Why is the Lotus Esprit not appreciating in value??
Discussion
Impasse said:
Oh yes. 
Did he show you his engine conversion? (Not a euphamism...
)
We did talk a lot about the engine, and his plans etc. I think i remember twin turbo being mentioned but my memory is terrible! Did he show you his engine conversion? (Not a euphamism...
)
Has he made any progress on the bodywork?And I think they are my favourite wheels on any car.
Any more pics or vids?
and cheaper to run.
I too loved the Esprit growing up, particularly the early Turbo cars. Remember seeing an article in Performance Car circa 1989 written I think by Mark Hales testing the Esprit against the Corvette ZR1 and one other which I can't remember. For me at the time, it was all about the Lotus...
SidewaysSi said:
I too loved the Esprit growing up, particularly the early Turbo cars. Remember seeing an article in Performance Car circa 1989 written I think by Mark Hales testing the Esprit against the Corvette ZR1 and one other which I can't remember. For me at the time, it was all about the Lotus...
You're not thinking of the Audi Quattro are you? That was in Fast Lane mag, a tour through Frances m said:
SidewaysSi said:
I too loved the Esprit growing up, particularly the early Turbo cars. Remember seeing an article in Performance Car circa 1989 written I think by Mark Hales testing the Esprit against the Corvette ZR1 and one other which I can't remember. For me at the time, it was all about the Lotus...
You're not thinking of the Audi Quattro are you? That was in Fast Lane mag, a tour through Francekiseca said:
s m said:
SidewaysSi said:
I too loved the Esprit growing up, particularly the early Turbo cars. Remember seeing an article in Performance Car circa 1989 written I think by Mark Hales testing the Esprit against the Corvette ZR1 and one other which I can't remember. For me at the time, it was all about the Lotus...
You're not thinking of the Audi Quattro are you? That was in Fast Lane mag, a tour through FrancePiers_K said:
Iirc, Chapman wanted the 'duck tail' spoiler on the back of the earlier turbo cars but when they drove the prototype they found it ruined the handling. Chapman wouldn't let the engineers get rid of it, so they added in the little flick spoiler on the back of the roof to stop the air flow hitting the large spoiler, there by canceling out its negative effect.
I love the earlier turbo cars, the engine may be gruff, but it certainly has character, and as a 40 year old, 6ft, 14+ stone driver I have no problems with the seating, getting in out etc...
There seems to be a lot of love for it too, going by the reaction and comments when driving one.
I love that story, I was reading more about it last night actually. I was always told that the rear ducktail was 'useless'. It turns out it was actually too effective! It made a tiny amount of downforce (-1lb) in the wind tunnel. This was only a problem because lift at the front was measured at 29lb (a big reduction from the S2's was 58lb!). Therefore to aerodynamically balance the car, the lip on the roof was added to stall the rear ducktail, resulting in a 26lb of lift at the rear (again half the rear end lift of an S2). Of course the fix would have been to add a bigger front spoiler. They actually tried this, the original Giugiaro prototype had one but there were issues with ground clearance.I love the earlier turbo cars, the engine may be gruff, but it certainly has character, and as a 40 year old, 6ft, 14+ stone driver I have no problems with the seating, getting in out etc...
There seems to be a lot of love for it too, going by the reaction and comments when driving one.
It's all in the Jeremy Walton book.
Incedentally, the dry sump cars definitely ride lower than the later cars, having recently seen them side by side. It's very easy to ground the nose on a dry sump car as it is, a lower chin spoiler would have taken a real beating!
s m said:
Yes, it wasn't a ZR1 as you say - I thought the Esprit was red? Or was that just the one they used for the lappery/cornering shot ( on three wheels! ) at Castle Combe?
I think you're right, the one used for the track shot was a different colour and had the front wheel dangling in the air!I think also the Quattro was not quite black but a very dark metallic grey (or could have been metallic black and just looked grey in the photos)
The Pits said:
I love that story, I was reading more about it last night actually. I was always told that the rear ducktail was 'useless'. It turns out it was actually too effective!
I read it in an old Evo mag. They had a feature on old Vs new, pitting the original turbo Esprit against an Exige (with the obvious outcome...)There was a side panel with an 'interview' with (again Iirc) Kershaw Snr and Jr both of whom have tested / sorted lotus ride and handling. Snr mentioned it there.
With regard to prices, I understand a yellow S1 sold for 50k to a well know petrolhead...
MC Bodge said:
from my youth:
The promising loading screen (yes, the huge <48k game took a few minutes to load from cassette) led to, er, this:
Oh well, it was ok at the time...
Loved that game! I really liked the fact you could indicate. What a classic.The promising loading screen (yes, the huge <48k game took a few minutes to load from cassette) led to, er, this:
Oh well, it was ok at the time...
As for the Esprit's.My bro worked for Frosts back in the early 90's and often had an SE Esprit or Elan which was new or Lotus Carlton. He picked me up from Heathrow in a red SE and I don't think I've ever been quite so excited. My word was it quick!!
Whether a Turbo Esprit was five miles an hour faster or slower than a 911SC or a 308GTS back in 1983 is pretty irrelevant these days.
The performance of most old exotics is now eclipsed by lots of mundane modern cars.
What remains is their sense of occasion. The feeling that you are driving something pretty special. The visceral pleasures that modern cars have lost behind their sophisticated management and safety systems.
Early Esprits are uncomfortable, harsh and fragile. They are not particularly pleasant to drive and they are awkward to work on.
But that doesn't matter to me. It is not a daily driver.
Unlike an old Ferrari, the bodywork will never rot. Neither will the chassis.
The engine may not be terribly sophisticated, but it is pretty robust. And in the unlikely event of a catastrophic failure, there are plenty of affordable replacement units available.
And whilst Esprits are a sod to work on, they are not complicated vehicles. If you know how to use a spanner then most jobs are straightforward, albeit time consuming.
I would rather fettle a recalcitrant headlamp motor or a sloppy gear linkage than have to deal with corrosion. So the Esprit makes a fairly sensible proposition for the classic car owner.
I am really prejudiced, because I am a Lotus enthusiast. I remember Colin Chapman's successes in motor racing. I grew up in the 1970s when the JPS Lotus 72 was dominant in F1. Patrick McGoohan drove a Seven. Emma Peel drove an Elan. Tara King drove a Europa and James Bond drove an Esprit.
Lotus cars were the epitome of style. I remember those glory days. To me the marque was as magnificent as Ferrari.
With the very best Elans now fetching £40,000 and with Climax Elites approaching £100,000, it seems to me that the classic car market is capable of appreciating old Lotus cars.
So I am sure that Giugiaro Esprits will have their day. After all, their fragility and impracticality are far more forgivable in a cherished classic than when their original owners tried to use them every day.
I don't really care whether my Esprit is worth a half, or a mere quarter of a 308. I love the fact that it is a big wedge of 1970s cheese. I love the pop up lamps, the tasteless decals and the tart's boudoir lurking inside.
Even the Rover 3500 rear lamps and the flappy Marina door handles no longer offend me, because there are no Marinas or Rovers left to make the parts bin engineering quite so obvious.
It is a really daft old car, but I love it. And so, it seems does everyone who sees it.
Happy days.
The performance of most old exotics is now eclipsed by lots of mundane modern cars.
What remains is their sense of occasion. The feeling that you are driving something pretty special. The visceral pleasures that modern cars have lost behind their sophisticated management and safety systems.
Early Esprits are uncomfortable, harsh and fragile. They are not particularly pleasant to drive and they are awkward to work on.
But that doesn't matter to me. It is not a daily driver.
Unlike an old Ferrari, the bodywork will never rot. Neither will the chassis.
The engine may not be terribly sophisticated, but it is pretty robust. And in the unlikely event of a catastrophic failure, there are plenty of affordable replacement units available.
And whilst Esprits are a sod to work on, they are not complicated vehicles. If you know how to use a spanner then most jobs are straightforward, albeit time consuming.
I would rather fettle a recalcitrant headlamp motor or a sloppy gear linkage than have to deal with corrosion. So the Esprit makes a fairly sensible proposition for the classic car owner.
I am really prejudiced, because I am a Lotus enthusiast. I remember Colin Chapman's successes in motor racing. I grew up in the 1970s when the JPS Lotus 72 was dominant in F1. Patrick McGoohan drove a Seven. Emma Peel drove an Elan. Tara King drove a Europa and James Bond drove an Esprit.
Lotus cars were the epitome of style. I remember those glory days. To me the marque was as magnificent as Ferrari.
With the very best Elans now fetching £40,000 and with Climax Elites approaching £100,000, it seems to me that the classic car market is capable of appreciating old Lotus cars.
So I am sure that Giugiaro Esprits will have their day. After all, their fragility and impracticality are far more forgivable in a cherished classic than when their original owners tried to use them every day.
I don't really care whether my Esprit is worth a half, or a mere quarter of a 308. I love the fact that it is a big wedge of 1970s cheese. I love the pop up lamps, the tasteless decals and the tart's boudoir lurking inside.
Even the Rover 3500 rear lamps and the flappy Marina door handles no longer offend me, because there are no Marinas or Rovers left to make the parts bin engineering quite so obvious.
It is a really daft old car, but I love it. And so, it seems does everyone who sees it.
Happy days.
Pat H said:
Whether a Turbo Esprit was five miles an hour faster or slower than a 911SC or a 308GTS back in 1983 is pretty irrelevant these days.
The performance of most old exotics is now eclipsed by lots of mundane modern cars.
What remains is their sense of occasion. The feeling that you are driving something pretty special. The visceral pleasures that modern cars have lost behind their sophisticated management and safety systems.
Early Esprits are uncomfortable, harsh and fragile. They are not particularly pleasant to drive and they are awkward to work on.
But that doesn't matter to me. It is not a daily driver.
Unlike an old Ferrari, the bodywork will never rot. Neither will the chassis.
The engine may not be terribly sophisticated, but it is pretty robust. And in the unlikely event of a catastrophic failure, there are plenty of affordable replacement units available.
And whilst Esprits are a sod to work on, they are not complicated vehicles. If you know how to use a spanner then most jobs are straightforward, albeit time consuming.
I would rather fettle a recalcitrant headlamp motor or a sloppy gear linkage than have to deal with corrosion. So the Esprit makes a fairly sensible proposition for the classic car owner.
I am really prejudiced, because I am a Lotus enthusiast. I remember Colin Chapman's successes in motor racing. I grew up in the 1970s when the JPS Lotus 72 was dominant in F1. Patrick McGoohan drove a Seven. Emma Peel drove an Elan. Tara King drove a Europa and James Bond drove an Esprit.
Lotus cars were the epitome of style. I remember those glory days. To me the marque was as magnificent as Ferrari.
With the very best Elans now fetching £40,000 and with Climax Elites approaching £100,000, it seems to me that the classic car market is capable of appreciating old Lotus cars.
So I am sure that Giugiaro Esprits will have their day. After all, their fragility and impracticality are far more forgivable in a cherished classic than when their original owners tried to use them every day.
I don't really care whether my Esprit is worth a half, or a mere quarter of a 308. I love the fact that it is a big wedge of 1970s cheese. I love the pop up lamps, the tasteless decals and the tart's boudoir lurking inside.
Even the Rover 3500 rear lamps and the flappy Marina door handles no longer offend me, because there are no Marinas or Rovers left to make the parts bin engineering quite so obvious.
It is a really daft old car, but I love it. And so, it seems does everyone who sees it.
Happy days.
Good post, and your Esprit is stunning The performance of most old exotics is now eclipsed by lots of mundane modern cars.
What remains is their sense of occasion. The feeling that you are driving something pretty special. The visceral pleasures that modern cars have lost behind their sophisticated management and safety systems.
Early Esprits are uncomfortable, harsh and fragile. They are not particularly pleasant to drive and they are awkward to work on.
But that doesn't matter to me. It is not a daily driver.
Unlike an old Ferrari, the bodywork will never rot. Neither will the chassis.
The engine may not be terribly sophisticated, but it is pretty robust. And in the unlikely event of a catastrophic failure, there are plenty of affordable replacement units available.
And whilst Esprits are a sod to work on, they are not complicated vehicles. If you know how to use a spanner then most jobs are straightforward, albeit time consuming.
I would rather fettle a recalcitrant headlamp motor or a sloppy gear linkage than have to deal with corrosion. So the Esprit makes a fairly sensible proposition for the classic car owner.
I am really prejudiced, because I am a Lotus enthusiast. I remember Colin Chapman's successes in motor racing. I grew up in the 1970s when the JPS Lotus 72 was dominant in F1. Patrick McGoohan drove a Seven. Emma Peel drove an Elan. Tara King drove a Europa and James Bond drove an Esprit.
Lotus cars were the epitome of style. I remember those glory days. To me the marque was as magnificent as Ferrari.
With the very best Elans now fetching £40,000 and with Climax Elites approaching £100,000, it seems to me that the classic car market is capable of appreciating old Lotus cars.
So I am sure that Giugiaro Esprits will have their day. After all, their fragility and impracticality are far more forgivable in a cherished classic than when their original owners tried to use them every day.
I don't really care whether my Esprit is worth a half, or a mere quarter of a 308. I love the fact that it is a big wedge of 1970s cheese. I love the pop up lamps, the tasteless decals and the tart's boudoir lurking inside.
Even the Rover 3500 rear lamps and the flappy Marina door handles no longer offend me, because there are no Marinas or Rovers left to make the parts bin engineering quite so obvious.
It is a really daft old car, but I love it. And so, it seems does everyone who sees it.
Happy days.
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