TVR Sagaris Or Nissan GTR...

[sleep envy]

Poledriver said:

Are we keeping you awake?

more likely having the temerity to hold a difference of opinion and not believing every printed word in Evo as Gospel is making him weary of having to C&P the same tired posts

[Trommel]

sleep envy said:

more likely having the temerity to hold a difference of opinion and not believing every printed word in Evo as Gospel is making him weary of having to C&P the same tired posts

More than capable of forming my own opinions, clearly not something the majority of people who post here are able to do.

[blindswelledrat]

You and I have bizarrely different tastes in cars I think SE.
I cant comprehend how anyone can claim that the GTR is dull to drive.
It doesnt make any sense to me.

[sleep envy]

blindswelledrat said:

You and I have bizarrely different tastes in cars I think SE.
I cant comprehend how anyone can claim that the GTR is dull to drive.
It doesnt make any sense to me.

maybe I do

then again I've found every 911 turbo I've driven dull

sure, they're very fast but they offer little in the way of interaction unless the conditions are really poor that you can get some big slip angles and muck around with it

Edited by sleep envy on Monday 18th January 13:53

[RobM77]

900T-R said:

RobM77 said:

I can't see it adding much to the purchase cost of a car like the Sagaris to get a professional chassis guru (there are plenty out with good CVs working freelance) to sort the suspension,

Um, John Miles not good enough for you? There was nowt wrong with the Sagaris' set up - it's just that the last cars tended to get cobbled together from whatever was laying around on the shop floor when everything was starting to go pear shaped at Bristol Avenue...

Sorry, operative word italicised in my post there I meant the rest of the TVR range. I believe the Sagaris was finally sorted. I only had a brief passenger ride in one on public roads but it felt great to me.

Point taken though, I think the first thing TVR needed to sort out was their quality control and parts supply.

[900T-R]

blindswelledrat said:

You and I have bizarrely different tastes in cars I think SE.
I cant comprehend how anyone can claim that the GTR is dull to drive.
It doesnt make any sense to me.

How often do you find yourself being truly absorbed and involved on the road within or within spitting distance of the law?

Edited by 900T-R on Monday 18th January 13:53

[sleep envy]

Trommel said:

sleep envy said:

more likely having the temerity to hold a difference of opinion and not believing every printed word in Evo as Gospel is making him weary of having to C&P the same tired posts

More than capable of forming my own opinions, clearly not something the majority of people who post here are able to do.

you mean they're not capable unless they form an opinion that falls in line with yours?

[Zippee]

Trommel said:

sleep envy said:

more likely having the temerity to hold a difference of opinion and not believing every printed word in Evo as Gospel is making him weary of having to C&P the same tired posts

More than capable of forming my own opinions, clearly not something the majority of people who post here are able to do.

What more do you want? I mentioned in my previous posts I'd formed my own opinions based on what I've seen of the GTR and the Sagaris, it could be the best drivers car in the world and I'd still not want one!

Sleep envy on the other hand has driven one and formed his own opinion again differing from yours. Is it the fact other people are able to make their own minds up rather than conform to your very narrow minded views about the car that you don't like? You appear to love the car - fair enough. Others don't for their own reasons - deal with it!

[Trommel]

sleep envy said:

you mean they're not capable unless they form an opinion that falls in line with yours?

It doesn't bother me that much when people are wrong, if that's what you mean.

[sleep envy]

Trommel said:

sleep envy said:

you mean they're not capable unless they form an opinion that falls in line with yours?

It doesn't bother me that much when people are wrong, if that's what you mean.

the word according to Trommel

maybe if you approached Emap you could publish your own fanzine - you'd blow the current ABC figures out of the water

[declasm]

Why not mix the two ideas together and get something like this?

http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/1270615.htm

(a lairy 900bhp RB engined RX-7!)

[lazyitus]

Trommel said:

jamie g said:

The sagaris is a 4 year old car now and still gets more votes. In 4 years the current gtr will not be so highly thought of and will be taken for what it is and not what it does.

Yawn.

Trommel said:

sleep envy said:

I have and I'd agree that it is dull

Evo can think what they like, they don't always get it right - Clio 172 and Focus RS Mk 1 spring straight to mind

Yawn.

Why bother posting?

[blindswelledrat]

900T-R said:

blindswelledrat said:

You and I have bizarrely different tastes in cars I think SE.
I cant comprehend how anyone can claim that the GTR is dull to drive.
It doesnt make any sense to me.

How often do you find yourself being truly absorbed and involved on the road within or within spitting distance of the law?

]

Ah, but that is an argument for having a st old car that doesn't handle very well over a new well made car.
That applies to almost any modern performance car of any type and is by no means applicable to a GTR over any other decent car.
On a track I think I got more adrenaline from a GTR than many theoretically better 'drivers' cars (assuming you were referring to the GT-R when I had it).

[sleep envy]

blindswelledrat said:

On a track I think I got more adrenaline from a GTR than many theoretically better 'drivers' cars (assuming you were referring to the GT-R when I had it).

why's that (genuinely interested)? what was it that 'did it for you'?

ps - you've sold it already??

[blindswelledrat]

sleep envy said:

maybe I do

then again I've found every 911 turbo I've driven dull

sure, they're very fast but they offer little in the way of interaction unless the conditions are really poor that you can get some big slip angles and muck around with it

I think the difference between you and I (and Carrera2 who has your point of view about his Turbo) is that I prefer to be scared by a car and you prefer to be at one with it.
The GTR scares the st out of me. 911 Turbos do the same and thats why I like them.
Yet to own a TVR but I suspect I will love them.

[blindswelledrat]

sleep envy said:

blindswelledrat said:

On a track I think I got more adrenaline from a GTR than many theoretically better 'drivers' cars (assuming you were referring to the GT-R when I had it).

why's that (genuinely interested)? what was it that 'did it for you'?

ps - you've sold it already??

Yes-you knew that. I bought a c4.
Explained above if that answers your question

[Carfiend]

And bought a TVR!

[sleep envy]

blindswelledrat said:

I think the difference between you and I (and Carrera2 who has your point of view about his Turbo) is that I prefer to be scared by a car and you prefer to be at one with it.

pretty much agree with that

blindswelledrat said:

Yes-you knew that. I bought a c4.

sorry my nistake, I thought you were running both together

[DJC]

The bottom line is that the GT-R simply doesnt flick the buttons like a Sagaris does in a majority of folks sampled on this forum.


When you are spending £30-£60k it is only partly about the objective abilities of motorcars. The rest is entirely subjective about how the cars make you feel. That is individual to everybody and the amount of value placed on the subjective aspect of the purchase varies with each different evaluation by different folks.

What is obvious from this thread is that a majority of folk value the subjective aspect of what a Sagaris brings to the table over the objective ability of the GT-R. That is neither a right answer nor a wrong answer, its just individual taste.

The trouble for the GT-R is in all the areas that it scores 10/10, the Sagaris scores 8 or 9 and in the real world, in those areas anything past 7 on the public road puts you well into big accident/licence bye bye territory. So it makes those last 2 or 3 marks out of 10 damn near irrelevent for 99.5% of the time for 99% of the drivers. Those areas were the GT-R scores less well than the Sagaris or rather the Sagaris scores 10 or 11/10, the GT-R doesnt even approach 7. It *does* look dull, it *is* a big heavy car, it *does* have a boring interior, it *doesnt* have the road presence of a Sagaris. They are all subjective areas where the Sag is scoring 10 or 11 and the GT-R is scoring 4 or 5 at best.

That is how people are scoring it, whether one likes it or likes it not. Not to mention a Sag is now £20k cheaper than a GT-R.

[RobM77]

sleep envy said:

blindswelledrat said:

On a track I think I got more adrenaline from a GTR than many theoretically better 'drivers' cars (assuming you were referring to the GT-R when I had it).

why's that (genuinely interested)? what was it that 'did it for you'?

ps - you've sold it already??

To be honest, "adrenaline" is something very different to what we're talking about, specifically different to what blindswelledrat is talking about with regard to "driver's" cars. A "driver's car" is a car that talks to the driver constantly, that has controls which are a pleasure to operate, examples are the Lotus Elise, Caterham 7 and I expect the Evora (which I haven't driven yet). "Adrenaline" on the other hand is something you get from skeleton bob sled, base jumping or perhaps riding a fast superbike.