular space frame IIRC, whereas didn't someone say this new car is some sort of box chassis?
http://www.lolacars.com/racecar.asp?RaceCarId=8
I've said it was near enough identical.
Perhaps Caterham have had some input on the setup - but Lola are the experts - effectively it's a rebadged Lola B08 with a cheaper body on the same chassis with a few cosmetic tweaks.
RobM77 said:
ravon said:
RobM77, How much was the Lola with a N/A Duratec selling for please ?
POA, but from [my admittedly very poor!] memory it was around £30k without the engine. The Sports 2000 website details the engine requirements, which from memory are a standard Duratec for a couple of grand, plus one of their kits, which includes dry sump, gearbox and a few other bits for about £1000-£2000. 200bhp and 475kg with mild downforce. Great racing.Here's Lola's brochure for the car.
http://www.sports2000-srcc.com/pdfs/B07_90brochure...
I'm just surprised that nobody's mentioned this car yet, as it is very similar in design and execution to the new Caterham car, and has the same engine in n/a form. Judging by the radically different price (pun intended!), I'm guessing that the aero package and chassis is far more advanced on the new Caterham car. S2000s (and Radicals?) are tubular space frame IIRC, whereas didn't someone say this new car is some sort of box chassis?
woof said:
Yep it was mentioned well the newer B08 has
http://www.lolacars.com/racecar.asp?RaceCarId=8
I've said it was near enough identical.
Perhaps Caterham have had some input on the setup - but Lola are the experts - effectively it's a rebadged Lola B08 with a cheaper body on the same chassis with a few cosmetic tweaks.
Hmmm, I refer the honourable gentleman to the comment I made earlier.http://www.lolacars.com/racecar.asp?RaceCarId=8
I've said it was near enough identical.
Perhaps Caterham have had some input on the setup - but Lola are the experts - effectively it's a rebadged Lola B08 with a cheaper body on the same chassis with a few cosmetic tweaks.
It is not a rebadged Lola B08 with a few cosmetic tweaks.
It is a rebadged Lola B08 with 100 more horsepower and an entirely different body and chassis
A 288 GTO is rebadged 308 with a couple turbos but that didn't stop me wanting one
Chances are if this car was Caterham from the ground up, it would be even more expensive. If they have had to compromise or rebadge, it is only to allow you and I to race it. Basically it would have been to keep costs sensible.
Chances are if this car was Caterham from the ground up, it would be even more expensive. If they have had to compromise or rebadge, it is only to allow you and I to race it. Basically it would have been to keep costs sensible.
Banjo47 said:
Finchy172 said:
It looks stunning, like all CN2 derived cars. However I feel its 5 years too late.
Majority of the old CSR, R400 racers went onto VdeV in Norma's, Ligiers and Juno's which were on price comparison slightly more expensive but came with greater downforce and better transmission and paddle shift etc.
The issue is those guys left 2-5 years ago and the market for this kind of expensive track day toy is very limited now.
Its a shame they didnt go at it alone but with limited funds for devlopment and no CFD, Simulation in house Lola is a sensible choice to ensure the car has speed and reliability on circuit.
Radical have the one make race series' sewn up with the range of cars, good support, and spares support which Caterham always failed to deliver.
If its to make a successful race series then I hope caterham can support it as they should do and tempt some of the old customers back and strictly scrutinise the championship as there is large scope for modification.
For now I shall stick my series 3!
The guys that left 2 to 5 years ago went on to other things as you say - but only because Caterham had nothing else to offer at that point. The new R300 series is already massively oversubscribed and hugely popular with drivers progressing through Academy, Roadsport B, Supersports and R300. There is considerable brand loyalty amongst Caterham racers and the support is actually excellent at race meetings though Caterham Midlands. I suspect there are several R300 drivers already licking their lips at the prospect of a race series involving these cars.Majority of the old CSR, R400 racers went onto VdeV in Norma's, Ligiers and Juno's which were on price comparison slightly more expensive but came with greater downforce and better transmission and paddle shift etc.
The issue is those guys left 2-5 years ago and the market for this kind of expensive track day toy is very limited now.
Its a shame they didnt go at it alone but with limited funds for devlopment and no CFD, Simulation in house Lola is a sensible choice to ensure the car has speed and reliability on circuit.
Radical have the one make race series' sewn up with the range of cars, good support, and spares support which Caterham always failed to deliver.
If its to make a successful race series then I hope caterham can support it as they should do and tempt some of the old customers back and strictly scrutinise the championship as there is large scope for modification.
For now I shall stick my series 3!
They look absolutely stunning too - I think the Lola hook up with Caterham is an inspired move for both companies. Radical is a great product too but they cant compete with that kind of motorport hertitage.
I am sure if they drive as well as they look - and sure there will be teething problems - but to me this is a very clever and inspired move.
The lower caterham ranks are fiercely competitive and over subscribed as you say and they now finally support these as they should be supported.
Radical have been doing it for years and have a vast number of cars of all ranges racing and as trackday toys.
Its not eligible for Speed / Euro VdeV so is aimed at one make series which at 72k a car is going to need a lot of rich guys that cant find what they want in GT's or CN2.
DonkeyApple said:
You get the impression that many more people would like it if it were £25k and not £70k.
As such, it's not a problem with the car but the wallet.
To be honest, I asked the question comparing it with the Sports 2000 series for a good reason, to investigate the difference in tech between them. You get what you pay for I guess! As such, it's not a problem with the car but the wallet.
pistolp said:
I'm disappointed you're all disappointed! But it doesn't surprise me because the overwhelming vibe on these forums is always negative. Something to do with people spending too much time alone in front of their computers....!
However, I think this car looks absolutely sensational. I think it is a very brave and commendable move by Caterham. However, I also think Caterham know exactly what they are doing and so the bravery side of things isn't really an issue as I am sure they have done their homework. All I can say is thank you Caterham, because for me there was a big gap in the market and you have filled it. I doubt it will be that hard to find another 19 people who agree with me. I am going to buy one for sure and I can think of a handful of others that won't need too much persuasion. It is the perfect step up for the experienced Caterham racer who is looking to go onto another challenge.
If you look at the alternatives, there are downsides to every option. Radical make cars that break all the time and they are effectively keeping their business alive by supplying an endless stream of parts to customers. I have a freind who raced in the UK Cup Radical series and he spent the same doing that as he did racing in the Carrera Cup. It is too expensive is the general gist. They rely on their cars being unreliable.
Then you have the CN cars and Vdev/Speed series etc. Again very expensive and it isn't one make. The organisers are unknown to must of us as well. Everybody who has raced in Caterhams knows how well this is executed so it is an obvious advantage over the competition. It will also be Caterhams new baby and their premier series so it will get the treatment it deserves.
In summary it is a one make series, with a great car and run by a proper bunch of people. What is not to like?
Thank you again Caterham and see you in 2012, well see you tomorrow actually!
I wish Caterham has told us this in their press statement! What you say makes a lot of sense because it's from the perspective of someone who's actually going to buy one. Thanks for postingHowever, I think this car looks absolutely sensational. I think it is a very brave and commendable move by Caterham. However, I also think Caterham know exactly what they are doing and so the bravery side of things isn't really an issue as I am sure they have done their homework. All I can say is thank you Caterham, because for me there was a big gap in the market and you have filled it. I doubt it will be that hard to find another 19 people who agree with me. I am going to buy one for sure and I can think of a handful of others that won't need too much persuasion. It is the perfect step up for the experienced Caterham racer who is looking to go onto another challenge.
If you look at the alternatives, there are downsides to every option. Radical make cars that break all the time and they are effectively keeping their business alive by supplying an endless stream of parts to customers. I have a freind who raced in the UK Cup Radical series and he spent the same doing that as he did racing in the Carrera Cup. It is too expensive is the general gist. They rely on their cars being unreliable.
Then you have the CN cars and Vdev/Speed series etc. Again very expensive and it isn't one make. The organisers are unknown to must of us as well. Everybody who has raced in Caterhams knows how well this is executed so it is an obvious advantage over the competition. It will also be Caterhams new baby and their premier series so it will get the treatment it deserves.
In summary it is a one make series, with a great car and run by a proper bunch of people. What is not to like?
Thank you again Caterham and see you in 2012, well see you tomorrow actually!
RobM77 said:
To be honest, I asked the question comparing it with the Sports 2000 series for a good reason, to investigate the difference in tech between them. You get what you pay for I guess!
Just do the maths on what you're getting. 300+bhp, Hewland FTR, paddle shift, Pectel ecu/logging, bespoke AP brakes, air jacks, monocoque chassis never mind any development costs, CFD time etc etc. It's by far the cheapest thing of its kind on the market.sfaulds said:
RobM77 said:
To be honest, I asked the question comparing it with the Sports 2000 series for a good reason, to investigate the difference in tech between them. You get what you pay for I guess!
Just do the maths on what you're getting. 300+bhp, Hewland FTR, paddle shift, Pectel ecu/logging, bespoke AP brakes, air jacks, monocoque chassis never mind any development costs, CFD time etc etc. It's by far the cheapest thing of its kind on the market.
precisely.pistolp said:
I'm disappointed you're all disappointed! But it doesn't surprise me because the overwhelming vibe on these forums is always negative. Something to do with people spending too much time alone in front of their computers....!
However, I think this car looks absolutely sensational. I think it is a very brave and commendable move by Caterham. However, I also think Caterham know exactly what they are doing and so the bravery side of things isn't really an issue as I am sure they have done their homework. All I can say is thank you Caterham, because for me there was a big gap in the market and you have filled it. I doubt it will be that hard to find another 19 people who agree with me. I am going to buy one for sure and I can think of a handful of others that won't need too much persuasion. It is the perfect step up for the experienced Caterham racer who is looking to go onto another challenge.
If you look at the alternatives, there are downsides to every option. Radical make cars that break all the time and they are effectively keeping their business alive by supplying an endless stream of parts to customers. I have a freind who raced in the UK Cup Radical series and he spent the same doing that as he did racing in the Carrera Cup. It is too expensive is the general gist. They rely on their cars being unreliable.
Then you have the CN cars and Vdev/Speed series etc. Again very expensive and it isn't one make. The organisers are unknown to must of us as well. Everybody who has raced in Caterhams knows how well this is executed so it is an obvious advantage over the competition. It will also be Caterhams new baby and their premier series so it will get the treatment it deserves.
In summary it is a one make series, with a great car and run by a proper bunch of people. What is not to like?
Thank you again Caterham and see you in 2012, well see you tomorrow actually!
Your going to buy one?? No surprise there sunshine.!! Just do me a favour and buy one for me as well. See you tomorrow. However, I think this car looks absolutely sensational. I think it is a very brave and commendable move by Caterham. However, I also think Caterham know exactly what they are doing and so the bravery side of things isn't really an issue as I am sure they have done their homework. All I can say is thank you Caterham, because for me there was a big gap in the market and you have filled it. I doubt it will be that hard to find another 19 people who agree with me. I am going to buy one for sure and I can think of a handful of others that won't need too much persuasion. It is the perfect step up for the experienced Caterham racer who is looking to go onto another challenge.
If you look at the alternatives, there are downsides to every option. Radical make cars that break all the time and they are effectively keeping their business alive by supplying an endless stream of parts to customers. I have a freind who raced in the UK Cup Radical series and he spent the same doing that as he did racing in the Carrera Cup. It is too expensive is the general gist. They rely on their cars being unreliable.
Then you have the CN cars and Vdev/Speed series etc. Again very expensive and it isn't one make. The organisers are unknown to must of us as well. Everybody who has raced in Caterhams knows how well this is executed so it is an obvious advantage over the competition. It will also be Caterhams new baby and their premier series so it will get the treatment it deserves.
In summary it is a one make series, with a great car and run by a proper bunch of people. What is not to like?
Thank you again Caterham and see you in 2012, well see you tomorrow actually!
I think it looks the nuts, and if I can find the cash...I'd love one.
sfaulds said:
RobM77 said:
To be honest, I asked the question comparing it with the Sports 2000 series for a good reason, to investigate the difference in tech between them. You get what you pay for I guess!
Just do the maths on what you're getting. 300+bhp, Hewland FTR, paddle shift, Pectel ecu/logging, bespoke AP brakes, air jacks, monocoque chassis never mind any development costs, CFD time etc etc. It's by far the cheapest thing of its kind on the market.Pugsey said:
Hugely disappointing. All these rumours had me thinking an exciting new road car was in the wings.
Same, I've got no interest in track driving or circuit racing, rally is more my sort of thing, but I like previous Caterham cars and while the performance of this will be interesting, and it may be possible to drive it legally on the road, would you really want to? I mean, this isn't exactly the kind of car I'd want to tour say, the Lake District or the Highlands, where as a Caterham 7 of some description or even an Ariel Atom is something I could see myself enjoying on that kind of drive.Mastodon2 said:
Pugsey said:
Hugely disappointing. All these rumours had me thinking an exciting new road car was in the wings.
Same, I've got no interest in track driving or circuit racing, rally is more my sort of thing, but I like previous Caterham cars and while the performance of this will be interesting, and it may be possible to drive it legally on the road, would you really want to? I mean, this isn't exactly the kind of car I'd want to tour say, the Lake District or the Highlands, where as a Caterham 7 of some description or even an Ariel Atom is something I could see myself enjoying on that kind of drive.RobM77 said:
...obviously if circuit racing isn't your thing, then this won't appeal. It is my thing though, and I'd jump at the chance to race one of these
But is a move into the circuit racing market the right way for a company like Caterham to go, do you think?They have a well established business selling road/trackday cars. Most race car manufacturers seem to aspire to a move in the opposite direction in order to grow and gain stability?
Edited by Sam_68 on Thursday 13th January 20:30
Gassing Station | General Gassing | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff