RE: DiCaprio's Formula E team
Discussion
Max_Torque said:
The next point is that, luckily for you Matt, you are not (yet) being forced to buy and EV. You can stick your head in the ground and shout "you're all idiots" until you are blue in the face, and guess what. It' won't make the slightest difference.
No it makes a small differenceIt makes my next commuter car slightly cheaper
Thanks MATT
AnotherClarkey said:
Technomatt said:
Yep, I can just see the Renault ZOE racing series shaping up right now......
A 4 lap quali session, then an 8 hour wait for a battery recharge followed by a 5 lap race at an average speed of 50 mph before the batteries expire.
Maybe they should just go for an endurance race and see who can creep round the circuit the longest and most efficiently. It would drive the spectators crazy with excitement.
I feel sorry for you. It must be miserable going through life with such a limited imagination and negative outlook.A 4 lap quali session, then an 8 hour wait for a battery recharge followed by a 5 lap race at an average speed of 50 mph before the batteries expire.
Maybe they should just go for an endurance race and see who can creep round the circuit the longest and most efficiently. It would drive the spectators crazy with excitement.
To cheer you up, here is a link to a formula where electric vehicles are making significant progress:
http://www.formulastudent.com/formula-student/news...
Edited by AnotherClarkey on Thursday 12th December 14:24
Technomatt said:
AnotherClarkey said:
Technomatt said:
Yep, I can just see the Renault ZOE racing series shaping up right now......
A 4 lap quali session, then an 8 hour wait for a battery recharge followed by a 5 lap race at an average speed of 50 mph before the batteries expire.
Maybe they should just go for an endurance race and see who can creep round the circuit the longest and most efficiently. It would drive the spectators crazy with excitement.
I feel sorry for you. It must be miserable going through life with such a limited imagination and negative outlook.A 4 lap quali session, then an 8 hour wait for a battery recharge followed by a 5 lap race at an average speed of 50 mph before the batteries expire.
Maybe they should just go for an endurance race and see who can creep round the circuit the longest and most efficiently. It would drive the spectators crazy with excitement.
To cheer you up, here is a link to a formula where electric vehicles are making significant progress:
http://www.formulastudent.com/formula-student/news...
Edited by AnotherClarkey on Thursday 12th December 14:24
I'm sure you could knock this up in your lunchbreak eh?
;-)
Max_Torque said:
All those "cost" issues you have pointed out^^^, and they are only issues if you can't afford it, are due to low volumes. There is no fundamental "cost" issue with EVs. In fact, quite the opposite. In a recent study i did for a major UK manufacture, the BOM cost for an specifically developed EV was approx 2/3 of there conventional engined varient. And further to that, the development, validation and durability program cost / scope required to get that EV variant into production was less than 50% of the ICE engined variant.
Hence my point. You said "EV's are more expensive to make", I said (and a £180k study backs up my findings) that they aren't. Hence i wondered what your source was for your statement?
Consumers are only concerned with the final ticket price, depreciation, running costs and what the product will provide to meet their lifestyles. Majority EV failure.Hence my point. You said "EV's are more expensive to make", I said (and a £180k study backs up my findings) that they aren't. Hence i wondered what your source was for your statement?
Just like all your efficiency ratios, ultimately any individual bit of individual component analysis is irrelevant in the showroom.
Max_Torque said:
The problem with you anti-EV argument seems to be that it is entirely based on "early stage" adoption limitiations (and erroneous knowledge from Google and the like). With relatively expensive purchase price, and potentially poor residuals, that is too be expected. BUT the game is changing, and it's changing fast. Companies like Toyota, BMW, Mercedes, Porsche etc do not invest millions of dollars into things just for fun.
Just for your information Toyota don’t produce an EV. No market they say. Clever chaps. The game is changing and favouring Hybrids and REX. Also, you will now see a huge market increase in sales of ICE powered SUVs. The public don’t dance to your expected tune. Right now you wouldn’t expect this person to swop this:
For this:
The equivalent of asking a flexible 600 mile range, lightweight, low cost derv owner to shift into a heavy, short range, expensive EV.
Max_Torque said:
15 years ago, the first generation of the modern "high performance" diesel engines arrived on the market, and people said "why would you ever want one of those". A quick perusal of sales volumes in europe tells you that that was an incorrect assumption (and the resale value of all those petrol engined cars)
The early diesel engine was instantly competitive in the market place compared to petrol. Poor analogy.Max_Torque said:
10 years ago, Toyota released the Prius. People once again said it'll never catch on. Well, check out the sales volumes for the prius, and it's residuals
The Prius is a Hybrid not an EV (as per the thread discussion) 
That’s why it’s popular.Max_Torque said:
5 years ago (nearly) the first production pure EV's became available to another round of "you'd have to be mad to buy one" shouts. Well, it's too early to tell if that's the case, but the evidence based on current OEM investments in EV tech suggests they are here to stay.
Here to stay but as an overall niche folly and only surviving on subsidies, grants and legislation. Max_Torque said:
So my final point (and question) is that, luckily for you Matt, you are not (yet) being forced to buy and EV. You can stick your head in the ground and shout "you're all idiots" until you are blue in the face, and guess what. It' won't make the slightest difference.
I’m afraid your intimation that the EV will win the day regardless is very misplaced and not in line with real life current sales, always a great leveller.Of course any negativity or challenges to statements such as ‘maintenance free EVs’ when there is a Renault ZOE circa £1080 per year ‘Battery maintenance/warranty’ is conveniently ignored by yourself.
The jury is out, but the final verdict on EVs is not shaping up well. Your enthusiasm for the concept and detailed component performance data is evident but ignore the actual real market sales feedback at your peril. It's the bottom line.
AnotherClarkey said:
More scratching around in the depths of the net. First an obscure school boy electric racing car, now a California only bespoke Toyota.
Technomatt said:
More scratching around in the depths of the net.
First an obscure school boy electric racing car, now a California only bespoke Toyota.
Formula Student isn't that obscure if you have any interest in motorsport (which this thread is about) or engineering. Ross Brawn supports it which lends quite a bit of credibility in my view.First an obscure school boy electric racing car, now a California only bespoke Toyota.
As for the Rav 4 electric you said that Toyota don't make and EV. They do, you were wrong. Rather than the depths of the internet I found it merely by typing 'toyota rav 4 electric' into google.
Max_Torque said:
Technomatt said:
That's a race series for students and kids.
Whom i'm going to guess are all a lot smarter than you!I'm sure you could knock this up in your lunchbreak eh?
;-)
4 wheel drive with 4 motors giving very silly torque vectoring abilities
Technomatt said:
More scratching around in the depths of the net.
First an obscure school boy electric racing car, now a California only bespoke Toyota.
But you did state categorically in one of your more recent 'claims' that Toyota weren't making or going to make EVs. First an obscure school boy electric racing car, now a California only bespoke Toyota.
In fact, it seemed to form the backbone of one of your many politically motivated rants about why EVs have no future.
DonkeyApple said:
Technomatt said:
More scratching around in the depths of the net.
First an obscure school boy electric racing car, now a California only bespoke Toyota.
But you did state categorically in one of your more recent 'claims' that Toyota weren't making or going to make EVs. First an obscure school boy electric racing car, now a California only bespoke Toyota.
In fact, it seemed to form the backbone of one of your many politically motivated rants about why EVs have no future.
A one-off bespoke vehicle only available in Califonia?
World domination awaits.
More scratching around for a bit of point scoring.
Gassing Station | General Gassing | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff