Flemke - Is this your McLaren? (Vol 5)
Discussion
buckle88 said:
Flemke were you ever officially told about the 675lt spider? Shmee says in one of his videos that he put his order in for one in May of 2015!
NOTHING that comes from that individuals mouth seems very trustworthy!flemke said:
As it was, I waited for the official announcement, then told them that I would take one, but, because of how McLaren had misbehaved in the 675LT coupe-only situation ("Oops, we forgot to mention the 500 spiders!"), I would do so with the explicit understanding that, as soon as I got it, I would flip it and give the profits to charity. On that basis, they seem to have decided that they won't give me one. That is fine, but I wish they would not give cars ever to the scum who make a regular practice of flipping them.
Prindiville, Alastair Bols, et al - why do I often see them with "new", "delivery miles" cars for sale?
You make it sound like a Client/Manufacturer relationship that has gone very, VERY sour over the last 18 months. Prindiville, Alastair Bols, et al - why do I often see them with "new", "delivery miles" cars for sale?
GTR numbers and then the same "trick" (Mistake if you're feeling generous) with the LT. Clearly you'd hinted before you'd never entertain Maranello's offerings, but are you know in a situation that the next thing to roll out of Woking may not find a space in your garage as a result? Can McLaren REALLY afford to annoy peoples opinions. When those people are the few that CAN afford these cars?
robinessex said:
flemke said:
buckle88 said:
Flemke were you ever officially told about the 675lt spider? Shmee says in one of his videos that he put his order in for one in May of 2015!
It was one of those things where, if you had heard only rumours, you could act on them because you didn't know for a fact but, if you knew it for a fact because someone on the inside had told you, your hands were tied and you had to stay quiet.It didn't matter either way. If I had wanted a spider, after they made the announcement I could have put my name down and they would have given me a slot. That was never an issue.
As it was, I waited for the official announcement, then told them that I would take one, but, because of how McLaren had misbehaved in the 675LT coupe-only situation ("Oops, we forgot to mention the 500 spiders!"), I would do so with the explicit understanding that, as soon as I got it, I would flip it and give the profits to charity. On that basis, they seem to have decided that they won't give me one. That is fine, but I wish they would not give cars ever to the scum who make a regular practice of flipping them.
Prindiville, Alastair Bols, et al - why do I often see them with "new", "delivery miles" cars for sale?
Monty Python said:
flemke said:
It was one of those things where, if you had heard only rumours, you could act on them because you didn't know for a fact but, if you knew it for a fact because someone on the inside had told you, your hands were tied and you had to stay quiet.
It didn't matter either way. If I had wanted a spider, after they made the announcement I could have put my name down and they would have given me a slot. That was never an issue.
As it was, I waited for the official announcement, then told them that I would take one, but, because of how McLaren had misbehaved in the 675LT coupe-only situation ("Oops, we forgot to mention the 500 spiders!"), I would do so with the explicit understanding that, as soon as I got it, I would flip it and give the profits to charity. On that basis, they seem to have decided that they won't give me one. That is fine, but I wish they would not give cars ever to the scum who make a regular practice of flipping them.
Prindiville, Alastair Bols, et al - why do I often see them with "new", "delivery miles" cars for sale?
What's your view on the 570S?It didn't matter either way. If I had wanted a spider, after they made the announcement I could have put my name down and they would have given me a slot. That was never an issue.
As it was, I waited for the official announcement, then told them that I would take one, but, because of how McLaren had misbehaved in the 675LT coupe-only situation ("Oops, we forgot to mention the 500 spiders!"), I would do so with the explicit understanding that, as soon as I got it, I would flip it and give the profits to charity. On that basis, they seem to have decided that they won't give me one. That is fine, but I wish they would not give cars ever to the scum who make a regular practice of flipping them.
Prindiville, Alastair Bols, et al - why do I often see them with "new", "delivery miles" cars for sale?
Rich_W said:
buckle88 said:
Flemke were you ever officially told about the 675lt spider? Shmee says in one of his videos that he put his order in for one in May of 2015!
NOTHING that comes from that individuals mouth seems very trustworthy!flemke said:
As it was, I waited for the official announcement, then told them that I would take one, but, because of how McLaren had misbehaved in the 675LT coupe-only situation ("Oops, we forgot to mention the 500 spiders!"), I would do so with the explicit understanding that, as soon as I got it, I would flip it and give the profits to charity. On that basis, they seem to have decided that they won't give me one. That is fine, but I wish they would not give cars ever to the scum who make a regular practice of flipping them.
Prindiville, Alastair Bols, et al - why do I often see them with "new", "delivery miles" cars for sale?
You make it sound like a Client/Manufacturer relationship that has gone very, VERY sour over the last 18 months. Prindiville, Alastair Bols, et al - why do I often see them with "new", "delivery miles" cars for sale?
GTR numbers and then the same "trick" (Mistake if you're feeling generous) with the LT. Clearly you'd hinted before you'd never entertain Maranello's offerings, but are you know in a situation that the next thing to roll out of Woking may not find a space in your garage as a result? Can McLaren REALLY afford to annoy peoples opinions. When those people are the few that CAN afford these cars?
Yes, McLaren have really let themselves down. I think, well I know, that their mentality is that they as a small company are competing against the power and reach of huge companies, which is hard to do, and they are making great cars, which is hard to do, and those two achievements should justify their taking liberties in order to generate what are in effect free (for them) profits.
What shocked me was when a senior guy there told me that they expected the backlash about the 675LT spider to be worse than it was. They thought it would be even worse, and still they went ahead!
I told them that my loyalty is to McLaren Cars Ltd (builder of the F1, and no longer effectively in business), not to McLaren Automotive Ltd. I'm not saying that I will never buy an other McLaren, but for starters I'm selling the P1 and going forward will think of them as another car company.
flemke said:
In fairness to Shmee, I think the distinction is that he went to a dealer on May 6th and said that he would like to be recorded as wanting to buy a spider if indeed one were built. Nobody (apart from insider big-shots) was able to "order one" in May, because dealers were not given allocations until December.
That's definitely the accurate way to put it. I suppose even then I didn't know 100% that they were building it and in fairness to McLaren, I don't think they had decided yet if they were going to do so.flemke said:
The last thing that I need, however, is another car.
Interesting comment.I am curious how many cars you have and consider too many?
I have 4 totally different cars at my disposal (excluding other family member vehicles) and feel that there is room for a few more yet. I am building another 'one-off', but that will take a while! Each car has to be different though. Two or three very similar vehicles would be pointless for me.
Of course if the cars are growing in value at, say 10% per annum, then you have to be tempted to hang on to them, even if it sits in a motor house all year.
Paul
Shmee said:
Rich_W said:
buckle88 said:
Flemke were you ever officially told about the 675lt spider? Shmee says in one of his videos that he put his order in for one in May of 2015!
NOTHING that comes from that individuals mouth seems very trustworthy!Hitch78 said:
Shmee said:
Rich_W said:
buckle88 said:
Flemke were you ever officially told about the 675lt spider? Shmee says in one of his videos that he put his order in for one in May of 2015!
NOTHING that comes from that individuals mouth seems very trustworthy!flemke said:
LongLiveTazio said:
Considered a Singer 911?
Yes, but by the time one has been imported to the UK you're knocking on £500k, and I think that is too much. Also not keen on the long lead time before delivery.Given that you seem to have an enthusiasm for modification (your own car(s) and perhaps others), have you ever considered something along the lines of Rob Dickinson’s work, where he (re)imagines how the car should be, and puts together a pool of talent (not withstanding his own) and realises the reality? I know that your F1 to some extent is that car, but for various reasons there is only so much you can do it, whereas with some other kind of donor car, the potential for almost a blank sheet reworking could be possible.
You seem to know have all the requisites, you know what good design is, aesthetically and functionally, know the right kind of skilled people, perhaps have the financial means or have contacts that could be involved. You have often referred to not needing another car, but just imagine that a ‘Flemke’ could be the only car you would ever need…
Wadayathink?
selym said:
Not really 'ordered' though, was it?
Technically a car isn't 'ordered' until you pay the second deposit and sign the spec freeze. If we went on that basis there are still people who haven't ordered their LT Coupes yet, so it's clearly a much more fluid process than this and the terminology is irrelevant. I'd bet there are Ferrari customers who have already 'ordered' the special edition convertible version of the F12tdf, but that's a long way from announcement. And probably the replacement to the LaFerrari, etc etc
Shmee said:
I'd bet there are Ferrari customers who have already 'ordered' the special edition convertible version of the F12tdf, but that's a long way from announcement. And probably the replacement to the LaFerrari, etc etc
I guess you're talking about letters of intent with dealers there, possibly with a deposit to show you're serious? Basically saying "I'd like put my name down for one of these, should you make one."Shmee said:
selym said:
Not really 'ordered' though, was it?
Technically a car isn't 'ordered' until you pay the second deposit and sign the spec freeze. If we went on that basis there are still people who haven't ordered their LT Coupes yet, so it's clearly a much more fluid process than this and the terminology is irrelevant. I'd bet there are Ferrari customers who have already 'ordered' the special edition convertible version of the F12tdf, but that's a long way from announcement. And probably the replacement to the LaFerrari, etc etc
Police State said:
flemke said:
LongLiveTazio said:
Considered a Singer 911?
Yes, but by the time one has been imported to the UK you're knocking on £500k, and I think that is too much. Also not keen on the long lead time before delivery.Given that you seem to have an enthusiasm for modification (your own car(s) and perhaps others), have you ever considered something along the lines of Rob Dickinson’s work, where he (re)imagines how the car should be, and puts together a pool of talent (not withstanding his own) and realises the reality? I know that your F1 to some extent is that car, but for various reasons there is only so much you can do it, whereas with some other kind of donor car, the potential for almost a blank sheet reworking could be possible.
You seem to know have all the requisites, you know what good design is, aesthetically and functionally, know the right kind of skilled people, perhaps have the financial means or have contacts that could be involved. You have often referred to not needing another car, but just imagine that a ‘Flemke’ could be the only car you would ever need…
Wadayathink?
Storer said:
flemke said:
The last thing that I need, however, is another car.
Interesting comment.I am curious how many cars you have and consider too many?
I have 4 totally different cars at my disposal (excluding other family member vehicles) and feel that there is room for a few more yet. I am building another 'one-off', but that will take a while! Each car has to be different though. Two or three very similar vehicles would be pointless for me.
Of course if the cars are growing in value at, say 10% per annum, then you have to be tempted to hang on to them, even if it sits in a motor house all year.
Paul
I think one can probably cover all the bases with about five cars. It depends as much on how much one is able to drive them as it does on how many different cars one has to drive. If you haven't got the time to enjoy five, a sixth is a bit of a waste.
Davey S2 said:
Shmee said:
selym said:
Not really 'ordered' though, was it?
Technically a car isn't 'ordered' until you pay the second deposit and sign the spec freeze. If we went on that basis there are still people who haven't ordered their LT Coupes yet, so it's clearly a much more fluid process than this and the terminology is irrelevant. I'd bet there are Ferrari customers who have already 'ordered' the special edition convertible version of the F12tdf, but that's a long way from announcement. And probably the replacement to the LaFerrari, etc etc
For example, I pay a reasonable amount of attention to what Porsche are doing. Not everything, but more than most people would do, and I have owned quite a few of their cars.
This week in Autocar mag I read that they are doing something called I think the 911 GT, something like that. It sounded like a lovely car - good engine, manual 'box, no stupid wing on the back. This certainly seemed as though it were the first official announcement.
Then I read that production was going to be limited to 600 units, and they all were already sold. That just seems ridiculous, same as with the GT4.
They make a car that they know is going to be desired, yet they artificially restrict build numbers in order to cause the model to trade at a premium and create a halo effect for their other cars which they produce in the tens of thousands.
In these situations, if they cannot resist artificially limiting the supply, the least they could do would be to lease the cars for the first say 2 years, to prevent the buyers from flipping.
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