Golf Mk7 - Sweetspot for price, spec, performance?
Discussion
nickfrog said:
Blown2CV said:
it's weird isn't it. If the thing that you have 'bought' at the end somehow represented a decent return on investment then i could understand it, however it doesn't. It's depreciated considerably, so cars are a wonderfully poor investment... what's to be gained from owning?
It depreciates whether you own it or not, that makes no difference. I am yet to find a lease deal that costs less than depreciation but maybe I have been unlucky. Or very lucky.The other thing is : how do you track a lease car ?
BMWE34FAN said:
I just can't gel with the MK7, the MK6 was definitely the best looking. The 7 looks ok in the top trims. Also I'm not a fan of the 7 interior, too much fake metal effect plastic, again the MK6 looked classier.
Agreed. In particular, the LED rear lights available for the Mk6 were fantastic - real shame they moved away from that style.Although... The Mk7 GTD, GTI and R do look especially aggressive from the front profile.
Yep the MK7 GTD, GTI AND R look great, it's just the rest look frumpy. Its a shame, I've always loved the Golf. VW styling is on a low at the moment, especially the new Passat. The estate looks identical to the MK7 Golf estate. I remember when the 2005? Passat came out, it was so different and luxurious compared to the old models it was actually desirable.
I can foresee where the OP will finally end up....quite possibly the decision was made moments before fingers hit keyboard but it makes for another lively discussion about Golf "Arse".
The lease deals are interesting and the example of £204pcm barely believable. Are you tied down to a specified annual mileage meaning a financial spanking when you hand the car in (assuming you havent been to see your local "mileage correction specialist hum um, you know who you are,yes you) and is there some 4 figure up front deposit or 3 months advance to be taken into account there?
I take it those are headline grabbing prices pcm Excluding VAT?
still £250 pcm seems very good just remember to keep the actual cost per month real. Before VAT they all look good.
To the uninitiated maybe a slightly more or beyter explained lease deal would win this sub debate? Is it a personal lease or do only companies get the better lease deals? Thats not been mentioned.
The lease deals are interesting and the example of £204pcm barely believable. Are you tied down to a specified annual mileage meaning a financial spanking when you hand the car in (assuming you havent been to see your local "mileage correction specialist hum um, you know who you are,yes you) and is there some 4 figure up front deposit or 3 months advance to be taken into account there?
I take it those are headline grabbing prices pcm Excluding VAT?
still £250 pcm seems very good just remember to keep the actual cost per month real. Before VAT they all look good.To the uninitiated maybe a slightly more or beyter explained lease deal would win this sub debate? Is it a personal lease or do only companies get the better lease deals? Thats not been mentioned.
Edited by ToothbrushMan on Friday 10th October 07:17
JQ said:
nickfrog said:
Blown2CV said:
it's weird isn't it. If the thing that you have 'bought' at the end somehow represented a decent return on investment then i could understand it, however it doesn't. It's depreciated considerably, so cars are a wonderfully poor investment... what's to be gained from owning?
It depreciates whether you own it or not, that makes no difference. I am yet to find a lease deal that costs less than depreciation but maybe I have been unlucky. Or very lucky.The other thing is : how do you track a lease car ?
BMWE34FAN said:
I just can't gel with the MK7, the MK6 was definitely the best looking. The 7 looks ok in the top trims. Also I'm not a fan of the 7 interior, too much fake metal effect plastic, again the MK6 looked classier.
this is a thread about the top trim though. The seats are a high point for me, half alcantara and very 'figure hugging' The interior is light years ahead in quality compared to the XF Portfolio I came out of.
excess mileage charges are very variable; anything between 7ppm and 40ppm, however they don't seem to bear any relation the cost of the lease and it's not something brokers normally shout about, and i don't think they have to show it anywhere apart from the contract either. If you ask them they presumably have to tell you though, if they want you to sign up.
JQ said:
nickfrog said:
Blown2CV said:
it's weird isn't it. If the thing that you have 'bought' at the end somehow represented a decent return on investment then i could understand it, however it doesn't. It's depreciated considerably, so cars are a wonderfully poor investment... what's to be gained from owning?
It depreciates whether you own it or not, that makes no difference. I am yet to find a lease deal that costs less than depreciation but maybe I have been unlucky. Or very lucky.The other thing is : how do you track a lease car ?
nickfrog said:
JQ said:
nickfrog said:
Blown2CV said:
it's weird isn't it. If the thing that you have 'bought' at the end somehow represented a decent return on investment then i could understand it, however it doesn't. It's depreciated considerably, so cars are a wonderfully poor investment... what's to be gained from owning?
It depreciates whether you own it or not, that makes no difference. I am yet to find a lease deal that costs less than depreciation but maybe I have been unlucky. Or very lucky.The other thing is : how do you track a lease car ?
edited to add - I'm not trying to be an arse, I'm genuinely interested as I'm planning on getting one, and if it's cheaper to buy than the lease deals currently being offered then I will change my plans.
Edited by JQ on Friday 10th October 14:44
JQ said:
nickfrog said:
JQ said:
nickfrog said:
Blown2CV said:
it's weird isn't it. If the thing that you have 'bought' at the end somehow represented a decent return on investment then i could understand it, however it doesn't. It's depreciated considerably, so cars are a wonderfully poor investment... what's to be gained from owning?
It depreciates whether you own it or not, that makes no difference. I am yet to find a lease deal that costs less than depreciation but maybe I have been unlucky. Or very lucky.The other thing is : how do you track a lease car ?
edited to add - I'm not trying to be an arse, I'm genuinely interested as I'm planning on getting one, and if it's cheaper to buy than the lease deals currently being offered then I will change my plans.
Edited by JQ on Friday 10th October 14:44
ks - it is largely guesswork!I assume the following:-
(1) A cash purchase price of £27k (manual lists at £30k).
(2) Value of the car after 2 years and 20k miles...um...no more than £20k.
(3) If you dont buy the car outright, you earn interest on the capital (or avoid paying interest because of lower borrowing).
If that is right, the lease is very probably cheaper.
ToothbrushMan said:
I can foresee where the OP will finally end up....quite possibly the decision was made moments before fingers hit keyboard but it makes for another lively discussion about Golf "Arse".
Ended up coming very close to having a Lexus CT actually 
I'll probably keep my Freelander 2 over the winter since I'm not 100% convinced by either.ORD said:
JQ said:
nickfrog said:
JQ said:
nickfrog said:
Blown2CV said:
it's weird isn't it. If the thing that you have 'bought' at the end somehow represented a decent return on investment then i could understand it, however it doesn't. It's depreciated considerably, so cars are a wonderfully poor investment... what's to be gained from owning?
It depreciates whether you own it or not, that makes no difference. I am yet to find a lease deal that costs less than depreciation but maybe I have been unlucky. Or very lucky.The other thing is : how do you track a lease car ?
edited to add - I'm not trying to be an arse, I'm genuinely interested as I'm planning on getting one, and if it's cheaper to buy than the lease deals currently being offered then I will change my plans.
Edited by JQ on Friday 10th October 14:44
ks - it is largely guesswork!I assume the following:-
(1) A cash purchase price of £27k (manual lists at £30k).
(2) Value of the car after 2 years and 20k miles...um...no more than £20k.
(3) If you dont buy the car outright, you earn interest on the capital (or avoid paying interest because of lower borrowing).
If that is right, the lease is very probably cheaper.
How do we know it's £280 ? It was £205 last time. We need a link to the deal. What's the mileage ?
£20K residuals . Maybe. Maybe not.
Interest : we need to compare at equal exposure to risk. In other words cash ISA at £15k per year if one hasn't used up their allowance. Very low return that won't even match inflation, even at 0% tax. Much worse at 20% or 40%. So it's actually an erosion of capital, not an opportunity cost.
Not as obvious as one would assume...My assumption is that there is nothing in it. Happy to be wrong though.
Edited by nickfrog on Friday 10th October 18:35
nickfrog said:
Fair enough. 3 points :
How do we know it's £280 ? It was £205 last time. We need a link to the deal. What's the mileage ?
£20K residuals . Maybe. Maybe not.
Interest : we need to compare at equal exposure to risk. In other words cash ISA at £15k per year if one hasn't used up their allowance. Very low return that won't even match inflation, even at 0% tax. Much worse at 20% or 40%. So it's actually an erosion of capital, not an opportunity cost.
Not as obvious as one would assume...My assumption is that there is nothing in it. Happy to be wrong though.
Erosion of capital? What are you smoking? How do we know it's £280 ? It was £205 last time. We need a link to the deal. What's the mileage ?
£20K residuals . Maybe. Maybe not.
Interest : we need to compare at equal exposure to risk. In other words cash ISA at £15k per year if one hasn't used up their allowance. Very low return that won't even match inflation, even at 0% tax. Much worse at 20% or 40%. So it's actually an erosion of capital, not an opportunity cost.
Not as obvious as one would assume...My assumption is that there is nothing in it. Happy to be wrong though.
Edited by nickfrog on Friday 10th October 18:35
We're comparing how much money is in your pocket 2 years down the line. The capital in the car 'erodes' just as much as that in a bank account but doesn't earn interest. The interest is therefore a relative benefit.
In my case, all cash is worth 3,5% to me because it offsets my mortgage. Accordingly, a lease would be cheaper by the amount I 'earn' on the capital over the 2 years, which wouldn't be a small amount.
nickfrog said:
Fair enough. 3 points :
How do we know it's £280 ? It was £205 last time. We need a link to the deal. What's the mileage ?
£20K residuals . Maybe. Maybe not.
Interest : we need to compare at equal exposure to risk. In other words cash ISA at £15k per year if one hasn't used up their allowance. Very low return that won't even match inflation, even at 0% tax. Much worse at 20% or 40%. So it's actually an erosion of capital, not an opportunity cost.
Not as obvious as one would assume...My assumption is that there is nothing in it. Happy to be wrong though.
£280pcm is what it costs in totality, here's the link: http://www.freedomcontracts.com/Volkswagen-Golf-2.... A 5dr Golf R at 10,000 miles per year - £204pcm inc vat on a 9 + 23 deal.How do we know it's £280 ? It was £205 last time. We need a link to the deal. What's the mileage ?
£20K residuals . Maybe. Maybe not.
Interest : we need to compare at equal exposure to risk. In other words cash ISA at £15k per year if one hasn't used up their allowance. Very low return that won't even match inflation, even at 0% tax. Much worse at 20% or 40%. So it's actually an erosion of capital, not an opportunity cost.
Not as obvious as one would assume...My assumption is that there is nothing in it. Happy to be wrong though.
Edited by nickfrog on Friday 10th October 18:35
So can we assume you've not actually worked out the cost of owning a Golf R, and you're just assuming it costs less? If not, feel free to post your calculations.
ps : I earn 4.7% gross on the cash in my current account, no erosion of capital there.
JQ said:
£280pcm is what it costs in totality, here's the link: http://www.freedomcontracts.com/Volkswagen-Golf-2.... A 5dr Golf R at 10,000 miles per year - £204pcm inc vat on a 9 + 23 deal.
So can we assume you've not actually worked out the cost of owning a Golf R, and you're just assuming it costs less? If not, feel free to post your calculations.
ps : I earn 4.7% gross on the cash in my current account, no erosion of capital there.
Cheers for that. £280 : gob smacked. I had no idea indeed. I assumed it was still over the £300 mark. So indeed, it would look like it is possible that it mght work out less than 24 month depreciation. First case I have come across. Even last year's M135i lease deals are marginal. It would be interesting to call then to see how much they sell for cash though. A little concerned about the 24 week delivery: are you going to give it a go ?So can we assume you've not actually worked out the cost of owning a Golf R, and you're just assuming it costs less? If not, feel free to post your calculations.
ps : I earn 4.7% gross on the cash in my current account, no erosion of capital there.
I'd love to know about the 4.7% too please. I don't think its a UK cash deal that will apply to £27k.
ORD : sorry to hear about your mortgage. Plenty of us without one do indeed see an after tax yield so low that it doesn't match inflation, hence the erosion that's a fact, smoking or not. Hence the preference not to keep disposable income as cash, at least beyond the ISA allowance. Basic stuff really.
Edited by nickfrog on Saturday 11th October 17:02
nickfrog said:
Cheers for that. £280 : gob smacked. I had no idea indeed. I assumed it was still over the £300 mark. So indeed, it would look like it is possible that it mght work out less than 24 month depreciation. First case I have come across. Even last year's M135i lease deals are marginal. It would be interesting to call then to see how much they sell for cash though. A little concerned about the 24 week delivery: are you going to give it a go ?
I'd love to know about the 4.7% too please. I don't think its a UK cash deal that will apply to £27k.
ORD : sorry to hear about your mortgage. Plenty of us without one do indeed see an after tax yield so low that it doesn't match inflation, hence the erosion that's a fact, smoking or not. Hence the preference not to keep disposable income as cash, at least beyond the ISA allowance. Basic stuff really.
Dont worry about me. My property is going up in value by 15% per year, so I would be stupid not to have a mortgage. In fact, anyone living in London who isnt mortgaged to the max is missing out on free money.I'd love to know about the 4.7% too please. I don't think its a UK cash deal that will apply to £27k.
ORD : sorry to hear about your mortgage. Plenty of us without one do indeed see an after tax yield so low that it doesn't match inflation, hence the erosion that's a fact, smoking or not. Hence the preference not to keep disposable income as cash, at least beyond the ISA allowance. Basic stuff really.
Edited by nickfrog on Saturday 11th October 17:02
I think when looking at the monthly cost, we need to remember to include the deposit, as say you have it on 9 + 23 then you will need to find a two grand deposit to start, say this is your old banger, then in two years you will need to find two grand again as otherwise you will have absolutely nothing, not a penny, and no car. I know all PHers have two grand in their spare codpiece and it is loose change but I am sure a lot of leasers forget this little detail. In reality, you should be putting £100 a month away for the next lease, on top of the monthly cost.
So, in reality that Golf R is nearer £350 a month.
So, in reality that Golf R is nearer £350 a month.
J4CKO said:
I think when looking at the monthly cost, we need to remember to include the deposit, as say you have it on 9 + 23 then you will need to find a two grand deposit to start, say this is your old banger, then in two years you will need to find two grand again as otherwise you will have absolutely nothing, not a penny, and no car. I know all PHers have two grand in their spare codpiece and it is loose change but I am sure a lot of leasers forget this little detail. In reality, you should be putting £100 a month away for the next lease, on top of the monthly cost.
So, in reality that Golf R is nearer £350 a month.
This is why leasing cars is usually quite a bad idea - it looks people into a cycle of paying for a new car every 2 or 3 years. If you said to someone 'Are you wealthy enough to afford to buy a new car every 2 years?' almost everyone would say no, but a lot of people do something that costs just as much as doing that - the only difference is that they pay for the usage by lease rather than buy purchase (and recouping at resale).So, in reality that Golf R is nearer £350 a month.
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