Why do people stick with BMW?

[C8LNJ]

They do attractive looking deals on the never-never, that and badge snobbery is why you see driveways littered with them among the working class neighbourhood.

I drive a 3 series btw......

[XJ Flyer]

motor mad said:

I always thought the engines and gear boxes on the Mercedes were bullet proof; it was the rust and trim build quality that let them down. Maybe that's been sorted out in more recent years?

A family member has just returned their 3 series company car early because of failures with coil packs, the stop/start system packing up

To be fair things like electrics and transmissions on BMW's are usually made by the same outside suppliers as Mercedes use.

[RobM77]

krisdelta said:

I've had 4 BMW's, amongst a load of other stuff. Can't say I had any major issues outside regular wear and tear items. 2003 320d, 2001 330i, 2003 Z4 and a 2004 M3 - all were rock solid build wise, I had one issue with an airbag sensor on the 330 @ 70k miles, but besides that - all simply had scheduled servicing. I sold my M3 on 77k with it still feeling fantastic. Like any marque you can get good / bad cars - but perhaps I've just been lucky.

As I say in my post above, the stats are clearly there for reliability, and BMW don't fare too well, but the stats are on millions of cars, and the chances are the car you buy will be fine from most manufacturers. I just buy the car I like the most and keep money aside for bills if and when they come. I love cars and life's too short to be driving an Avensis because it's a Toyota and will be bulletproof; I apply that logic to dishwashers and vacuum cleaners, but not cars cause I love driving. On that note I do wonder why some PH members are even on here... you won't find me posting on a washing machine forum

[SpeckledJim]

They aren't what they were. Nor are Mercedes or VW.

Because they used to be expensive, and now they're not.

Because they used to be spartan, and now they're not

Because they used to be designed to be sold for cash to people who expected them to work well for a very long time.

Now they're designed to be sold on tick to people who only need them to look flash for three years.

[keegs111]

XJ Flyer said:

To be fair things like electrics and transmissions on BMW's are usually made by the same outside suppliers as Mercedes use.

True, zf boxes send shivers down my spine! However, just picked up a DB9 and the salesman at Stratstone proudly announced that the gearbox was built by zf! Hope I have more luck with this one!

[Baz Tench]

I'm on my fourth BMW now (2x330ci, e39 M5 and e46 M3).

I've had no reliability or build quality problems from any of them tbh. They have all been great cars in their own right.


I'm leaning towards an e92 M3 next, so yeah, I do stick with them.

[RobM77]

The Crack Fox said:

RobM77 said:

The Crack Fox said:

I had an E34 that did c.150k miles with no problems other than a radiator hose, an E30 with similar mileage that I killed on track but (rust aside) was no trouble, an E39 that did c.170k miles with only a broken coil spring, and my E46 went with only about 40k on the clock although that needed springs prematurely (18" wheels, low profile tyres and speedbumps didn't help).

The ride quality on newer ones (and Audis too, to be fair) is what puts me off having another, I hate oversized wheels, our roads simply aren't like Germany

Try the 16s - I've not tried the new 3 series, but having driven lots of different E90s the 16s are by far my favourite, if fitted with standard tyres (yes, the runflats..). You can enjoy the handling too with less grip than big tyres

Ta Rob, I doubt any of the quick BMW stuff comes with such small wheels though, I've now moved to Porsche (17") and think I'll end up in an Evora someday

The Evora is simply sublime Having tried two Cayman Ss, I much prefer the Evora from a driving point of view. I much prefer the look of the Porsche though and the engineering purity behind the layout.

Yes, quicker BMWs are very hard to find on standard sized wheels. I've yet to establish if BMW set the suspension differently for different wheels, cause if not you could just find the car you want and then buy 16s for it... To be honest though I've always found the quicker but non-M BMWs to drive pretty badly anyway (throttle lag, awful ride on the big wheels, horrible clutch delay etc); my favourite BMWs are the bog standard diesel ones (no throttle lag and easy to find on 16s), or the M3 (also no throttle lag, and the suspension's tuned really well for the standard wheels - 19" I think).

[MikeG88]

People stick with them because they like them, they like the personal image of owning or driving one and generally you cant deny they handle well out the box for what they are.

Frankly I hate BMW.

Mine is my first, a 2012 320d E92, had for 5 months. Although my mates parents whom i used to work for changed BMW's like toilet paper meaning Ive driven plenty and some were M5's, 130i, 335i 330d etc. I thought id get a well balanced chassis but actually now ive been able to REALLY push the vehicle its crap. I could change the tyres and stuff but the fact remains its a piece of st.

Reliability? Well aside from the fact im scared of running over a pebble incase my alloys crack (313's) the steering rack failed - not immediately i might add, on a motorway journey home where it partially failed and was turning on notches at a time - and I think my clutch is on its way out. Its done 12,000 miles btw.

Dont get me started on the dealerships. Hope you don't require a courtesy car or want the dealership to actually care whether you were alive or not....

Id consider an M135i or M3 again in future when I could easily afford one but Id always be put off by the dealership and reliability experienced.


Rents used to own BMW's way back when (all brand new), they were the same then. ALL of them broke down. One was making a funny sound from the engine. Mum took it in and they thought she was being a silly , sent her away saying nothing was wrong. Eventually she made them remove the engine for inspection and it turned out the fking block had a BIG crack in it.


Shes had mercs now ever since and they have been nearly faultless. I remember a problem with a wing mirror once, was fixed promptly. Everytime she needs the car servicing they have a courtesy car driven to her house and the pick hers up and fix it. EVERY TIME. Dealers go out of their way for her.

id consider merc myself but what would a 25 year old drive about in? C class doesnt handle well enough really?! Proper AMG's are out the question unless I put a halt on my savings account lol.

[XJ Flyer]

keegs111 said:

True, zf boxes send shivers down my spine! However, just picked up a DB9 and the salesman at Stratstone proudly announced that the gearbox was built by zf! Hope I have more luck with this one!

If I could afford a DB9 it would be the manual option for me which I think is the same bulletproof Tremec that's used in the VXR8.

[Contigo]

You are comparing M cars with a diesel Merc taxi? Really?

DO a comparison with a B5 RS4 or a C5 RS6 and you will soon see that running a german marque with supercar performance will be an expensive luxury.

I can tell you now that no M car will cost you as much to run as the C5 RS6 which can be ruinous. It was voted least reliable car on the WD survey and it will eat DRC suspension parts for fun.

On my M5 I've had a 4k claim for gearbox and I would not run any AMG, M car or RS car without a proper warranty now.

[keegs111]

XJ Flyer said:

If I could afford a DB9 it would be the manual option for me which I think is the same bulletproof Tremec that's used in the VXR8.

I tried the manual, but they are an Italian box that supply Ferrari and Maserati, didn't fancy having an Italian gearbox and was a little heavy. The zf box is better than the smg's I've driven in BMW, not quite a quick to change but much nicer to live with

[The Nur]

ArsE92 said:

Because of the imagine?

That was about an Audi A3.

[Patrick Bateman]

There will be someone, somewhere saying the same about Mercedes or Audi or whoever- down to their own experiences.

Dealers can no doubt vary massively.

[RobM77]

MikeG88 said:

Mine is my first, a 2012 320d E92, had for 5 months. Although my mates parents whom i used to work for changed BMW's like toilet paper meaning Ive driven plenty and some were M5's, 130i, 335i 330d etc. I thought id get a well balanced chassis but actually now ive been able to REALLY push the vehicle its crap. I could change the tyres and stuff but the fact remains its a piece of st.

On your other points I agree - they're not the most reliable of cars and the dealers are largely stuck up their own arses, but I simply had to comment on this. I've raced and driven single seaters, supercars, sports cars etc and have run a variety of interesting road cars (2-Eleven currently, two Caterhams, Elise etc), but despite that I can say that the humble old E90/E92 is an extremely nice and well balanced chassis, probably the best you'll find on a modern road saloon. Mine (E90 320d) will corner neutrally without much provocation in wet and dry and if you want it'll transition smoothly into oversteer. Quite simply either there's something very wrong with your one (sorry) or you're doing something very odd behind the wheel (sorry again!). Sure, the 'M Sport' suspension and big wheels do the car no favours at all if you've got them, but the fundamental balance should be there in spades, with those options just making the car ride a bit harsher and turn in a little more keenly. ETA: It should feel very similar to the other BMWs you've driven; I've tried the ones you've listed apart from the M5 and they handle very similarly to the 320d (unsurprisingly!).

Edited by RobM77 on Friday 23 August 14:37

[keegs111]

Contigo said:

You are comparing M cars with a diesel Merc taxi? Really?

DO a comparison with a B5 RS4 or a C5 RS6 and you will soon see that running a german marque with supercar performance will be an expensive luxury.

I can tell you now that no M car will cost you as much to run as the C5 RS6 which can be ruinous. It was voted least reliable car on the WD survey and it will eat DRC suspension parts for fun.

On my M5 I've had a 4k claim for gearbox and I would not run any AMG, M car or RS car without a proper warranty now.

Contigo said:

You are comparing M cars with a diesel Merc taxi? Really?

DO a comparison with a B5 RS4 or a C5 RS6 and you will soon see that running a german marque with supercar performance will be an expensive luxury.



I can tell you now that no M car will cost you as much to run as the C5 RS6 which can be ruinous. It was voted least reliable car on the WD survey and it will eat DRC suspension parts for fun.

On my M5 I've had a 4k claim for gearbox and I would not run any AMG, M car or RS car without a proper warranty now.

No, I've been in many a diesel 5/7 series which has felt tired after only half miles of the equal car in the MB range. I had an sl55 which I treated with no care or respect, was a higher mileage car and took the abuse with a smile on its face.

However, when it comes to maintenance costs, Audi are not exactly a safe bet either.

[Unknown Prodrive]

I agree with the aforementioned stuff. The OP's question was why? I'm on my sixth, currently got a manual 123d coupe. I'm not gonna highlight faults which wouldn't answer the question. If individuals have had bad experience fair enough, but I've escaped anything major to put me off buying again. It seems to me they at least try and make driving an experience more than just going from A to B without problem. Their engines are powerful and FUN, great choice, their chassis's are FUN, the cars have the ability to put a smile on your face, on the whole they don't look to bad either. The best answer would be just drive a nicely set up one, and I'm pretty sure it would answer the question.

[GC8]

kambites said:

motor mad said:

I always thought the engines and gear boxes on the Mercedes were bullet proof; it was the rust and trim build quality that let them down. Maybe that's been sorted out in more recent years?

Mercedes seem to have solved the rust issues.

From when?

[Patrick Bateman]

keegs111 said:

No, I've been in many a diesel 5/7 series which has felt tired after only half miles of the equal car in the MB range. I had an sl55 which I treated with no care or respect, was a higher mileage car and took the abuse with a smile on its face.

However, when it comes to maintenance costs, Audi are not exactly a safe bet either.

Who's to say what cars have been maintained and what ones have been abused though?

BMW, Mercedes etc. don't manufacture a lot of their components remember. They'll all use the likes of Bosch, Lemforder, Sachs, etc.

Edited by Patrick Bateman on Friday 23 August 14:43

[kambites]

GC8 said:

kambites said:

motor mad said:

I always thought the engines and gear boxes on the Mercedes were bullet proof; it was the rust and trim build quality that let them down. Maybe that's been sorted out in more recent years?

Mercedes seem to have solved the rust issues.

From when?

Well it wasn't uncommon to see rusty W210s at two or three years old, I've yet to see (or hear about) any rust on a W212 and they've been out for longer than that.

[Mr_Yogi]

keegs111 said:

A quick look through eBay, a remarkable amount of 5 series e9x with gearbox issues for sale!

e9x are 3 series.